This is not a photo of Avi’s child.
by AVI VINCE
I was taking the bus to work the other day and a couple got on. They both seemed to have suffered a big one the night before, and were most likely still a little hammered or high as neither could speak properly.
From what I could understand, the mum was really upset that another one of her children had to be removed from her care. She blamed the dad for always upsetting her and I gathered there may have been some domestic violence being the reason the child, or children, were removed. It almost looked like they were on their way to meet the Child Protection worker to plead their case.
I have to admit, as I sat opposite them, I started to hate them. Not because of their story, but because of the way she spoke. “Do you know how I feel, having another one taken from me? That was the worst mother’s day for me. I can’t believe you did that to me. I can’t have him away from me, he is my little boy.”
For the entire 20 minute bus ride, she didn’t show any worry about how he felt…her little boy. Not only did he have to witness whatever he did for however long, but he had to be taken away from his bedroom, from his toys, from his friends and put into a stranger’s house.
He was sleeping in an unfamiliar bed, in an unfamiliar house, in an unfamiliar suburb with complete strangers. And all she could think about was how she felt. I couldn’t help but hope that she didn’t get him back.
But then instantly I knew what it would mean for the little boy. He would grow up wondering why his mum didn’t love him the same way other mums loved their sons. He would hate the workers that put and kept him in care. They stood in the way of him being with his mum.
Regardless of whatever happened to him and regardless of how drunk or high she would be, he would have this inexplicable love for her. Regardless of how he would sometimes hate her in moments of anger, he wouldn’t be able to shake it.
I never believed that loving your parents is instinctual until I entered the Child Protection sector. The problem is parenting is not instinctual. It is taught and learned. Your mum teaches you what to do when your baby doesn’t stop crying. But what if your mum, or the nurse, wasn’t there to teach you.
Then what happens when the child doesn’t stop crying for the 18thhour? What happens if there isn’t anyone there to call on for help? “Mum, I just need you to come over and do something because I am about to crack it?” What happens when you crack it?
Avi Vince
I have worked in the community services sector for almost 5 years. I’ve seen a lot of behind the scenes stuff that you don’t think could happen in a place like Australia. People with no right to work and no right to Centrelink.
But nothing shocks me more that the state of Australia’s kids. Mainly those in the Child Protection system.
Did you know that one in thirty one kids in Australia gets reported on? That means that someone out there thinks that child is at risk of harm. That is one kid in every classroom! That statistics comes from the latest Australian Institute of Health and Welfare report on Child Protection.
Of those reports, one in 165 is substantiated abuse or neglect. In other words, they are so at risk, that the family needs intervention. That doesn’t mean that the rest were nothing. Just that the Child Protection workers couldn’t find enough to charge the parents. It isn’t a simple task.
In Australia in 2011, there were 37,500 kids in out of home care. That is a huge number, too huge for a country offering services and support to families in need. Even worse, that is up from 2007 when it was 28,500.
Besides being better informed, and more mechanisms to report child abuse, this increase is still horrifying. These kids are innocent victims of a society that still practices “What happens behind closed doors is none of my business.”
Governments are starting to put more funds into early family intervention. But in most cases the funds come from the care system, so the little boy above gets less support – he is almost given up on. Should we implement mandatory parenting courses the way some churches implement mandatory marriage counselling? Or is that overkill?
Not if you are the little boy living in a stranger’s home.
Avi Vince works as a manager in a non-profit organisation. She is starting her freelance writing career and you can follow her blog here or at twitter here. Her opinions are entirely her own.
Is it enough to intervene when a family is showing cracks? Or is that already too late?
Comments
96 Comments so far
I didn’t have a mother or anyone else around to help me when i had my children, and I never ‘cracked’. For some being a mother is instinctual, you don’t need your mother or anyone else there and even if you did – tough luck. There isn’t always a village around to raise your children – but that doesn’t mean they are always mistreated.
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If you are worried about a child and unsure of whether or not to make a report to docs, please, please just do it. If you are wrong, so be it. Chances are you are right.
I have a lot of trouble accepting that nobody intervened and made a report about my parents when we were kids. Nobody cared enough to help. Nobody knew exactly what was going on but everybody knew that we were being abused.
Our neighbours knew, our extended family knew, our school freinds knew and I personally told a few teachers at various times.
Maybe things would have got worse if someone had intervened. Or maybe my mother may have decided to put us before herself and leave. I don’t know. But I just struggle to understand how none of these adults cared enough to make a phone call.
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I don’t get why we need a licence to drive a car but not to bring a new life into the world then raise it as a person…
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I always thought my dad was nuts when he said “you need a license to drive a car but any idiot can have a kid”. Now i am in schools i am seeing how true that it some people really just dont have the skills to be a parent and the only person it hurts is the child. From an academic viewpoint these children and parents are fascinating, but some of these kids suffer from social competency and then the cycle continues. They will leave school because they get in trouble because their needs are not being met at home, no one is helping guide them and the teacher only has a certain amount of time. It’s devastating for them and unless they get a lucky break in the form of intervention that helps them. Not all intervention is good and some comes too late, nothing is perfect but we have to keep trying.
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In most circumstances, I would have absolutely none or very little sympathy for a parent who had their child removed from their care, but when my daughter was in the NICU I saw such a sad, heartbreaking situation involving a couple who both appeared to have a mild intellectual disability. It was clear that they were not allowed custody of their baby and from overhearing the conversation (I wasn’t eavesdropping on such a sensitive topic but in the small NICU it was very difficult not to overhear) it seemed as if they didn’t have appropriate accommodation. Although, like I said, there could be so much more I don’t know about and I’m not suggesting the baby should have stayed with the parents, but it was heartbreaking to see their distress and see them both crying when saying goodbye to their baby.
I imagine working for Child Services would be such an emotionally challenging career, I know I couldn’t handle it.
Having my own children, it’s just unimaginable and heartbreaking to think of them in a dangerous situation or not being cared for properly
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We should have to attend and PASS a parenting course to be eligible for the baby bonus or paid parental leave. I’m thinking 5 weeks 10 hours. That’s a payment of hundreds of dollars per hour.
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Then there are mothers who work tirelessly for their precious babies/children but with no moral support from family. It is an exhausting task. Sadly some family members think they are the only ones who had it tough, and use ever chance to make life difficult or put you down. All mums with an infant are fragile if left on their own. What they need is a supportive group around them. If that is not there at the start, then things can get worse quite quickly. Blaming the mother is very unhelpful.
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Can I please just comment on the statistic of 1 in 31 kids being reported on, as someone who’s been the victim of a trivial report for a personal reason.
My husband was at the doctor putting up with a rude nurse. He was a little stressed, as many people in the health system are (illness is a pretty obvious cause of stress), she left him waiting thirty minutes because of a personality clash, he raised his voice at the nurse … and all of a sudden I am facing the prospect of MY child being taken away from me!
I am not looking for praise here, but I am an excellent mother – I am patient, I have time for my children, I go to extraordinary lengths to keep them from danger, and they know how loved they are.
The incident had nothing to do with my daughter, he treated her as he always does – with the utmost gentleness and respect. You cannot imagine how much that scared and infuriated me, that someone would tell somebody else that they thought it was a possibility that my child was not safe with me, who would willingly face my own death to prevent theirs.
I don’t think as much needs to be made of the ‘reports’ as the actual cases where kids were taken from their parents. I daresay mine’s not the only trivial report that came more of a personal vendetta than any danger.
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I’m not sure if people are aware that child protection is state legislated, and therefore differs state to state. Mandatory reporting isn’t required in SA to do a report, but all professionals in child sectors are mandatory reporters. Reports can be anonymous.
There are also processes that occur, whereby, intervention is enacted if there is imminent danger, or considerable risk. Work is done to try to mend the family, and improve function and above all, safety. Only failing that, are children entered into the system until 18. The premise is always, that children belong with their families. The premise is also, that the strongest support for families is their natural network/community. So of course, we can see, where there are degraded communities, people’s “natural” community, is kinda stuffed. We have a social obligation to equalise resources in communities, schools, health. It’s no big secret that trauma compromises health and wellbeing. Imagine a few generations of trauma and the impact on brain development.
http://www.childtrauma.org/
Link is awesome … work of Bruce Perry .. trauma specialist
Avi’s article rings true regarding a child’s need and indeed, right, to love and know their parents. This can complicate fostering processes, whereby foster families would like to take in a child/ren and carry on life as their “parent” and not acknowledge that they have an entirely alternative identity with their birth family. It is important to nurture that as best as possible, especially as statistics show us that an incredibly high number of foster children return to their birth families during adolescence and early adulthood and their exit from the system. Foster families, for whatever reason, rarely extend support to these children beyond the last paycheck at 18 yrs, and these children require connection, bond, family that goes beyond 18. They want somewhere to stay in their uni break, somewhere to come home to for christmas, someone to call on a bad day, someone who’ll call on their birthday. Families do this. Foster families, rarely continue to do so after 18. I’m sure there are some fabulous ones … that do, of course … and I loathe to generalise … but by early adolescence most of the foster kids have had placement breakdowns and end up in group homes anyway … The broken family of their origin … is the only family of choice for most of these kids. What would you choose? Broken or nothing? I think we have a social obligation to continue to support families, beyond their child’s entry into alternative care, so that when their child tries to reconnect, they have stabilised their lives, and can receive their child with the warmth and security they seek … and will forever seek. Imagine being let down by your parents when you’re small and helpless. Imagine being let down again when you willingly seek them out. Our society lets these kids down twofold … daily.
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It upsets me when I see children of parents who obviously don’t fulfil their responsibilities as parents. However, I’m upset for both the children and parents. If we want to help parents be good parents then we need to address the underlying issues which can include drug and alcohol abuse, domestic violence, unemployment, no family support, gambling, etc. I’m sure no parent sets out to be a bad parent and we should offer them our support not our judgement.
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I think the underlying problem is selfishness. I grew up in a family with
Violence, infidelity and alcoholism. I was determined my children wouldn’t have the same experience. Sure, I was not perfect, but I did the best I could do. My sister, on the other hand, just thought of what she was missing out on, her kids were a burden. Her marriage broke down and she just wanted to be free. She had no empathy for her kids and just thought of herself. Today, my nephew is fighting for his life against a drug addiction, and thank God my niece is doing well, although she has deep seeded problems with her mother. I just want my sister to tell them how much she loves them.
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I’ve commented here before on the circumstances of my childhood which were traumatic and complicated and should probably involved my removal from my mother assuming there was somewhere better for me to go. I find the author’s lack of insight despite her experience extremely unsettling – her comments on her immediate response to the mother show a lack of empathy that has a significant impact on families. Things are nowhere near as black and white as they have be presented here. I absolutely agree that there are families that shouldn’t have children, mine was one of them, but the realities are that there are issues to be resolved well before a disadvantaged woman falls pregnant.
We willingly talk about the fact that women are severely disadvantaged in circumstances of poverty and abuse but then we blame them for the outcomes that disadvantage produces – all the while services that support women (NGOs rather than DHS) cry out for support. We don’t even bother to comment on the fathers.
I don’t defend the way I was treated by my parents as a child or how this mother (no mention of the father’s responsibility in the piece), but I have a deep understanding of why these things occur. I feel very concerned if this is the stance taken by someone who works in an industry that is meant to be trying to achieve better outcomes.
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I think they article did a great job in bringing forth so many emotional stories and so much pain in the comments. Thanks to all who have shared.
From my perspective as an adoptive parent I feel agrieved on behalf of all the poor children who are made to stay with (or go backrepeatedly to) parents who clearly aren’t up to the most important job of all in raising children. The same system that sends children back to parents for more neglect and abuse is a system that demonises adoption because of past practices that were wrong. Our children are adopted from overseas and adoption within Australian rarely occurs because of the extreme bias against it. What is so wrong that we are made to feel like second class parents?
I will always honour my children’s instictive love for birth parents they don’t know and I will always feel honoured to have the privelege of parenting them. I love them like life itself.
But my heart goes out to the children (and adults) whose instinctive love for their parents is destroyed by bad parenting and a system that inflicts more of the same on them, rather than consider adoption as a positive alternative.
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I think I could be a foster mum but I am put off because DOCS seem to want to always get the kid back to their parents.
The parents i know of whose kids are in care were prostituting the children. Those kids need a steady home forever, to balance the horror of their early childhood.
Is it possible to foster a child who will be with you until 18?
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I believe that you can apply to be a long term foster carer. In some cases the children do stay with you until 18 and some you can apply to have guardianship of, but it’s not all of them.
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Thanks. I’ll look into it some more.
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Just letting you know – its not DOCS that send the children home, it is the magistrate at the Court who makes the decision. I think this is a common misunderstanding.
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Once the kids are in a foster home, why does the matter go back to the courts? Is it the parents wanting their kids back and appealing the original decision to take them away?
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A lot of orders are only for 2 or so years, so they do get revisited legally. Some children do have the permanent order, but it can take time and a number of court appearances. It’s all individual.
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The legislation makes it very difficult for DoCS to get long term orders for children in many instances even if that is their recommendation to the court. Instead, short term orders are often all DoCS can get, orders which allow the parents to address the issues which led to the child being placed in care. Sadly this seems to put more emphasis on the parents’ “rights” to get their child back than the child’s need for safety and security.
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I believe so, celia. I want to do the same. My concern is for my surprise baby. I’m frightened of what I’d be bringing into her life but I want to do it do much. I keep thinking ‘next year’ and each year I put it off again.
I think ‘odette’ has gone through the process and has other children. I wonder how it’s going for her.
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Me too Celia! I think I would be devastated if they took the child off me!! I have looked into fostering too
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I always thought that foster care was mostly about short to medium term care, with long term placement being rare.
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These are some things I know since I have been on both sides of the foster kid fence- I was fostered out when my mum needed to go to rehab & I fostered my nephew for 18 months after my sister died & his dad was not capable of caring for him. One thing I know for certain is this- a kid will love their parents & want. to be with their parents no matter how crazy things are at home & how nice their foster parents are. I also know that just because a parent loves their child doesn’t mean they should be their primary carer.
Their are no winners in this situation. People are always scared. Bonds are always fractured.
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That’s interesting. But I’m even more interested to get your thoughts on a solution:
Should kids be removed from their incapable (and that’s putting it politely in some cases) parents? Or should they stay with them – for better or for worse?
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We should absolutely have mandatory parenting classes.
I’m always curious about how many of those parents are genuinely just in need of education and support, and how many are genuinely just bad parents who are never going to be fit.
The truly horrific child abuse cases I have seen as a nurse have made me confident there are a lot of people out there who should never, ever be allowed to take care of their kids again.
I honestly have no idea how you do it Avi, I take my hat off to you. It would break my heart in a day. You are a champion!
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This is a really hard one. I’m a family law solicitor, and I do some work in the care jurisdiction acting for parents who have had their kids removed. When I get a file, there will sometimes be a stack of Risk of Harm Reports (where people call up the helpline to report abuse) with the majority of it not even investigated because Community Services doesn’t have the resources. Then we will have all the attempts the caseworkers have made to work with the family, trying to get them to engage with counseling, parenting courses and support services in the community. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn’t. Its nice though when a parent acknowledges that having the kids removed was the kick in the pants they needed to get themselves straight, and you see them actually going off and getting themselves into rehab and counseling. Sometimes the parents just don’t have the capacity to change and you almost feel relieved that the child is going to someone else. Sometimes I wonder if parents should have to apply for a license to have kids…we sit a test for a drivers license but not for kids (sorry, I know that’s an outlandish statement but I sympathise with Avi…it’s not easy working in this field)
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my first vivid memory of my 1st stepfather, was him hanging mine and my brothers’ dog. He brought us around to the side gate, picked up my dog , placed the leash on top of the post and hung him. I was almost 5 and my brother was 6 1/2. That was just the start.
Yes, some people definitely shouldn’t be parents.
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That is terrible, and should never have been inflicted upon you and your brother, at any age, let alone whatever has followed.
I hope that you and your brother have both managed to grow up to be well-adjusted individuals, in spite of these events.
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Holy crap! That is one of the most disgusting things I’ve ever heard.
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That is horrendous. I’m so, so sorry that happened to you.
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I’ve worked for child health for a while now and we visit the “high risk” parents for 1 yr to 18 months. We see lots of things you wouldn’t really want to see and do have to notify child safety risks to DOCS. I think intervention at any time is a good thing. There’s all sorts of intervention from supporting families to removing children, however the earlier the intervention the better.
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I really appreciated this article for the author’s honesty and willingness to speak out for the thousands of children at risk of abuse and neglect.
I am a foster carer and have seen the effects of trauma on young children. Being removed from birth parents is traumatic in itself, however I think the greatest travesty is the department and court system’s desire to return children to their parents for a second, third, fourth, fifth… attempt at reunification. Children suffer far more from being bounced back and forth through cycles of abuse than being removed and having stability and security in a loving, long term or permanent family.
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Amen to that!
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Kate I question your statement that the Department “wants” to return a child to their parent for a second, third, fourth time etc. The Department are limited by the legislation and the Courts make it very hard for long term orders to be made. I’m not saying I agree with this, but it’s easy to criticise the Department from outside.
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Parenting unfortunately is not learned in 6 mandatory lesson, nor from a mother that comes over at the 18th hour. Parent is learnt well before you are a parent, parenting is learn as a child then clarified, maintained and supported by family, peers and society closest to the parent. Ps avi I mean this in a nice way…. Your loving your dogs a littttttle to much they are a tad uummmm chunky
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Parenting CAN be learned… to some degree at least. There’s a great episode of the This American Life podcast out this week which touches on this issue – I highly recommend it, it was so interesting.
And yes, those little dogs are such chub chubs, but oh so cute! If they were my dogs they’d probably get super spoiled and end up even chunkier
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Well in my role as a docs working it took more training than a doco…..my point being is this lack of skill is a societal issue and not easily fixed with a few classes otherwise this would have been fixed by now! It’s greater than the individual, it’s their current life their childhood, their role in society, their education and soooooo so much more that makes them who they are. As for the dogs I love my lab and it could easily be loved to death but I love it too much for that
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I get the TV guilts too, and the I can’t get me child to eat enough vegetables. Reding this really does put things into perspective I guess. I don’t have an answer, more support for families is probably a good start.
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Mandatory parenting classes sound like a good idea to me… just simple coping mechanisms, etc. Something along the line of the Positive Parenting Program, which some government departments run.
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How would you make people go?
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We get court ordered parents in the groups we run. They are ofte disruptive and you’re not sure if they’ve gained anything from it. Other times separated parents are advised to attend by their solicitors before they go to court for custody matters.
I’m not too sure about mandating the groups for everyone though.
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Maybe it could be a requirement before you get paid your baby bonus…
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I don’t know how much use it would be at that age. Parenting classes like triple p are aimed towards children 2-12. There are parenting classes for parents of infants called circle of security that are more appropriate.
I’m still not too sure about mandating them, I don’t know how much you’d get out of classes you’re forced to attend. I believe that in Victoria, you’re required to accept a home visit from child health once your baby’s born, not sure how they worked that.
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I agree with the title of this article – some people shouldn’t be parents. It’s so sad and infuriating and it makes me feel impotent to help, reading an article like this. Beautifully written, such an important conversation to have and yet I feel really disturbed and uneasy after reading it.
I do think some things are learned. But there is something that drives us to learn to take the best care possible of our kids.
I’ll never understand how some people are missing that instinct that says “you can’t get drunk in front of your kids” or “don’t hit or abuse them”, or “dont take your kids to a violent rally/mutilate their genitals/leave them at a train station in the middle of a winter night. They are so precious and vulnerable. Love is completely instinctive, and I guess for some people they don’t have that instinct even if they love their kids.
Ps (I was referring to fgm not circumcision above , please don’t jump down my throat!)
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I disagree that instinctual love for your parents doesn’t go away. It may well be so for some, but not in my case.
My father left when I was almost 5. He had the opportunity to visit, but never did. My love for him and memories of him faded. I never hated him, but I no longer loved him either. What I did feel was anger – especially a few years ago when he was dying of cancer and asked his brother to phone me to let me know I had “permission” to visit him. WTF???
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I too don’t have that instinctual love for my parents. At best it’s an indifference or sense of pity. Strange. Of course, I hope my children continue to love me as they become adults, but then I swear I won’t behave like my parents, so I hope I can break the cycle.
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I feel the same way about my Dad, sharoncello.
He stopped visiting not long after my parents split up. We found out later that he remarried, didn’t tell us, and was still claiming Centrelink benefits so didn’t want my mum to know he was married cos she might dob on him.
Which was entirely possible, but he gave up ever seeing his kids for a bit of flipping stolen Centrelink money … sorry, but he didn’t deserve my love.
But at least part of it was his personality, too … I know he loved me in a bloody stupid way, but I know my mother would do anything for me, go to the ends of the earth, and still love me even if I murdered someone. All it took for Dad to pretty much stop was a bit of pressure from a new woman and the prospect of actually having to work for his cash.
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I occasionally work in a Childcare centre in a not so nice area of Adelaide and over the years have seen many things that have broken my heart. From children who only eat in care, to others who come back the next morning with the same nappy we sent them home in. One child had recovering drug addicts for parents and the mother could never pull herself together, the father attended meetings, classes and community service and eventually left the mother with the boys but he was made to put them in our care 5 days a week as he wasn’t competent enough for 24/7 care. I have taken bags of my own children’s clothes in for the kids who are wearing trackies that were small enough to be shorts and who didn’t have jumpers in the middle of winter. We have to bathe children who don’t get bathed at home. I get the impression from talking to some of these parents that they are TRYING but seem to lack the parenting instinct mentioned in the article. I think money spent in early intervention and training for parents (because like every job, some need it) would work wonders in a majority of cases. Just teaching parents what is expected and what is acceptable.
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It makes me sick that kids are being so neglected. Thanks for sharing, certainly puts things into perspective.
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I know from my own experience growing up, when you aren’t taught those life skills by your own parents your immediately on the back foot when you start raising your own children.
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Please visit and pm on the fb page provided link. http://www.facebook.com/pages/Who-Am-I-Stop-Child-Abuse/169298899830304
If you are in need of extra clothing etc for these children I would love to help. Children need to know and feel love and safety for them to express it in a healthy manner in the future. They have no voice, no defense in protecting themselves. You change their lives, their outlook on human nature every time you show, love and kindness. Thank you. Parenting classes should be mandatory. But just imagine where these precious innocent souls would be without child care? Imagine the pain and horror they would face without this refuge? So much more needs to be done to save these children from a bleak, harsh future. Not to mention the type of future we as a nation will face with so many hurt and numb individuals.
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Hmm I totally disagree with this piece based on a few things. First one is are you aware that there is people out there that ring human services about a family to cause trouble? So how many of those one in thirty children are really being abused and which ones are not at risk? Thats the real reason why human services do not take it any further not to mention the funding to do so. The second thing that has annoyed me is what is written about instinctual parenting not been true that it is shown and taught how wrong of a statement is that? As a parent I go with my instincts everytime and 99 per of the time it was the right thing to do. As for been shown how to parent from my parents well I wasnt shown or taught and I am a much better parent for it as I have abusive parents and I sure as hell do not abuse my daughter. Thirdly this piece is coming from somebody going off memory written a piece that her dogs are her children. Sorry you might work with children and you try to protect them but until you become a parent you have no idea what it is like to be a parent. So less of the judgement please!
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I believe that people who call just to ’cause trouble’ are in the minority and most callers are people who genuinely believe the child is in danger.
and arent you judging the author by saying that because she only has dogs she has no idea what its like to be a parent. Her experience in the community sector obviously gives her quite an authority to speak on this issue.
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Agreed.
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My mother never taught me how to be a mother. I was neglected as a child. If anything, she has taught me how NOT to be a mother.
I have raised my daughter with no support, no one to call in the middle of the night at breaking point. But I didn’t break. If I had an issue I knew there was help out there, Health direct, Karitane. There is alot of help out there if you are motivated enough to seek it. There is also alot of parenting information out there if you are motivated enough to seek it. But instinct is the best parenting tool any of us have.
If you are hell bent on putting a band-aid over the system, you’d find more sense in looking into Mental Health.
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Only your neighbor can’t just ring and have DOCS investigate, they need it to come from a person with mandatory reporting responsibility. Having worked in the industry you are required to ask them to call the police, talk to a teacher etc. however I agree with your sentiment poor parenting starts at home when you are a child. It’s not the individual failing here its society.
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Actually, that’s wrong (in Qld anyway). Your neighbour can ring DOCS and if serious enough or enough calls things will be investigated.
Anonymous above, you are the exception. Most children raisd in an abusive home don’t go on to be good parents/productive people etc. my husband is definitely the white sheep of his family of 4 boys.
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Actually, a good friend of mine was reported maliciously by her two sister-in-laws (they rang twice, once each) and it was investigated. The sisters were known to DOCS and had been in the child protection system for years. My friend is a brilliant mother from a well respected family in the community. She told me about the report and I couldn’t help but laugh because the allegations were just so ridiculous. This is in NSW
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NSW is rubbish all round hey!
My mum used to work in a preschool and was reported by docs. it was years ago but i didnt find out about it till i was much younger, It makes me so sad because i KNOW i am so privelidged to have been born into the family i was, and to have parents care about me as much as they do.
To know someone had this thwarted veiw of her, or was very very malicious, breaks my heart, because she just has the kindest heart.
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You are wrong there anybody can ring DOC’S and make a report (which are now known as human services in NSW) which bottlenecks the system which is the whole point to my argument caseworkers dont know which reports are real and which ones are false sadly false reports are more common then you think.
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What are you basing this on? Do you work in the area?
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My family have lived next to insane smacked out jailbird junkies who live in a government house for 6 years now. we’ve been up-close and personal to their domestic violence, drug dealing, child abuse for this time, and harassed beyond belief.
the stress was so bad that my first child never learned to sleep properly as his bedroom was next to their driveway (4 and he still has massive sleep issues), and it pushed my hubby and i to breaking point.
things are much better now, as the crazy woman took her kids and left her partner, who was actually the best of the lot.
i’ve called local police, 000, and DOCS many, many times and become intimate with the peeps at crime stoppers!
the woman once screamed over the fence at me (after a visit from DOCS) “Children should be with their parents!” i thought, i agree, except when the children are being routinely verbally and physically abused. The worst bit is that she was a compulsive liar and took the kids away; i don’t think EITHER of them should have been parents, but, by god, the bloke was definitey the lesser of two evils, and the only one i ever saw doinging any proper parenting (without screaming or punching). Before a DOCS visit (as they were scheduled) they’d have all their mates around to clean up their filthy pigsty and she’d put a big smile on her nasty face.
They were nice little kids at first but as they got older i realised that the cycle just wasn’t going to break itself this time. so sad. i used to pray that the kids would be taken away young enough not to remember their awful start, isn’t that horrible of me?
sorry for wall of text
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‘Smacked out jailbird junkies’ – LOL I’ll have to remember that one!
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There are no easy answers here.
I think that it safe to say though that family cracks occur across the socio economic spectrum.
Personally I think families need more help no matter what category they fall in.
More help, easily available help, free, non judgemental help… no matter who requires it. And let it be well publicised so someone in time of crisis or need knows exactly where to go, because it’s at those times of emotional stress that you are less clear in your thinking. But hopefully, and more importantly, they can go for help BEFORE a crisis occurs.
So many families struggle along with no supports of any kind and so they break. Some people are broken before they become parents.
And for some reason our society lives under the belief that the parents and only the parents can raise a child, when the human race for the most part of it’s vast history has been more about a community raising the children.
That’s what we have lost here. The community that will hold the family together when it can’t hold itself up. So many people could benefit from help available before things go pear shaped. Parenting classes, counselling to know how to cope etc. If it is easy, visual and well respected people will use it. Not all, unfortunately, but enough.
I too have been on the front line with some horrific stories. I once had to hide in an hospital toilet with an 8yo patient, hands over my ears, her on my lap as I squatted on the toilet seat hiding my legs from being seen under the door. Because her drunken violent dad had shown up looking to take her so he could abuse her again.
And so so many sad sad stories that I can’t bear to even put a breath to.
These circumstances, the world has already fallen apart for these children, and they need pure fierce protection and rehabilitation. These situations are complex, distressing and difficult. ANy service that looks to these issues, whether government or charity, should be fully supported.
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Rudyroo, that image will stay with me all day. Great comment. Going to hug my babies now.
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That should read ‘..hands over her ears’ …not my ears. Darn ipad typing.
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firstly , thank you for casting light on the topic of child protection and kids in care. it is a topic many fear to speak about or rather ignore. as someone who runs a NGO focused on supporting carers and kids in care and as a person who has lived in the care system as a child and who is now a parent, i have a insight in to the reality of the system spanning a few decades. the reality of the child protection system is: nothing is what it seems! its just not all black and white. finding a fix or solution is not as simple as simply making parenting classes mandatory, not all parenting courses work , lots of problems cant be averted or resolved simply with a parenting course. only offering support during the early years is also not a resolution and early intervention alone with no further support in the later years actually can cause and it is causing a massive black hole where thousands of family’s struggle , cant cope , go unsupported and then further problems develop. parenting a baby and a toddler is very different to parenting a pre teen or even a teen.
being a parent is the most difficult thing any one person can undertake , and the only way to survive parent hood is with support , encouragement, access to supports for any issues you may experience , community awareness, acceptance and guidance. your comment about the what if this new parent was never taught , what if their parent was a poor parent ? , they don’t have those skills, the knowledge , the experience to parent well. it is already a massive stigma for kids who leave care that they wont make good parents. i was told whilst in care that if i ever grew up to have kids they would take them from me because i had been abused and that meant i was destined to be an abuser , really it is a very sad state of affairs. as a starting point our system who is given the job of raising our community’s most vulnerable children must improve the support to those in their care , they must look at the bigger picture and not just the here and now. there should be guaranteed support for any former foster child who becomes a parent , to help them be the best parent they can be to help them learn what it means to be a loving caring supportive parent, the sad reality is most wont learn that in the care system , they will learn bits and pieces and if they have moved allot it becomes very confusing when you experience a wide range of parenting styles , cultures and family dynamics it makes it very hard to know just which parenting style to follow , which is right ? . the bottom line is the system is a mess and a simple band aid like a simple parenting class is not the answer , and saying some people just shouldn’t be parents is a reality but at the same time a very sad reflection on our society that we don’t support each other enough as community’s that so many in our society don’t know how to care or love properly , and some are simply never given the opportunity to be loved or cared for and therefore never given the chance to learn how !
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“…and saying some people just shouldn’t be parents is a reality but at the same time a very sad reflection on our society that we don’t support each other enough as community’s that so many in our society don’t know how to care or love properly , and some are simply never given the opportunity to be loved or cared for and therefore never given the chance to learn how ! ”
Yes!
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Yes, I totally agree with this too.
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My kids are watching peppa pig-an obsession in this household-while I read this post. I think they sometimes watch too much peppa. But posts such as these put such thoughts in perspective……
Do I have an answer about appalling parents? No. But I went and gave my kids another cuddle and reminded myself how thankful I am to have the family I do.
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Totally get the peppa pig guilts too!
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if only it went for longer than 3 minutes!
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Manfeen….you need to get your hands on some dvds of the series
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Um, my 12 week old is manic for that pig! How?! I turned it on by chance one day and well, now we have to watch it every day simply to see and hear her squealing and giggling!! I feel guilty though. I think I should be doing tummy time or reading rather than the pig.
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Dont worry, Anonymous! I have learnt to embrace the squealing pig. My 3yr old recently went to the dentist for the first time – and only happily went after I told her that Peppa goes to the dentist (and then showed her the episode!).
I rely on the premise that at least Peppa has nice manners, loves her little brother, shares her things and her mum and dad are pretty funny. The worst thing she does is jumps in muddy puddles (and at least she wears her gumboots!!). I could do without the snorting though…..that can enter our conversations frequently!
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Your mother teaches you what to do when your baby won’t stop crying??? Aahhh no. I never asked my mother what to do with my baby, my baby taught me what to do. I did use my instincts, I figured it out for myself… my baby not my parents. Very strange paragraph…
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I agree Lauren. My mother died long before I had children but I still knew what to do when a baby cries. Not having a mother around doesn’t mean you don’t know how parent properly as I relied mostly on instinct and asking other mums or maternal health nurse when I wasn’t sure. A lot of crappy parents come from neglectful backgrounds but having grown up with an abusive father I broke the cycle. I make my own decisions in life and do not blame these on my past.
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My mother came around to have photos taken with the baby to send to her friends. She offered no help, I had to figure it all out myself.
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I am all for mandatory parenting classes… I think all good parents would jump at the opportunity to learn (even if just to validate themselves) and all “bad” parents, would benefit from knowing what is veiwed as “normal” good parenting skills…
Some people have just never had the opportunity to know…
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I want to write about this but I struggle to put into words how much hurt I feel when I read about this topic. I had an awful childhood. I was isolated, alone, unloved and obviously never wanted by my single mother.
I wish I had been taken away from my home. At the time I didn’t, but maybe if I had been, I would have a bit more confidence, be a bit more sure of myself and proud of the person I am today.
I consider myself pretty perceptive because my mother has made me realise everything that I don’t want to be as a parent. I will never treat my daughter the same way I was when I grew up.
I wish I had gotten help, or my mum had changed/had the support to change. But even then, who knows what she would have done. Maybe she just didn’t care enough to ever get help or do the right thing.
If only there was a simple answer to help the families who are struggling with abuse and neglect. It is terrible to grow up like that. And even worse to grow up and realise that you were never really loved enough to be protected. I have no idea what any of the answers may be, but I wish there was more that could be done.
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“And even worse to grow up and realise that you were never really loved enough to be protected.” – This resonates with me greatly. I was abused and quite seriously neglected, and there were so many signs. As an adult it weighs greatly on my mind that no one ever noticed, or maybe they did, but didn’t care that I was abused and neglected. No one ever reported my parents. I know intellectually that that probably isn’t the case, but I still feel inferior as a person, As I grew up I had questions. Why was I so unimportant that my parents frequently forgot to feed me? Why didn’t anyone want to be around me, why was I left home alone almost all the time? Why did my parents beat the shit out of me, and then beat the shit out of me because I cried? Was I just born unimportant?
Even though I have quite a normal life, these questions have faded away, I am married, have my own kids and take part in the community, I have trouble making actual friends as an adult. I think the inferiority is just so ingrained in my self that I will never feel that anyone would want to be around me or actually care about me.
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Heaven only knows what the answer is. Human beings can be so feckedup. To be perfectly frank, I want to collect every at risk baby and sterilize the parents. If I had the power I’d make people have a license to breed.
I have a family friend with an intellectually challenged daughter. Her condition makes her hypersexual. She comes from a very high achieving family and has been educated to the extent that her condition allows. Her parents begged for her to be sterilised but, of course, her needs are more important than the poor children she has bought into the world. She now has five, to five different but equally repugnant no-hopers. The children have physical disabilities and emotional disturbances across a huge and diverse range. Her parents do what they can. They have successfully removed one child who was being abused by the new boyfriend but the courts won’t remove the others.
The issue isn’t confined to the uneducated, generational welfare recipients, the drug addicts or alcoholics. Abuse is happening right across the country, often in homes that we’d never suspect. The one in four girls and one in seven boys who are being sexually abused may never come to the attention of DOCS because they don’t fit the stereotype of a neglected or abused child.
Even so, many of these poor babies would rather have ‘Daddy’ sneak into their rooms and rape them every night than be taken from their mothers.
I guess all we can do is educate, empower children as best we can and thank God for people like Avi who fight every day to do the best they can in a situation that will probably never change.
Maybe at risk mothers should be told they have to either enter a six month, live in parenting course or risk losing their baby and then follow up on the family weekly until the child is two. If things aren’t right then remove it while it’s young. Identifying the risks before they are reported would be more effective than cleaning up the mess. At least the identifiable cases could be addresses.
I don’t know.
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‘Maybe at risk mothers should be told they have to either enter a six month, live in parenting course or risk losing their baby and then follow up on the family weekly until the child is two. If things aren’t right then remove it while it’s young. Identifying the risks before they are reported would be more effective than cleaning up the mess. At least the identifiable cases could be addresses.’
I agree. Not with the specifics, necessarily, but the sentiment.
Let’s cut the crap! There should be stricter laws around having kids. Not every idiot with a functioning reproductive system should be able to have as many as they like with absolutely no guidance whatsoever. Mandatory parenting classes for everyone, live-in programs for at-risk parents, early intervention, and various standards that need to be met – otherwise, your kids go to a family who can adequately care for them, and that’s the end of it. No, it will not stamp out ALL problems. But it’ll certainly make a dent in the scale of the issue.
I also think we should be educated from a young age about the realities of parenting (physical, emotional, financial etc.), so more people would stop and think before doing what society expects of them ie. having kids. Making the conscious decision not to have children should be as valid a choice as becoming a parent.
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Spot on! Reading this article brings a lot of passion out in me and there is one point I want to make.
I volunteered and was eventually employed by an amazing South Australian early intervention childrens charity. I was not offered an extension on my contract at the end of last year because the CEO had not been able to secure any more funding (even though she worked her ass off for it!). Both myself and one other employee lost our jobs, and therefore this charity lost 2 positions, forcing them to merge them together and have 1 person take on 2 peoples (full time) roles – tough ask! Six months later, 2 more employees at this charity again lost their jobs for the same reason, leaving 2 employees (only 1 a qualified social worker) to take on the work that 6 previously used to do.
As you can imagine they have been forced to cut specific services to families, in turn placing more pressure on government agencies. This charity has had enormous success in it’s 50+ year history in keeping at-risk juveniles out of the court system, and in school, yet the Government, for all they are worth, have decided that because they cannot “measure” it’s success in dollars, they are happier to wait until this child ends up in the court system and will THEN put money towards rehabilitation. It is common sense that an early intervention will reduce cost in the future. This fact makes me insanely angry that there are families out there crying for help and the government would rather wait until they have failed before they help.
In the 9 months since I lost my job, I know of one other amazing charity that has closed it’s doors because they ran out of funding. For the first 4-5 months of this year there were a very limited number of Community Services jobs being advertised (most only offered 6 month contracts) because funding was so slim, and there were more charities cutting jobs than hiring.
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Argh! this is so frustrating! Im sorry you’ve had to go through the loss of such a great job. As i said below i work for a drug court. People always ask me things like, do you think drug should be legal, do prisons work, etc. Irrelevant i think, maybe, maybe not, i don’t know. What i do know, is that i wish someone got to my people 10, 20, 30, 40 years before me! It would have saved a lot of pain, heartache, and damage! When will we learn.
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One of the problems resulting from government outsourcing is that NGOs compete against each other for much needed funding. Reality is the government cannot fund every service that seeks money to operate – it doesn’t even fund itself appropriately to operate effective child protection systems.
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I was removed from my parents’ care when I was 12. It wasn’t for very long and it only happened once. My parents are not junkies, they are not off the radar like many you’ve mentioned. Both university educated professionals with good jobs, we were at a private school and outworldly had a functioning, normal family. Except that my dad used excessive physical force to discipline us (commonly referred to as “beating the shit out of us”). I realise now that he always had problems with alcohol and anger management, and that he was raising us the way his father raised his.
Did the intervention help? Not really. He hit us less, but there was still a lot of violence in the house. There was some councelling required of us all but my dad refused to take it seriously, blaming the “left wing do-gooders” for interfering in his family. There was no follow up, at least as far as I was aware, and the whole “ugly affair” was promptly swept under the carpet and forgotten about (I actually repressed the memories for many years and only “remembered” about 10 years later).
For a long time I did love my parents unconditionally and instinctively. Then I started my own family and started to look at my upbringing objectively. I realised, over many years, that my parents failed over and over again in their duties to protect their children, whether they inflicted the damage themselves or allowed others to do it through neglect and a selfish desire to not have their children impact their lives. Not only have they never apologised for their actions, but they completely admit any fault whatsoever- in their eyes they have been exemplary parents and deride my own parenting techniques for differing.
I have turned into a decent human being, I hope. I am good to my children, am educated, run a business and haven’t fallen of the rails. But I don’t love my parents any more. I don’t hate them, but I also have completely cut them from my life. Even as an adult, they continue to harm me, both emotionally and physically and recently, in ways that make the childhood beatings seem like a gently tap on the hand. My little family is much better off without them.
As a child in care, I didn’t miss my bedroom and toys, or my parents. The scariest thing about it was facing my parents when I had to go home. I felt safe in foster care. That said, it wasn’t a nice experience, and I’d hate for any child to go through it.
Parenting courses wouldn’t have helped us – my parents are so convinced of their own superiority they wouldn’t have gone and if they had, they wouldn’t have paid attention. They should never have had children (we often wonder why they did, we seemed to be very inconvenient and they certainly didn’t like doing things with us). Would it help others? I definitely think so. I’ve had to work extremely hard to not repeat my parents’ mistakes because without training, the only thing you know is your own upbringing.
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Scary isn’t it? The thought that you could be like your own parents? It’s a life long journey for me. But I’m glad you no longer have contact with them, I found it makes it easier to believe you will never be like them. I made a big mistake though. I let my kids have contact with my parents.
I’m so glad you have come out the other side ok.
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“my parents are so convinced of their own superiority they wouldn’t have gone and if they had, they wouldn’t have paid attention. They should never have had children (we often wonder why they did, we seemed to be very inconvenient and they certainly didn’t like doing things with us). ”
This resonates with me (although to a lesser degree). I’m glad you have found a way through this, but like you say, it is very difficult to realise that you don’t have to parent the way you were parented.
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Oh goodness, thankyou for sharing your story. What a strong remarkable woman you are.
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Totally hear where you are coming from. I often wonder why my parents had us as well, I definitely feel either like an inconvenience or a show pony for them.
Thanks for sharing! x
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‘As a child in care, I didn’t miss my bedroom and toys, or my parents. The scariest thing about it was facing my parents when I had to go home. I felt safe in foster care. That said, it wasn’t a nice experience, and I’d hate for any child to go through it.’
I loved your comment, but was confused by this. Can you please explain? If you didn’t miss anything about home and felt safe in foster care, why wouldn’t you want any child to ‘go through it’? What do you think would be the solution to a problem like yours? Stay with your family? Or be removed? Just interested.
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It was a horrid experience overall. Even though I knew I was not going to be hit for a few weeks, I was terrified for my sister who was still at home; I thought my parents would take their anger out on her. I didn’t belong with the foster family, it wasn’t like staying with friends you know well. They were all really lovely but very different to what I was used to. I copped a lot of flack at school about it, mainly from the bitchy girls who laughed at the clothes I wore to school while I didn’t have a uniform. The uncertainty was awful as were the court appearances. The whole experience was incredibly stressful, I guess I just wish no child was ever in a position where they have to be put into foster care.
I honestly don’t know what the answer is. I think ultimately nothing much changed for us after the foster care – my aunts say my dad did get a reality check but that it was pretty short lived. But I guess it’s given me a big wake up as an adult – when you realise that the state has had to intervene and remove you from your parents, then your gut feel that they weren’t very good at it is justified, and you feel a lot more comfortable making decisions based on that. So now, when I say “I’m not having anything to do with my parents” I can back that up with justifiable evidence, I’m not just being an ungrateful bitch.
I’m so glad I’m not in a position to have to make these kinds of decisions for anybody else.
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Thanks for your response!
I mentor underprivileged teenagers and spend a lot of time thinking about how I can help them and others with a neglectful/abusive/dysfunctional family background. But I didn’t come from a background like that myself, and I don’t have a degree in social work, so I’m never really sure whether or not my ideas are productive.
It was helpful to hear from someone who’s been there and has, clearly, moved on from it. Nice work!
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Beautiful. You’ve captured what it’s like! I work for a drug court – so of course most of my clients were in state care, and most of their children are in state care. I dare say i’m pretty hardened, but nothing gets me like the children.
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