Personal comments on school report cards. Discuss.
By REBECCA SPARROW
“Rebecca’s stories are very imaginative and well presented. There is certainly a need to practice the recorder.”
That’s a direct quote from my grade five report card. Reading between the lines, I can see that my teacher Mr Wessling was trying to tell me something … like maybe, “You are shit at the recorder”.
He had a point.
Regardless, I still have every single one of my school reports - from Mrs Robinson in grade one all the way to Mr Rudd (yes, Kevin’s brother) in grade 12.
The marks I worked so hard for back then, mean little now. The high achievements in English and Drama. The low achievement I got in year 8 for Phys Ed. (“Although she experiences difficulties in performing the basic skills necessary for this unit, she always performs to the best of her ability …” What am I? Forrest Gump?).
That’s the thing. I don’t know about you but when I dig out my reports it’s not the grades I care about so much. It’s the personal comments by the teachers I want to read. Partly because they provide a snapshot in time and a decidedly less biased view of me as a (clearly unco-ordinated) child and teen. And partly because many of them are hilarious to read. (“On occasion Rebecca can be exuberant and she needs to contain herself a little more …” Mrs Gifford, Year 9.)
Which is why I was surprised to read that Victorian State School teachers are holding report cards to ransom as part of their industrial relations dispute.
PARENTS are calling for the ban on written comments in end-of-year report cards to be lifted, saying it will impact on children’s education and lead to a loss of support for teachers.
Report cards sent home in December will contain a grade and attendance information only as state school teachers escalate their industrial campaign for improved pay and conditions.
But the work ban has alienated many parents, who say it will hurt children, especially those who have learning difficulties or are applying to attend another school next year.
Initally, I thought perhaps it wasn’t such a big deal. After all, aren’t “personal comments’ what the parent/teacher nights are for?
Jessica Rudd, Year 9
Um no, not according to my friends with school-aged kids. They were all in agreement about two things.
First: that personal comments were important.
Second: that report cards had become far too generic over the past 20 years.
“Report cards have become far too generic.”
For those not aware, in the majority of schools teachers access a bank of hundreds of comments (approved by the principal and related to the curriculum) and simply – for want of a better word – cut and paste a report together. How ‘personal’ the report ends up, is really up to the teacher and whether they choose to add more in.
My friend Lisa who has kids in grades 1, 2 and 7 complained to me that the comments were so generic on her kids’ last report cards that the three of them were nearly identical and had proven to be a waste of time.
“The only unique bit was when they said Tom seemed to enjoy the Christmas pageant. Except Tom didn’t participate in the Christmas pageant ..”
But others – like my friend T – said it was the comments that helped boost her son’s self-esteem.
“My son’s not a strong student so a C or a D with a comment like ‘Has worked hard and made great progress this term’ makes us both feel positive about school, even though the actual mark may not be great,” she wrote to me on Facebook.
And that’s what those truly personalised comments did. They gave you the bigger picture. Told you that Tom or Sally was empathetic, a leader, helpful, positive or kind. Not to mention their prowess at playing the recorder.
Do you remember what was written about you on your school report cards? If you have (or when you have) kids, would you want their school reports to include personal comments from the teachers?
Comments
233 Comments so far
I’m a teacher and I hate the generic version of reports. Even though I call a boy Tom all year round, when it comes to writing his report, its Thomas. For me that is impersonal and silly. I’m not even allowed to say well done or good luck next year.
I am currently sitting here about to write my year 12 comments and browsing through the bank of ‘boring, impersonal and wanky’ comments as to not offend any 18 yr old student and their parents. What are we teaching these kids……???
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My daughters school will not be commenting on report cards, I have already notified them that no comment = no school fees for them. I urge other parents to do the same and show that we will not stand for it! All public school fees are actually ‘voluntary contributions’ they cannot make you pay and they cannot discriminate against your child for not paying.
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I find this ridiculous, you pay your school fees so that your children can get the best education possible. If you want to know more, ask your childs teacher don’t withhold vital funding because no doubt you will be the first person complaining next year when library or music are cut.
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“How ‘personal’ the report ends up, is really up to the teacher and whether they choose to add more in.”
I am a teacher, and I am not allowed to make personal comments because of school policy. The comment banks that we use are also written in line with school policy and we are not allowed to change them.
The whole tone of your piece suggests that teachers are lazy for not bothering to put more effort into making reports personalised enough. But as a teacher I too am frustrated at the impersonal and politically correct reports that we have to write.
Maybe you should check the facts before criticising teachers in this way?
You might also want to think about why the Victorian teachers are not writing reports this term. It is because they are not getting paid for writing them. They have evey right to take industrial action. Ted Bailleu is trying to completely destroy our profession. He wants to fire 5% of our colleagues. That will increase class sizes for your friend’s child. Did your friend tell you about that?
I am fed up with the constant teacher bashing that goes on in our community. One of the problems with our profession is that because everyone went to school once, or now has a school aged kid, they think they’re and expert on education.
It’s a stressful, demanding job at times. In Victoria we have the lowest wages in Australia. the responsibilities and expectations of teachers are so high. We spend much of our weekends and holidays doing corrections and planning work. Then to have such a lack of support in the wider community in ill informed articles like this just adds insult to injury.
Bec, I have enjoyed some of your other articles but I am really disappointed in this one.
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Teachers are NOT allowed to make personal comments any more. School principals refuse to allow them to do so for fear of backlash from parents. Additionally, having worked as a TA for five years, I know for a fact that comments on reports take weeks for each teacher to complete to the school’s standards. Then they MUST be exactly to the proofing standards of the school. Eg one school I know insists on only one space after a full stop. They force anybody who has left two spaces after their full stops to go back and change every single one. After proofing they must be peer checked (more teacher hours) and only then are they submitted to management for them to tear them to shreds and insist on all sorts of changes.
Teachers are not to blame here. Management are.
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teachers still leave comments
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We were told just this past month that we can’t make ‘personal comments’. We still write comments – I punched through 60 on the weekend – and I do all of mine from scratch, but we must say things like, “Rebecca is a respectful student who has made pleasing progress in this subject.” We aren’t to make comments like, “I have enjoyed Rebecca’s enthusiasm for learning and warmly wish her well in 2013.” Because it’s ‘unprofessional’.
Harrrummphhh!
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Sometimes using a comment bank or doing a bit of cut and paste to your own reports can be good for your sanity.
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I do not use comment banks for a couple of reasons – I like to make each comment truly meaningful and pertinent to the student and I also find that comment banks are much more labour intensive (you have to search through options to find something that vaguely matches what you want to say – easier just to look at your anecdotal records and notes and use them).
They can be useful though for reminding you of good wording choices for the things that you do want to say.
Niether option is easy – using comment banks or creating your own from scratch – writing reports takes a massive amount of time out of your evenings and weekends towards the end of the term, semester or year depending on how your school presents reports.
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Slightly off the subject but I think the classic of all time is that at our children’s primary school, we don’t have parent teacher interviews but we go to the classroom whereupon the child shows us their portfolio of work for the term….the teacher wanders around the room giving noncommittal comments here and there but as parents we can’t actually get any useful information from the teacher as the child is there. Also, the report cards are so beige (has achieved, may one day achieve, we don’t see him achieving in the future) so that they are almost rendered meaningless. Whatever happened to the good old days of 80% or 50% or whatever and the proper parent teacher interview?!
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I have worked in schools that don’t use comment banks, and in schools that do use them. Comment banks aren’t necessarily the quick, easy, no-thought option, although I can see why people might get this impression. Personally I find them much more time-consuming, because instead of just writing what you really want to say, you have to slowly trawl through all the options trying to find the best match. And they can lead to ‘that’s close enough, it’ll have to do’, instead of a more individual description.
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Can everyone just agree that while the cut and pasting may not happen at your school, it clearly does happen, because others have commented on using that system?
It isn’t a personal attack on laziness levels or anything, it just doesn’t happen where you work.
The lack of comprehension and some spelling errors makes me wonder about whether some of you actually are teachers. There is no incredulity in Bec’s article about the teachers taking the decision to use strikes or other industrial action.
I’m a member of the Teachers’ Federation and completely support the Vic teachers (and any others in actions) but accusing Bec of not understanding or being ignorant or whatever is not a cool way to make your point.
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I think Bec’s line that MOST teachers/schools use comment banks hit a raw nerve. I’m not a teacher, but I’m married to one, and know many other people who are teachers. None of these teachers have been at a school that uses comment banks and collectively they’ve been teaching for over 30 years. I’m sure it does happen, but I doubt it is most schools. I don’t think it’s a stretch to see how it could offend those teachers who are in the midst of writing 120+ individual reports to be told that most of them are simply cutting and pasting.
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I agree, it was the word ‘most’, that annoyed many people. Personally, I have no idea whether most, some or a few schools use comment banks and I’m a teacher, so how does Bec know?
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Yes, exactly. You said that much more succinctly than I did!
I just realised the word she used was majority, not most, but still, I think the same thing applies.
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There is a lack of understanding when important issues regarding education are reduced to whether or not teachers use comment banks when reporting. I believe, intentionally or not, that the writer has trivialised the importance of state education and the actions taken by teachers to protect and support it.
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I am a junior primary teacher I can honestly say I always start students’ reports afresh. I do not cut and paste from other years or classmates’ reports. I always think about and discuss the individual student’s qualities and characteristics, strengths and weaknesses. Personal comments are hugely important and a great place to start discussion with parents/caregivers. I hope they will always be a part of reports.
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Where did you get your information that
‘the majority of teachers access a bank of hundreds of comments and simply cut and paste’?? As a Primary School teacher in the Catholic school system (which is still including comments in reports) I take great offence to this. I, like many teachers I know, have spent the last four weekends and many week nights writing individual reports for my 26 students.
At my school, we are encouraged to ensure our reports are personalised yet remain aware we are not allowed to make them too familiar. This is a difficult balance, especially when you genuinely like the children you teach. Most teachers write reports to provide an accurate overview for each member of their class and put great effort into doing so. Our friends in the State system are simply trying to raise awareness of their rights and working conditions. Give teachers a break- we do this job because we love it and we value your children.
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Hi MM team. Not sure what is going on, but it keeps happening..my comments don’t show up. Perhaps occasionally they are moderated, but mostly I doubt it…it happens about 30% of the time, and is frustrating.
Also, the ‘Share Article’ box has shifted to the right a few centimetres, making it cover over text in the comments section. I can get rid of it by changing the size of the window, but I think it’s probably unintentional so thought I’d point it out.
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Hi Tripitaka,
Just letting you know you’re not alone – I’m having the same problem. My comment did actually appear on this post earlier today, but I realised it had some grammar problems so I edited it. After I edited it, a message came up saying that it was marked for moderation and the post disappeared… Frustrating.
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One more thing. I no longer get email notifications when people reply to my comments (and I am checking the box and putting in an email address.)
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As a teacher, I wish I was allowed to write more personalised comments! But the way that schools are run these days, trying to focus on making teachers seem more like “professionals”, we have to write formal comments about the student’s application, as if we’re doctors writing prescriptions to patients.
Pffffft I just want to tell you how much I love your kid when they tell me stories, or how much they annoy me when they fart in class, or how I love that they always know when I’m upset and ask me “Miss are you OK?” or how I think they are going to be an amazing leader one day or how cute they look when they smile or how I can always tell that they are using their phones in their laps or how my heart breaks when I can tell they are sad.
Or how I love teaching your kid
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Hiba, you can be a teacher at my children’s school anytime! You sound like you’d be a wonderful teacher to any child who would be lucky enough to be in your class. I hope you find a school where you can continue to write your personal remarks.
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That’s the thing… teachers just aren’t able to write personalised comments any more. I am frustrated by this from both sides… as a prep parent who wants to know what my child is like from the teache’s perspective and as a teacher who would like to be able to tell the parents exactly what their student is like.
In terms of comment databases – I tend to cut and paste sections of my comments as well as adding in personalised statements (which of course can’t be of a personal nature!!)
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Whilst I believe the writer has not meant to offend, her lack of understanding is hurtful for supporters of public education. In Victoria, state teachers are fighting hard to ensure that ALL children have access to quality education. Teachers are fighting to stop the state government from undermining their profession by introducing destructive performance based pay that will damage teacher collegiality. Teachers are fighting to reduce class sizes. Teachers are fighting for fair pay. Teachers are fighting for equality in education. Teachers are fighting not just for themselves, but for the students they so passionately educate. They are fighting for students whose parents do not engage with their education and never collect their report. They are fighting for the students whose parents do engage and value every comment. It is my hope, that these parents sit down with their children and explain to them that there are no comments on their report this semester because teachers are fighting the government. The teachers are fighting for them. The teachers will continue to fight because they know their cause is just. Teachers will continue to write quality reports, even when they know that many won’t be read, because it is the right thing to do. For now though, there are bigger issues to consider. Fair, equal and quality education for ALL.
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Exactly. Well said.
The idea what teachers are not completing reports in order to ‘punish’ parents or children is looking at it completely the wrong way.
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I can understand why some parents would be upset at not getting the personal comments on the school report. I am a parent who has spent many years in and around the school and I am also studying to be a teacher. I have a son who has quite severe learning issues and he is in a main stream school. I have contact with his teacher on a regular basis so do not have to worry about the comments on his report to know how we are going. Our school are handing out reports earlier than normal, so that if parents have any questions they will have time to speak to the teachers and get “the personal comments” this way. Yes we have parent-teacher interviews and if you are concerned about your child being present and not getting “the truth” or “full story”, I am sure that your class teacher would be more than willing to make a time to speak to you without your child being there.
Oh and to all you teachers out there, I would like to say a very big thank you for your dedication and efforts.
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I teach secondary students and the school’s policy on what we cannot say often renders the comment meaningless. We are not allowed to write comments like ‘X is a pleasure to teach’. We are not allowed to make negative comments about a student’s attitude or behaviour. We are not allowed to express disappointment or delight in a student’s results. All comments must be phrased in the positive. It’s soul destroying, particularly when writing the comment for a struggling student because there is nothing you can say of value to parents who know their child is less than average. There seems to be a very wide gap between what parents want and the reporting policies of the schools.
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I am happy that a ban on writing reports has angered and inspired you, as was the intent of this ban. I urge you to please take this to the government so we can come to an agreement about the conditions teachers will work under for the next 3 years. Then we can get back to carefully writing reports that are well and truly individual.
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As a teacher, I am often told that my comments are too negative and to “find something nice to say”. This means the comments often don’t match the marks. A report will end up with a “John has been a conscientious class member this year…..” with a mark of 35/100. Report comments have become sanitised to avoid offending anyone and are pretty meaningless. Please keep in mind that marks are also moderated and do not reflect the marks you child actually received. I have seen a kid who earned 35/100, end up with 62/100 on their report. I agree that this is very unhelpful to parents and really strains the communication between parents and teachers.
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As a teacher, it is upsetting to read that there is a public perception that reports are just a cut and paste job. You have no idea how long it takes to write them. In a word document, my classes general comments this year totalled over 7000 words and that’s just generals. Yes I use a bank for KLA’s but my general comments are always my own and i think i speak for most teachers when i say that. Although i dont teach in Victoria, i do support the stand they are taking. What other profession would be asked to write 30 individual 4 page reports in their own time with no extra pay, over time or given time away from their job to complete. Unfortunatly teachers are not respected as professionals and the work we put in is only ever criticised. I would never pressume i know more about someone elses job than they do, but in teaching it happens all the time.
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I just wanted to add that for all the people who go on about the holidays teachers get…they are actually for the children as well. Ask any teacher and they will tell you that by the end of term the kids ar getting tired and a bit ratty to say the least. Everyone needs a break from each other and a bit of a refresh to enhance any learning.
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I wonder if most teachers prefer writing reports or parent teacher interviews? As a parent, I much preferred speaking to my daughter’s teacher in person. I felt it was much more relevant, and I got much more out of it, but at her school (government primary school in NSW), they only have the interviews once a year (although we can make a special appointment at any time if we want to.) The reports at our school are, I suspect, written from a drop-down menu, and they are aimed to be very positive. “J can write all the letters of the alphabet”, “J can count to xxx” was the gist of the comments. They didn’t tell me anything I didn’t already know, and there was no advice as to how to challenge or help her more, or how she could improve. If her teacher is spending hours and hours of time doing these, it seems to be completely inefficient, because having a 20 minute chat with the parents could be much more valuable.
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I think both go hand in hand, but nothing replaces talking to someone face to face. I dread face to face interview before they happen, believe it or not, I get very nervous and resent the late nights but when they are completed I am glad that I have spoken to my parents and had the opportunity to get to know them more. I just wish more of them would turn up. Often the ones you really need to see don’t bother.
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Bugger, just wasted an hour of my time using this post as a means to procrastinate and put off doing my reports.
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Ha! Bec I think my aunty may have been your Yr 9 teacher. Classic!
*Edit: Yes, she was your teacher and says you never stopped talking!
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I can see the positives in personalised comments, however I do not think it is going to be damaging to not have them for a short period of time because of industrial action. They have to take an action that is going to get them heard, because teachers really are incredibly underpaid. This sends a very loud message.
I would also like to see teachers paid from the same salary scale in every state. It seems unfair for some states to get paid more than others. Why should Victorian teachers get paid more than any in the country. As a graduate teacher, there is not a massive difference between states, but once you get to experienced senior teacher wage there can be quite sizeable gaps.
My mother is a senior experienced teacher and is part of the regional team in my area in Qld – she mentors teachers around the region on teaching maths, implementing the Australian National Curriculum, coordinates gifted and talented education programs, delivers seminars and professional development sessions, travels quite extensively and is one of the most passionate and dedicated people I know. She is, without a trace of doubt, amongst some of the most highly qualified teachers in this country and she inspires me everyday. I am incredibly proud…. but she gets paid a little over 80k. The amazing people who do what she does should be paid a whole lot more, because many of them choose not to go down the path of being a school principal or deputy because they are passionate about teaching, not paperwork.
It is time that those who choose the teaching profession are rewarded for it, because it is a hard, hard job and this country relies on good teachers for the positive and fruitful futures of our children.
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I’m a teacher and I didn’t even know some schools had a bank of comments to pick from! Every word (1500 ish per kid) is written by me for that student! I understand why parents want personal comments, they can be entertaining! I hope this is all resolved! I wish our society had more respect for teachers it has been so disheartening sometimes listening to uninformed views about what teachers do.
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LOL Jamila!
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Hi Bec,
I absolutely love your writing and always find myself vivaciously agreeing with you. I was just wondering out of interest where the information came from re: your comment “in the majority of schools teachers access a bank of hundreds of comments and simply – for want of a better word – cut and paste a report together.”
I teach in a Victorian government school where we all write our reports completely from scratch, and I myself spent over 30 hours writing thousands of words for my June reports. I have never heard of a comment bank and would not have thought my school was in the minority by doing 100% original comments, but I saw in the comments other teachers had acknowledged this. I wonder if it varies state to state.
While I personally disagree with the use of a comment bank (and understand now why people don’t believe reports take me so long!) I can see one reason why they use it. We are told to be so careful about what to say and how to say it, not too nice but not too critical etc etc, that I can see why people might think ours seem copied and pasted!
As an AEU member I am standing by this particular action, though I do have mixed feelings about it. We are working around it by being more than happy to discuss progress verbally with parents who seek additional info, and I just hope that my parents will understand I am supporting the action because I don’t like where the Vic government is taking the education system. For anyone who thinks it is just about pay (which is all the media promotes) I urge you to look into exactly what all the action is about. I am happy enough with my salary, it’s all the other changes the government is proposing that I’m fighting against.
Oops, that wasn’t meant to be so long! It’s just that I’m a first year teacher, I love my job and I work my butt off, and all the negativity around teaching this year had been a but disheartening!
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I can see the positives in personalised comments, however I do not think it is going to be damaging to not have them for a short period of time because of industrial action. They have to take an action that is going to get them heard, because teachers really are incredibly underpaid.
I would also like to see teachers paid from the same salary scale in every state. It seems unfair for some states to get paid more than others. Why should Victorian teachers get paid more than any in the country. As a graduate teacher, there is not a massive difference between states, but once you get to experienced senior teacher wage there can be quite sizeable gaps.
My mother is a senior experienced teacher and is part of the regional team in my area in Qld – she mentors teachers around the region on teaching maths, implementing the Australian National Curriculum, coordinates gifted and talented education programs, delivers seminars and professional development sessions, travels quite extensively and is one of the most passionate and dedicated people I know. She is, without a trace of doubt, amongst some of the most highly qualified teachers in this country and she inspires me everyday. I am incredibly proud…. but she gets paid a little over 80k. The amazing people who do what she does should be paid a whole lot more, because many of them choose not to go down the path of being a school principal or deputy because they are passionate about teaching, not paperwork.
It is time that those who choose the teaching profession are rewarded for it, because it is a hard, hard job and this country relies on good teachers for the positive and fruitful futures for our children.
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My all time fave:
‘Vanessa has the ability, but not the application’
*curtseys*
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That one is a classic from the report writing Hall of Fame. It would also sum up my daughter’s year at school for 2012 !
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As a teacher, I can speak for the majority when I say that I do not just grab a few lines from a ‘bank’ of report statements provided by my principal. In fact, I’ve worked at a few schools and I have never received a bank of statements from any principal. My reports are always meticulously put together, and each report is individualised to cater for the talents and needs of each student. You have no idea how long each report takes, and the amount of detail we must provide within a seven line paragraph. It’s so easy to criticise when you don’t know all the facts.
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Well said! People who live with teachers not just know them know how many unpaid hours goes into each report. It’s almost 1000 words per child at my school times an average grade of 25 students.
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Thanks for putting into words exactly how I feel, my experience as a teacher is the same.
I’m one of the lucky ones that only had 21 reports to write, about 10,000 words but all done over my weekends. I make a huge effort to address the important concepts my students have grasped and what they are still working on.
This article may not have been intended to offend but covering this subject at this time of year might hit a few nerves, mine included.
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I have great respect for my kids teachers and the work they put in and treat them accordingly. I’m always gobsmacked to watch how some parents approach their children’s teachers with the attitude of ‘I’m paying your wages so you’d better jump when I say’. How can that approach help your child?!
Would love your opinion about a comment my child received on her end of year report – “…she often plays alone at recess”. Why do you think my daughter’s teacher mentioned that? What am I meant to do with that information? I would’ve asked the teacher but a) it was the end of year and we didn’t see her again that year and b) I was hesitant to approach her about it the following year because she no longer taught my daughter and I felt that booking a time to see her just to ask that seemed a bit OTT.
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It is strange that your child’s teacher wrote that in her report and didn’t address it with you earlier than the end of year reports.
I imagine she is telling you because either a) she needed to fill up the word count and that is all she could think of b) she is concerned that your daughter is having social issues and perhaps you could talk to your daughter about who she plays with? Tell her a teacher at school told you she noticed that she is often alone at break times.
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Articles written like this make me furious. As a teacher I NEVER use a cut and parts or drop down box of comments. I spend time making sure my students receive a personalised report.
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“Taegan is a kind, conscientious student who likes to contribute to class discussion” Year 9
Guess I talked a lot in class!
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I find all the justifications for school holidays contradictory..on one hand they are perceived as ‘time off in lieu’ for the hours of preparation and report writing… on the other hand they are often used as a reason for why teacher salaries should not be raised – because they work ‘less’ hours a day and weeks of the year,thus are entitled to a reduced wage that reflects the school day and school holidays. On one hand, teachers are hard workers, and should be rewarded with holidays, on the other, they work less than other people so deserve less pay. So which is it? Because to me, those two justifications completely contradict each other!
The majority of teachers work incredibly hard to ensure their end of year reports reflect each and every student’s individual progress throughout the year. I myself spend at least 50 hours writing and compiling every report from scratch- no two students are the same so no two reports are the same.
The majority of parents don’t even acknowledge or express appreciation for the report. I completely understand the frustration and dislike for generic, automatically generated comments but I also think parents need to let teachers know how much they value the feedback. A thank you goes a long way….
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That’s what your pay is for. Paid by the parents taxes.
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I pay taxes too… I-and I’m guessing most teachers-don’t do it for the pay.
I teach because i love my job, I love haven an impact on the kids I teach, and I love seeing them develop academically and personally. I put so much of my own time and my own money into my job ($4000 last financial year), even outside of report writing time.
I wake in the night trying to solve problems, I come up with lesson ideas in the shower…
A parent saying thank you makes my week.
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I completely agree..I also teach for the love of it. I think most of us do.
I was just trying to point out that society has some very mixed perceptions about the role of teachers.
It seems to be a profession that most people feel they have the right to judge, despite having no real understanding of what it is like to be a teacher.
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Heaps of people work hard and stressful jobs. Heaps of people make similar or even less money than teachers. Heaps of people wake in the night and think about work. Nearly everyone ends up doing work outside of working hours.Heaps of people don’t receive a “thanks” for doing their job – they just collect their pay. Should I go on?
What makes your job so difficult that it warrants so many complaints?
Is it the extra 8 weeks holidays you receive? I’m stumped.
Surely there is a teacher out there who is grateful they actually have a job?
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I don’t think any teacher thinks they have the hardest, most stressful job in the world. I think the annoying part for us, Annoyed, is the common perception or at least, the common expression of perction, that teaching is a cruisy gig for idiots who couldn’t cope in the “real” world.
The lack of any respect from students and parents alike, plus the negative societal perception does make us feel a bit underappreciated.
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As a Civil Engineer, I’d really like people to thank me for the roads and bridges that I’ve built, and for the sewage treatment plants that I designed and built, and also for the water reticulation systems that I’ve put in the ground. Throw in the odd runway so people can fly on flash A380′s.
But no, most people don’t even know what civil engineers do, or how hard we work, today was a typical day and was 12 hours from start to finish. A long day is 14 hours and a short day is 10 hours, my Saturday is my shortest day because I get to go home after 8 hours. .
So when teachers complain about having to write reports at home on weekends, and having to stay at school until 5.30 to prepare lessons, I don’t have a lot of sympathy. We know what you are supposed to do, and that is teach children and then accurately report on their progress.
So stop complaining and do your bloody jobs.
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Anon, as a civil engineer you also get paid way more than even the most qualified, experienced and passionate teacher, so what exactly is your point?
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I can see the positives in personalised comments, however I do not think it is going to be damaging to not have them for a short period of time because of industrial action. They have to take an action that is going to get them heard, because teachers really are incredibly underpaid.
I would also like to see teachers paid from the same salary scale in every state. It seems unfair for some states to get paid more than others. Why should Victorian teachers get paid more than any in the country. As a graduate teacher, there is not a massive difference between states, but once you get to experienced senior teacher wage there can be quite sizeable gaps.
My mother is a senior experienced teacher and is part of the regional team in my area in Qld – she mentors teachers around the region on teaching maths, implementing the Australian National Curriculum, coordinates gifted and talented education programs, delivers seminars and professional development sessions, travels quite extensively and is one of the most passionate and dedicated people I know. She is, without a trace of doubt, amongst some of the most highly qualified teachers in this country and she inspires me everyday. I am incredibly proud…. but she gets paid a little over 80k. The amazing people who do what she does should be paid a whole lot more, because many of them choose not to go down the path of being a school principal or deputy because they are passionate about teaching, not paperwork.
It is time that those who choose the teaching profession are rewarded for it, because it is a hard, hard job and this country relies on good teachers for the positive and fruitful futures of our children.
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I’m a high school teacher and also a year co-ordinator. I don’t believe it is always feasible to write individual comments. I try to tailor some comments individually, especially for students who have done exceptionally well, improved, not been doing as well or for those who may have faced extenuating circumstances over the year. As year co-ordinator it means that I also have to write an additional 200 odd comments on top of my 5 classes. Time wise you might only get 1-2 weeks to complete this, on top of your regular duties.
I think the Victorian teachers are valid in their decision to do this. If they are expected to have an increased workload due to the financial constraints put on them by the state government, then this is a good example of the types of duties which will suffer as a result. I’m sure the teachers don’t want to disadvantage their students, but it is a really strong way to get the message across about the impacts.
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Hey Anonymous, I take issue with ‘Time wise you might only get 1-2 weeks to complete this, on top of your regular duties.’ Really? You get at least 15 weeks notice as far as I can tell. Reports are due at the same time of year, every year. I think this about managing your workflow, not getting completely snowed under at the last minute.
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Cool logic. She has 15 weeks so by that logic we start writing a report the day we start teaching the student? We need to teach and then assess learning BEFORE reporting on it. Learning happens every week. I think parents would like the most up to date information on their child not “3 and a half months ago your child could count to 100 now its probably 500 but I’m writing this 3 and a half months early so not too sure”
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To be fair to teachers (and I am not one) they can’t write the reports before students have been assessed each semester!
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So you are suggesting we don’t teach for the last few weeks of school.
My students are doing things this week, that they weren’t doing last week, because we still have 3 weeks left of term, and are expected to teach for at least the next 2 (a few days of the last week are taken up with class party, excursion and Christmas concert rehearsal).
If I wrote reports 15, 5, or even 2 weeks early they aren’t reflective of the students.
So only assess until when? Kids ask-will this be in the exam? Will ths get reported on? If not-they don’t care and don’t try.
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Not true, reports can’t be written until assessments have been undertaken and marked, usually at the end of term/semester when all the content that needs to be covered has been taught to the class. This generally does only leave 1-2 weeks.
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Well I guess that depends on whether you want the report to reflect how the student is doing at the start of the semester, or at the end of it. As a parent, I’m more interested in how they’re doing at the end, as a teacher I’m amazed at how much your opinion lacks insight,.
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I am actually really offended by this article, and some of the commenters. At my school, we are expected to write 200 words per student. As a high school teacher, I teach 174 students. That is 34,400 words. My deadline was today. I like to see the whole semester picture for my classes so that I can write meaningful comments – which means I have basically written these comments in less than two weeks.
There will always be teachers who cut and paste. I used to work in a school where you used a formula ie if I wanted to use three sentences I would type in 699+123+52 (my favourite combination for a ‘class clown’ type kid). But yes, there were more than 700 sentences to choose from. We had no choice, but at least, mathematically, there were so many options that there werent too many problems.
Now, I am actually not allowed to repeat the same comment in a class. My reports are thoroughly checked, adding to everyone’s workloads, and ‘subjective’ comments are frowned upon. Last year, I had a complaint that I had written ‘Sally should not be disappointed with this result, as she tried her best at all times’ because of course Sally should be disappointed, she didn’t get an A!
There are few professions that are so heavily scrutinised – I’m not sure many of the negative commenters would be able to cope with a full day of work, add to that marking time, and no life on weekends for 40 weeks of the year.
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Don’t be offended. I’m sure all parents know that some teachers work really hard and are worth their weight in gold. Conversely, most of us have encountered absolute duds. My son could have stayed home for year 4 and it would have made no difference.
Also, please don’t imagine that you are working harder than other professionals. I work in international logistics. It’s not a 9 to 5 , Monday to Friday job. I also have full days, some nights and many weekends, 48 weeks a year.
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i dont think that teacher is imagining that she is working hard….the point she is making is that teachers are not respected for the professionals they are and whilst i would never ever assume to know anything about the pressures of working in international logistics….people always feel they can judge teachers or make a comment on what we do.
I have encounted dudes in all professions but i dont right off that profession because of them.
To a point this article offends me to…people have no idea the time involved in reports…the way we stress over one word and try to build kids up whilst being honest. I support victorian teachers, although i dont work in victoria….what other profession requires you to write 30 individual reports (not to mention assessment tasks etc) in thier own time with no overtime pay or time away from their job to complete.
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Yes, but do you get paid overtime for those extra hours? I’m sure your salary reflects the time you spend at work.
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Hi Teacher, Bec is travelling today, but I know that offending teachers is the very LAST thing she’d have wanted this post to do. No one is more aware of the phenomenal effect a teacher can have on a child – did you see this piece she wrote a few weeks ago? It’s a love letter to teachers – http://www.mamamia.com.au/social/my-favourite-teacher/
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I remember getting the comment “sings like Dad”. My father can’t sing ….my teacher was a good friend of my fathers! Ruined my future career as a singer!
As a teacher we are directed to use the comment bank. Many of us dislike it because it is impossible to find the comment you want.
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“If Louise spent half as much time on her Science as she does on her socialising, I would have an A grade student”…….
Although I was a good kid, obviously Science wasn’t my forte. It is the only comment I remember though…..and just quietly its my favourite!!
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I remember two hilarious comments made by my Year 3 teacher on my report: “Victoria has the capacity to beat a wet hen wings down when animated and can paint a room with black when the mood strikes” (or something to that effect). That teacher knew me & was outstanding at his job. Thanks Mr Les Martin for your personal comments.
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As long as my kids aren’t falling way behind, the general comment is the bit I’m most interested in. My teacher pal Lou (who has 4 sons herself) says the comment bank makes doing reports anything but time-saving. Far quicker to scribble ‘Delight to teach’ than to fish through hundreds of curriculum relevant comments. My sympathies are entirely with teachers – I am grateful to them. A report is a bonus.
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I am a primary school teacher in NSW and at my school, comments are expected to be “personalised” – not from a “bank” and certainly not from a “drop down menu.”
Writing reports is god-awful boring…..but it IS part of my job and I knew that when I signed up.
It consumes hours and hours of time.
I know…I know….I get ah-may-zing holidays, get home at 5 past 3 every day & get paid bazillions!
My colleagues and I often talk about “personalised” vs “cut and paste” reports – it really does depend on your perspective. Really, in a classroom, there are five kids you could use the same sentence on, mixed with a variety of other sentences. We don’t think it’s realistic, in the time frame given (we mean between the teaching/learning and the deadline for reports to be in) to write a personalised report comment for each child, for each subject. Everyone looks for ways to save time in their job……teachers are no different.
I’ll never understand the teacher-bashing. It’s just so sad in a country as educated at ours that teaching is perceived as the type of profession that people regularly take aim at.
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I honestly think it’s jealousy over the holidays. 4 weeks it torture, but we should all work so we can all take more holidays if we want – not drag down those who are lucky enough to get more holiday time.
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As a teacher, I can tell you that the good old days of interesting reports are over. They have been sanitised to the point of boring and we are told to include details that I as a parent couldn’t give two hoots about. I preferred the old days when you got a grade for subjects and a lengthy personal comment at the end. So much of it is just fill these days in primary school and doesn’t tell me what I want to know as a parent. Unfortunately, in some schools they are a torture to write as well.
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It is gratifying to read so many comments acknowledging the hours teachers devote to their students.
Like many who have already commented, I found report writing both a blessing and a curse. I appreciated the opportunity to comment on my students’ progress and always wrote a personalised comment that reflected both the learning and the approach to learning. However, I cursed the linguistic wrestling match – wanting to be personal yet needing to comply with report marking policies that kept an eye firmly on accountability (ie what could be measured).
Teachers could be doing so much more, if only we were given the time, flexibility and opportunity to do so. Too often reforms, systems and policies are imposed upon us without adequate thought as to how the ‘idea’ translates in a ‘real world context.
However threads such as this offer a glimmer of hope. It seems many parents do understand and effective, proactive change may be closer than we think.
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Just make it 2012…
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Personally I feel very sorry for teachers in this day and age. Parents need to toughen up and hear the sometimes hard facts about their children. If any of my three children is disruptive in class or struggling with the work, not doing any work etc I’d want to know about it so together we can come up with a positive solution to the issue. The system is way to PC for my liking (along with alot of other areas) and we really need to go back to an era where teachers can be honest about a student and their progress without fear of abuse or finding themselves in legal hot water from miffed parents. Don’t care about the “excess” holidays teachers get – you couldn’t pay me enough to do their job. I take my hat off and salute all amazing teachers out there!!
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I’m a teacher, and not one who generally complains about working conditions etc – I think we have it pretty good! I do think, however, that the reason teachers have moved away from personalised comments is due to the sheer number of students we teach (particularly as a high school teacher) and the sheer amount of content that we have to cover with those students. As it is, reporting takes me at least 30 hours (yes, which I’m not technically paid for but hey, the holidays make up for it) – and that’s with ‘generic’ comments. The comments are generated by teachers at the start of each reporting period though, so they do relate to specific work that each student has done.
And while parents might still be up in arms about it, it’s also worth considering that the best communication with a teacher is face to face, or at least on the phone! I constantly contact parents to talk about students’ progress if I feel it’s needed, and I encourage them to contact me. Sadly the effort isn’t coming from the parental side – usually I request about 50 Parent Teacher interviews a semester…I never get more than 10 who bother to show up.
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I didn’t really care about the comments. As long as they indicated effort was being made that was enough.
What I wanted was academic results. I wanted to know how they were doing against their peers. We’re they comfortably in the middle? Or struggling at the bottom? Every kid in the class seems to get a C for everything. My kids came to the conclusion very early on that everyone gets a C regardless.
It’s very hard to motivate your child when they get the same mark as the kid who’s failed to hand anything in for most of the term.
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I was happy to support teachers in their strike days even though organising childcare while I’m at work is an unwanted extra expense but I am upset at the no comments on the kids report cards. Yes I do know that they are mostly from an accepted list but as a mum of a prep this is a memory that can’t be replaced. To be honest I do feel like parents are being punished and held to ransom when we (most of us) have been and are totally supportive of teachers.
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I don’t think this is to punish anybody. I believe it is to give an assessment of your child’s ability….regardless of the teachers personal opinion of your child.
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As a Victorian teacher and a union member, I fully support the AEU ban on writing comments. This ban is designed to make parents aware of the time that is spent by teachers writing comments for your children. By not writing comments we are making parents aware of our plight and giving them the opportunity to give feedback to their local member about the situation. Please do not ring the school and complain. For too long the state government in Victoria has taken teachers in state education for granted. We are not just about the pay in our pockets each fortnight, we are doing this for your children – for their future as students in public schools in Victoria.
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I was once called fat in a school report – no joke!
“Bo hasn’t done her grades or her body any favours by being highly selective in her participation”
- Year 11 sport class, 2005
????
( for the record I’m a size 6-8 and regularly play netball and tennis. I just wasn’t that keen on hockey….)
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I don’t see how that is labelling you as fat, size 6-8 is hardly overweight. I think it’s in regard to your physical health.
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For Kay & Angie:
Sigh…….everyone is so serious!
As I said, I regularly played netball and tennis and I was active in other sports too like swimming and running. Coupled with the fact that I was (and am) a size 6-8 I’m obviously not fat and my physical health is really good – I just didn’t like hockey!! It was amusing to me at the time and it’s a pretty full-on personal comment to leave on someone’s report card so I thought I’d “add it to the conversation”.
Even though the comments have kind of turned into teachers v parents, the original conversation was to remember some of our report cards.
I wonder what the response would’ve been if I hadn’t included my size? Or if I was overweight? At the end of the day it’s still a very personal comment about someone’s body!
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I don’t get your interpretation of it. It doesn’t say anything about you being fat.
“Bo hasn’t done her grades or her body any favours by being highly selective in her participation”
It is P.E and clearly all about using your body! If you weren’t joining in then I see this as a perfectly reasonable comment.
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That comment doesn’t say your fat. It’s true you wouldn’t have done your body, as in the health of your body, any favours by not participating. For it to be mentioned in your report means it would have been a significant amount you missed.
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Why is it that teachers are quite often critisiced, blamed, and generaly held accountable for societies problems, and told we have a cushy job with too many holidays?! General sweeping statements are not intelligent debate either. You dont go into teaching for money or the holidays.
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Teachers cop shit because everyone’s been to school, so they think they know what teachers do.
I’m studying teaching at the moment and so often I hear “Oh that’s a great job for a single Mum, all the holidays and good hours!”. Um, yeah. We’ll see.
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