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1512371 std 5 43074 300DPI Would you swap lives with your grandma?

This post is sponsored by Karcher.

 

 
By KATE HUNTER

Sometimes I’m guilty of romanticising the past.

Things seemed so simple in my gran’s day. Kids raced billy carts in the streets, mothers chatted over back fences. Dads came home at five o’clock, and after a dinner of chops and potatoes, the family listened to the wireless.

There was no online bullying, no one stressed about ‘carbs’ or wrung their hands over what school to send the kids to.

I like to believe that gran had it great when she was my age. But then I look around my house and realise great is relative.

From where I sit, writing at our kitchen table, I can see 8 appliances Gran would have killed for had she been the violent type. If I could be bothered to walk a few metres and open the laundry door, it would be 10.

Air Conditioner: It’s 39 degrees in Brisbane today. Only the dining room is air conditioned so family meals are taking longer than ever. There might even be board games tonight.

Dishwasher: This broke down last year and because of a shortage of parts we washed dishes by hand for a week. It was like camping, but without the fun bits.

Fan-forced oven: Gran had an oven, sure. But it was either hot, or off.

Sandwich press: I remember gran making toasted sandwiches, but in a frying pan, which meant washing up. See ‘dishwasher’ above.

Food processor: Cooking in Australia in the forties and fifties had a reputation as being somewhat bland. I’m not surprised. I don’t think I could be arsed making my own pesto by hand, could you?

Gas BBQ: Pop was a big one for barbecues, but barbies back then meant wood, kerosene, beer and burned meat. No wonder Gran was ‘meh’ about it as a cooking alternative on hot nights.

Fridge: Gran and Pop had fridges. But those fridges didn’t have ice-makers and water dispensers. They also didn’t keep things that cold, and it was tricky to tell if that icicle-laden lump hacked from the wall of the freezer compartment was a bit of flathead or a rump steak.

TV: A blessing and a curse. But more blessing than curse, I reckon. No wonder Gran and Pop were the first in their street  to get one. Gran didn’t watch it that much, but she said it was good to put framed family photos on. It’s probably a good thing Gran passed on before today’s flat-screen slimline jobs. Where would she put the pictures?

Washing machine: This is the pointy end. Gran had five kids. Those kids wore cloth nappies. No wonder people had their babies toilet trained by 12 months.

Vacuum cleaner: I remember Gran did have one, but it was only slightly smaller than a VW Beetle and quite a bit noisier. As such it was rarely used and Gran preferred to drag rugs onto the clothesline and beat the bejesus out of them with a broomstick. Hard floors were mopped with such a cocktail of chemicals that no bacteria could survive the onslaught. Of course, no one in the family could breathe for an hour after the mopping had taken place, but that was the price of good hygiene.

Kaercher logo Diff R large YK 24321 300DPI Would you swap lives with your grandma?

This post was sponsored by Karcher, makers of commercial quality steam cleaners.  Steam cleaning is the natural, clean and environmentally friendly way to clean and works without any chemicals at all. Steam is the ideal alternative to conventional cleaning methods.

So, would I swap lives with my Grandmother? Maybe. As long as I could take my sandwich press with me.

Would want to live as your Gran did? Which appliances would you miss most? 

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46 Comments so far

  1. Curious

    My amazing Grandma spent her 19th birthday in a concentration camp called Aushwitz. She lost nearly all her family in the gas chambers and after the war had to marry a man who she didn’t love (my grandfather) who was ten years older than her because she had nowhere else to go. She lost twin babies who were premature -she didn’t know she was having twins. She eventually grew to love my grandpa and they were lucky enough to eventually leave Europe and come to Australia. Such a special lady- I miss her every day!

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    • Anon

      She must have been a very special lady.

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  2. JosieY

    If I were born in my grandma’s era, I’d be dead twice over : once from a deficient thyroid, and once from cancer.

    I would not have been able to do two degrees while my husband supported us financially.

    I sure as hell would not be an ordained minister, or a black belt.

    So no thanks, I like it where I am!

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  3. mummamoo

    Such a great piece Kate! I am actually finding myself doing more and more things that my Nan (mum’s mum) would have done when she was my age. Not by necessity so much, but by choice. We have recently decided that our two boys can share a room, even though we have a 4 room house and t wasn’t necessary. I’m spending more and more time being creative with my cooking, really looking hard at what’s in the pantry and how I can make it work. Growing our own vegies, baking from scratch, hand-making all our family Christmas gifts.
    And I am married to a farmer, just like she was! So we can chat about the “farmer’s wife” things that not many other people understand. Only going away on the raining days, being in the paddock til all hours, kids in tow, asleep in the back while I deliver dinners or move trailers.
    The more I do, the closer I feel to her, which is a double benefit really.
    BUT I really really like my washing machine (dirty farmer clothes and two boys!!) and my oven just the way they are!

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  4. Anon

    swap with grandma?

    Not in this life.

    Born in a 2 room house and no electricity until she was 14, no telephone. When her brother was listed as missing in WW1 it took 8 months to have his death confirmed. There was no school within cooee so she started work on the farm at the age of 5, then she only had 4 years of school between the ages of 10 and 14 (but never stuffed up her spelling). When her other brother died in 1918 in France her father had to walk 32km to town to find out that his son had died. Then he walked back to tell his wife that she had lost a second son in the “war to end all wars”. There was no penicillin, kids in the area got infantile paralysis, when she fell out of a tree as a 12 yo and broke her collarbone she had to sit on a dray for 2 days to get to the nearest doctor to have the bone set, without any pain relief.
    Then when she was old enough to go out into the big bad world the depression hit. When she was ready to have her first child in 1938 she asked her older sister what would happen during childbirth. Her sister told her not to worry because the baby would come regardless of how much she knew.

    She gets through the depression and WW2 takes her new husband away for 4 years, and he comes back with post traumatic stress disorder, a serious drinking problem, and a couple of wounds that took 40 years to kill him.

    So, would I like my grandmother’s life?

    No way, you can stick it fair up your arse, today is a much easier place in time to live.

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    • Anon

      Nanna was however, a beautiful old lady who died last year at the age of 96.

      She taught me humility and how to accept adversity with good humour and the determination to succeed.

      She always had sage advice, and I never once heard her bad mouth anyone.

      She lived her life with grace and dignity. She even died with acceptance and dignity.

      I miss my Nanna.

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  5. Snap!

    Kate, I had a Gran and Pop too! I’ve never met anyone else who used those exact same monikers for thir grandparents :)

    My pop worked night shift and my gran raised 5 kids who all had to be quiet until lunchtime so pop could get his sleep.

    And I didn’t have a dishwasher for the first 15 years I was married (currently 18 years on the clock there). And no air con until our 3rd house. But I was mortgage-free by age 37. I do now have everything on your list and have no intention of parting with any of it!

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  6. Bored of Burwood

    Hell, no. Both my grandmothers brought up children in wartime London.

    No washing machines, no tumble driers, no fancy labour saving devices. Vacuum cleaner? No. Hard, physical labour. Wringing washing out with a mangle. No supermarkets. Crappy sanitary wear. Painted on stockings. No indoor toilet. Food rationing. Clothes rationing. Fear of bombing. Actual bombing. Poor career opportunities. Poor education.

    My grandmothers were extraordinary women.

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  7. Renee

    No. Appliances aside. My maternal grandmother was uneducated (because you didn’t ‘waste’ education on girls), and thus her life had only one option. Bring up children (which she did a stellar job on).
    Give me choices thanks.
    My paternal grandmother grew up in Europe where education for girls was more accepted. Her mother was one of the first women to graduate from medical school, and Mieke had a uni degree too. She worked as a social worker up to and during WWII (in Holland). Some crazy stories. Then in 1952, they left Holland to start a fresh life away from war – a 6 week boat ride by herself with 4 kids under 6 (her husband went by himself a few months earlier to find a house, etc). She must have found NZ so backward in the 50s and 60s. She was the only university educated female in her peer group and had to contend herself with raising children.

    So – options. That’s what I like about being in today’s world.

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    • Anonymous

      Renee! I will NEVER complain about taking my 22 month old girls to kinder gym alone, EVER. AGAIN! Thanks for helping me realise what is worth complaining about today!

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  8. goose

    It’s funny how few of the things you listed I actually own! Washing machine, TV, gas BBQ, that’s it! And the gas BBQ is out of gas (and has been for 1y+).
    I do own a fridge, but not the ice-maker, water dispensery kind.

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  9. Lisa-Jane

    I would swap in a heart beat. My nan never had to work and never had a mortgage. Pa was a fisherman so they lived in a home over looking beautiful Portarlington. She never worked and yet she retired on a full pension in a beautiful home on the gold coast 5 minutes from the beach. She always had new cars, a boat a caravan and overseas holidays plus 3 cupboards full of clothes, matching shoes and handbags. I would gladly swap my dishwasher (necessary because I an enslaved in a dead end job just to pay the mortgage) for her life anyday. There is no way I could ever afford all the things she had even with 2 wages coming in. I will probably die before the house is paid off and never even get to retire

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  10. Bec

    Not a chance. Two under 1yo in cloth nappies with no electricity.

    But even worse she was Rh negative and only had one live baby after those two and even then it was touch and go for her and her baby’s life when he was born. She lost three babies, including her only girl.

    Her husband sold up the farm without asking her opinion.

    Polio without a vaccine – would scare the crap out of me.

    Without modern medicine my daughter will lose her hearing and eye sight.

    I’m only mid 30s – my grandma is not yet 80. The changes over the past 60 years are enormous and I’m not keen to go back to those times.

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  11. JulieN

    Not on your life..

    My Grandmother had 4 kids in 4 years because her husband was catholic and wouldn’t allow birth control. Whilst having those 4 kids she milked cows morning and evening while he was at the pub (he NEVER came home at 5) and worked in his shop during the day.

    Giving birth to her first child at 20, which she did on her own, there were complications she couldn’t give authority to resolve and her husband wasn’t there (see pub statement above), meaning her son almost died. She played nursemaid to his mother who was mean to her until she died, and she did and continues to do everything for him after 60 years.

    I love my grandfather, but my grandmother is a force of nature – mainly because she had to be. Our lives may be complicated at times, but I’d never go back.

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  12. Shaezy

    No way. Although both of my nan’s were amazing, strong women, my mum’s mum lost triplets to Rubella in the early 1940′s and never got over their deaths. The vaccine wasn’t invented then. I think I’ll stay in the era that has life saving medicine, thanks.

    And my dad’s mum was looked on as “suspect” during the wars as her grandfather was German – even though he arrived in Australia in 1854, aged just one year old! No one cares enough about my ancestry to bother branding me an alien, or trying to run me out of town during devastating times of war. I’m okay with that too.

    They both lived for their families, had roofs over their heads, and were happy when I knew them, but since researching their lives I’ve come to realise how hard they had it, and how amazing they were to keep their families together after such adversities as they faced.

    I miss them both very much, and wish I could have had more time with them before they died.

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  13. Walking on Sunshine

    My grandma had limited education and was forced to quit work when she had children. No way would I swap with her, but I’m sure she would swap with me!

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  14. Faybian

    My dads mum was a turn of the century baby and mums mum born in the 1910s. They both lived through 2 world wars and the great depression with dads mum telling me about what the great depression was like one time. They both talked about the appliances, or lack of at different times, as do my own parents.
    What I would miss: indoor toilet. I remember how scary my great grandmothers outdoor loo was.
    Washing machine: there is absolutely no way I’d want to have to use a copper and then wringer to do the washing.
    Fridge: ice box, nuff said.
    Vacuum cleaner: carpet sweepers are pathetic compare to them.

    Dishwashers and air con are lovely and yes, we have them, but you can still live without them, without feeling like housework is hard labour.

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  15. anon

    I get strangely nostalgic for the life of someone in the 30′s to 60′s eras despite the fact that it’s a life I have never lived. When I see elderly ppl I actually stare at them just imagining what life they have lived and what the have seen in their life and times. I ponder if they were happy , if they reminisce about days gone by and the ppl the have loved and lost. Were they just like us, sitting with friends on a weekend sharing their week over dinner? Did they know the impact of the generation they were living in would have on their descendants? I am literally lost for words when I go into the war museums and see the artifacts and pics of ppl from back then . They were my age once their whole life ahead of them. And one day I will be in a picture that one of my descendants will see and I hope that they reminisce about the person I might have been.

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  16. mizjayne

    15 years ago I was living in a stable out back of a medical centre in Sydney. I slept in the hayloft up a ladder, had total of 2 power points in the 3 rooms, a gas hob & bottle, a toaster oven, microwave & a cold water tap in the kitchen : read old laundry. My bathroom was an outside loo, a hip bath that I filled with a hose & heated with an electric element, I could watch telly in the bath!. I washed clothes in an old copper with a hand wringer. I used the pay phone & showered in the change rooms of the theatre where i worked every morning.
    And I was never happier. Had I 3 children & a husband, like I do now, it may have been a bit harder, but it was a simpler life that really suited me.

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  17. Renae

    Hell to the no.

    I live in the house that my grandmother (and great grandmother) lived in. I’ve lived here on and off since I was 16… and I have no idea how we survived before the aircon (which hubby and I got 6 years ago when we bought the place). At the moment we only have aircons in the lounge and the bedroom, and the rest of the house is as hot as hell. (the air flow in this house is awful, and it seriously heats up like an oven. It can be up to 10 degrees hotter inside than outside, and when it’s 40+ degrees outside, it’s nasty!). Hubs and I are planning on replacing the two small units with a ducted split system!!
    Before the roof got insulated about 15 years ago, it was even worse.

    I also remember the extremely old oven/cooktop we pulled out and replaced when we moved in. Like Kate said, that thing was off, or hot. The cooktop was awful and the whole thing was a bitch to clean. Give me my multifunction electric oven and ceramic glass cooktop any day!
    I think I would have a hard time living without my food processor. I’m a total klutz, and have been known to accidentally grate my fingers, or accidentally cut myself while using knives, so getting that thing has saved a lot of blood and pain.
    I definitely could be accused of some romanticism about the past though… I bought a Sunbeam mixmaster that looks exactly the same as the one my grandma had, and I love it to pieces ;)

    You also didn’t mention our wonderful hot water systems, Kate. My paternal grandma has told me all kinds of stories about wood-fired “coppers”… I don’t even have to think about my big, electric storage hot water system. I just get up in the morning and turn the shower on and my lovely hot water comes straight out.

    But probably the thing I would not swap, most of all, is the toilet. The old toilet in this place was a scary thing that was so loud when it flushed, and again, bitch to clean! And I have no idea what my great grandma had before this house was built in the 60s!

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    • Me Myself I

      Had to laugh about the wood-copper. We had one when I was little and Mum used to stand in the backyard with a tea towel putting out spot fires that the copper produced while Dad was stoking it. No wonder we all used the same bathwater!!! I bet it didn’t get lit every day.

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  18. Bec

    My Nanna brought me up as my mother died when i was 12 – she was a great story teller, but even she recognised the value and convenience of all our appliances – i might swap a day or two, but i quite like the 21st century with all the mod cons!

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  19. Anonymous

    I think I would swap with my mother’s mother if I could. She used to tell amazing stories about growing up on a farm with all her siblings. She married in her early 20′s. Bought a large block of land with her husband in what is now a very fancy part of Brisbane only about 15 minutes drive from the CBD today. I remember visiting there as a kid in the late 70′s and early 80′s and it was great. Open paddocks across the road, bush out the back, neighbors also on massive blocks. It’s more built up today but still quite pleasant and far nicer than anywhere I can afford to live. They sold the property for millions about 10 years ago now and moved to the country. She had 6 healthy kids. I’m guessing childbirth was probably not fun back then (not that it’s fun now but at least we’re not drugged against our will and tied to beds – I read a book on childbirth that said this happened in Aus). I have 2 kids and would love more but can’t afford it. She stayed home with her kids and her husband worked full-time. She was in charge of everything relating to the kids and home. No she didn’t have air conditioning or a gas BBQ or a fan-forced oven or a dishwasher but I don’t have those either! I’d definitely be willing to trade my food processor, tv, vacuum cleaner and fridge if it meant I could live in an amazing place like she did and stay at home and bring up my 6 kids while my husband was out of the way at work every week and handing over his paycheck every Friday. Haha, the more I think about it the more bitter I feel!

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    • Faybian

      I was born in the 60s and most Australian women weren’t drugged against their will. Yes, it happened, but not to the extent that it did in the US.
      While I think childbirth has been medicalised too much and the caesar rate is ridiculous, childbirth IS safer these days.

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    • Anonymous

      I live on a beautiful property with my husband and 2 kids, 450 acres 15mins from the beach and 20mins to the closest town. The property is worth millions if we were to ever sell. However we have had to WORK VERY HARD to get it. I look after all the finances, children and household chores (plus work on the farm and at the moment a town job as well because $$ are tough). My husband works all week (7 days per week, 16hrs per day). It’s not as romantic as you think. We are farmers and don’t have air con etc… because we can’t afford it. My husband hands me all the money but I have to work out how to make it strech to cover all our expenses- not run around spending it on what I like. I could have 6 kids if I wanted, however I would still have to do all the other jobs I have- my husband doesn’t have time off when our kids are born- it’s back from hospital and he’s off to work and I’m back to looking after all the kids and cooking dinner etc… You don’t often get the 50′s life-style, house etc… and have a husband who is around to help out and all of the other luxuries of city/suburban life. You don’t get to pick and chose which parts you want and don’t want. A lot of the time I think people with 9-5 jobs, a regular income, just a mortgage as their major debt are the lucky ones.

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  20. Debbie

    Nope – I like being able to go to University and not feeling like I’m defective because I’m 29 and unmarried

    My Grandma rocks, but I love the 21st century thank you very much

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  21. lozzie

    My nan passed away before I was born but I prefer my life now.

    I like that I can work and work school hours.

    I LOVE my dishwasher, sandwich maker and hair dryer.

    I would like to live without the tv, ipods, laptops etc etc.

    But I’m glad we have mamamia

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  22. Guest

    YES, YES, YES AND YES. I would love to swap lives. Life so much simpler and as for appliances to do all the hard work for me now – I wonder if I didnt have them how much I would save on exercise equipment?? I could be home with my children cooking and baking… not at work and feeling guity.
    I’m sure it wouldnt be all roses but neither is my life today. I look back on my gran and they seem happier.

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  23. Rach the Muso

    As much as I admire(d) both my grandmothers, I wouldn’t swap with them!

    My maternal grandmother, Nanna, grew up outside of Yorkshire. When I watch Downton Abbey now, cousin Violet reminds me of her – an amazing combination of wit, stubbornness and Victorian upbringing. I definitely inherited the stubbornness!

    She travelled to Australia in 1956 with my grandad and my mum as an 18mo. It took 6 months, and my mum was seasick the whole time – imagine! I still have my nanna’s Husqvarna sewing machine which has a date of 1956 in the manual, so she must have purchased it immediately. And I still use it! So I would at least have that. Despite her stiff-upper-lip upbringing, Nanna seemed to keep with the trends, wearing pants certainly since my mum was a girl, always having the most practical things needed to be self-sufficient. She was an awesome baker. But she had so many medical problems. Everything that could have been removed (appendix, tonsils, reproductive organs, gall bladder, etc) had been. She was born with only one functioning kidney, and went into renal failure within her last decade. She suffered severe endometriosis (something else I inherited), but still managed to have two kids. If she had been born today, a lot of her problems wouldn’t have become the issues they did.

    My paternal grandma raised four kids by herself in the 50s. She brought them to Australia (from England) in the late 60s. She lived in a shack next to a railway station, which later was repossessed by the Railways commission, which they compensated her poorly for. My dad and his older brother had to leave school early to support the family, although they both went on to lead extremely successful careers. She always had it rough, but never complained, and she is now in late stages of MND.

    My grandmothers were amazing, but some aspects of their lives would have been vastly different with today’s technology, so I can’t imagine swapping with either of them!

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  24. gabbie

    I was only thinking about this yesterday!
    I’m a curious and inquisitive person by nature – and consequently also an aspiring anthropologist – and I absolutely wish more than anything that I could ‘go back in time’ and live in the 30′s, 40′s, 50′s, etc. It would be so incredibly interesting to not only see what life was like, but to live it. The culture was different, everything was so different to how we know it today. It would be a wonderful adventure and learning experience!

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  25. Lulu

    My Nana (dad’s mother) lived to the age of 94. I suspect she didn’t miss old-timey medicine – her own mother had died when she was a baby.

    My Oma (mom’s mother) passed down a set of family baking recipes which have to be seen to be believed. Some of them involve much beating of eggs, yet they date from a time before electric mixers & beaters. I think she must have loved her hand mixer when she got one.

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  26. distracted

    In terms of appliances? Hell yes! No problems swapping with my grandmother. I don’t own or need an icemaker, sandwich press, food processor OR dishwasher. I can learn to live without an air conditioner, and have lived without a washing machine in the past for 6 months.

    BUT in terms of society, heck no I would not want to swap. Women were still treated very much as the possessions of men in my grandmother’s day. We had almost no career opportunities. Science was in its infancy – antibiotics hadn’t been discovered and vaccines were just beginning to be developed. 99.5% of population had no idea what ‘genes’ were. Life was ruled by the church and if you aborted or had a baby out of wedlock, you were going to hell on earth even if you didn’t believe in an actual hell.

    So eff the sandwich press, but I’d really like to keep women’s rights and medicine!

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  27. Anna

    My gran was a mum in post war Communist Poland. If I were her, I think I’d miss having food on the shelves most. Closely followed by toilet paper, regular electricity and water, and then stuff like freedom of speech and elections.

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  28. Violet

    Kate, your articles are rarely relevant to me (I’m a single, child free twenty something), but by golly gosh I love your writing. So down to earth, so accessible, and always so funny. Has been great to see you popping up more on MM lately and I look forward to much more.

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    • Kate Hunter

      Thanks Violet. It’s nice to be here more :-)

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    • Zelda

      Agree with Violet, Kate. I think you’re fab!

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  29. Mel

    I’d swap for sure! I suppose it makes a difference how much money you have. I dont have airconditioning, dishwasher or sandwich maker (lack of space). So the idea of lower cost of living, lower expectations and more time for the simple things, sounds very appealing :)

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  30. Bradley

    I’m just imagining my Grandmother running about with a Karcher in her hands ! I can just see her water blasting shit from pillar to post and back again. :)

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  31. TDMJ

    I know we’re supposed to comment on the topic here and not the *idea* of sponsored posts, but can I just say, this probably the best example of a sponsored post I’ve seen in a long time.

    It actually has the feel of an interesting topic and storyline, in which the sponsor has a commercial interest; rather than a flimsy and dull topic that has tenuous links at best and reads more like a lengthy ad.

    Good one MM and Karcher :-)

    x TDMJ

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    • distracted

      I agree, and thank you MM for putting the ‘sponsored post’ message up the top. I always feel a bit cheated when it only appears at the end, this is way better :)

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  32. Grace

    I have a computer, an iPad and an iPhone. Sometimes I use all three at once and I love it. That said – sometimes I wish just reading a book would be enough for me.

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  33. Bella

    My hair straightener. I went away for the weekend and forgot to take it and, well, it was a tough, frizzy, few days.

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  34. vivacious

    No way.

    My Dad’s mother (Maya) grew up in a rich family in Vienna. She lived a very luxurious childhood and was too small to remember WWI. But by WWII she was in love with a Jew – my grandfather. They fled Europe leaving everything behind, arriving in Australia with only $100 in their pocket. From a life of luxury she had to forge a hard life in Australia. She eventually married my grandfather, had 3 kids and had a very successful career including being responsible for organising to bring many of the refugees, particularly from concentration camps, out to Australia after the war. But she never felt at home in Australia and when she went back to Europe to visit it had changed and was no longer her home either. She didn’t feel like she had a comfortable home ever after she left Vienna the first time.

    My Mum’s Mum (Oma) had just got married when WWII broke out. They lived in Germany under constant fear of being bombed, starving, or having my grandfather conscripted or arrested as he was a bit too vocal in his anti-nazi views. After the war they were in Eastern Germany and the Russians wanted to take my grandfather to Russia because of his exertise in printing so they fled with only a suitcase each. They first went to India where my Mum was born, then came to Australia where they lived a very megre life for many years while my Mum was young. Oma worked hard all her life and just as it seemed things would be easy and they could retire, my grandfather had a massive stroke and Oma then dedicated the next more than 20 years to nursing him.

    Both of my grandmother’s had amazing, brave, pioneering lives. But would I swap with them, hell no. I hope like anything I never have to go through the terror of war like they did.

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    • Anonymous

      What an amazing pair of women your grandmothers must be.

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      • vivacious

        Yup, they were pretty amazing and to be honest, my grandfathers were equally amazing, if not more so. If you are interested, my Mum writes a blog about what it was like growing up with them. She has just written a whole series about the flats where they lived which were as close to being a slum as you can get, certainly completely illegal dwelling. It is really interesting: http://am-i-old-yet.blogspot.com.au/

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        • Anonymous

          enjoying the blog, thanks. laughed out loud at the budgie smugglers not smuggling the budgies too well bit.

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