Men can have babies at almost any age. Women? Not so much. Our most fertile years are before we turn 35. And for some women, these years can get sucked up by a ‘vampire’ man, who has no intention of committing long term.
Author and blogger Sam de Brito wrote a strong column about the jerky men who exploit womens’ fertile year, with often devastating consequences. He writes:
Tell me you don’t know this woman: she started seeing a guy when she was 28 or 32 and the dude said he wanted to get married and have kids, but the time wasn’t right.
They had some fun, moved in together, but he had issues in his 30s (don’t we all) and she was right there beside him, waiting for him to turn the corner.
And he did. Except, when he got there, he decided the relationship ”wasn’t working” and the woman found herself single again at 35 or 38 and was now staring at the possibility that she would never have children.
Yes, yes, we do know that woman. We all do. She’s the one who has spent a decade waiting for her boyfriend to be ‘ready’ and when he finally does decide that he too wants a family – he wants that family with someone else.
And he can do that. Because he’s a bloke.
At age 40 he’s perfectly able to father children but for her it is going to be a whole lot harder if not impossible.
Biology means the playing field is intrinsically unfair – men get a biological gift of more time to sort out their issues and figure out what they want from life. Women don’t have that luxury.
De Britto calls these men vampires – because they literally suck away the fertile years of women’s lives.
He writes:
Sam de Brito
They’re the human equivalent of the morning-after pill because while you’re with them, you’re actually ensuring you will never become a parent and experience what is quite possibly the greatest thing that can happen to you – staring into your child’s eyes.
This is how it breaks down. You meet this guy when you’re 27, you think it’s on forever and ever, amen. Maybe, early in the piece, he thinks the same way, but at some point you become his backstop, his insurance policy, and if someone ”better” comes along he is goooone.
You could argue the guy just didn’t want kids – blah, blah – except these dudes always seem to impregnate the next (much younger) woman, about a year after dumping their long-suffering, long-term girlfriend.
Have you been with a man or do you know a man who put off ‘settling down’ for years?
Comments
211 Comments so far
This was me! How true. He was also an emotional vampire.
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I’m a bit torn by this story, I guess I could be considered the younger new girlfriend that a guy had a baby with quite quickly after a break up…
My partner was in a relationship with his ex for 12 years and married for 7 – they got divorced when they were in their mid to late 30′s.
When we met we discussed kids, and he was adamant he did not want kids, did not want to get married again and was even reluctant to admit when his feelings towards me became serious.
I was much younger, at 24 I wasn’t that concerned with babies and marriage, I wasn’t even sure I wanted kids at that point and after my own horrid break up was happy to be casual. In my own plan I had wanted kids in my late 20′s but still considered I would have time.
After about six months, out of the blue, he sat me down and said he loved me and wanted to marry me – he told me he couldn’t believe it but he couldn’t think of anything greater than having a child with me. He completely changed his view.
We now have 2 beautiful children and have been together 9 years, it still feels like the honeymoon period.
I guess from his ex’s point of view he may have stolen her most fertile years – but they were horrible together. A child born into that relationship would have cause everyone involved misery.
I think a lot of people feel compelled to get married and have children because they feel they must. As many people have said, communication is the key, many women get stuck thinking the guy will ‘grow up’ or change his mind, but a lot of the time, that is just who they are. They wont accept what they are hearing, they pretend not to notice how disinterested he may be even if he doesn’t come out and say ‘No’.
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I am sorry, but if you are only staying with a guy to have kids with him and then he dumps you, he is doing the right thing.
seriously ladies, grow a pair. don’t put up with second best, don’t play the game the way guys do. stick to your own morals and values and find someone who matches that rather than hanging onto some guy because you are too scared to be alone. there are worse things in the world than being 40 and single.
yours,
miss 35
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I too have been the victim of a fertility vampire. I met him when I was 27. Within the first month of meeting we discussed children and marriage and he said he was up for both. I was in no hurry and nor was he. He had 2 small kids and a messy divorce on his hands to deal with. Somehow I managed to let 11 years go by (I was an idiot!) without getting married or having children with him. I did however move in with him (which in hindsight was a mistake). He lead me on all this time and I was an idiot to believe things would work out.
I was really seeing my reproductive years were coming to an end as I was 38. By this stage he was clinically depressed and seeing a counsellor and not ready to have a child due to his issues. He said he wanted to sort himself out and that he’d marry me. He never got around to asking me to marry him though. I dumped him when I turned 40 as I was fed up. I tried the dating scene, RSVP etc, but didn’t meet anyone decent. The men I met actually made my ex look like a god in comparison! So I am now a very attractive 43 year old, childless, single lady. I’d never have imagined this is how my life would be at my age. I’ve had to deal with the painful reality of my situation. So ladies let that be a warning. Get clear up front and then give yourself a timeframe for him to pop the question and get the babymaking happening otherwise you may wind up childless and single. Of course there are benefits to being childless and single (which I’m making the most of which my mummy friends are envious of!) but it is not the ideal life I thought I would have.
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I moved from Perth to Victoria be with my ex but only after months of him telling me he loved me and talking about our future together. A week after I got here he said he didn’t think it would work out because he wanted to live in Darwin all of a sudden. I hope he gets what’s coming to him. Luckily I only lost a year to this scumbag and I am still in my mid 20s. It happens even when you think your eyes are wide open.
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Sometimes you honestly think you’ll change. It’s not intentional to string someone along. When you met you said you weren’t ready and you hope and think that will change. When it doesn’t you let them go because that’s the kinder thing to do. And then one day it does change and you want kids too for all the right reasons. And so you have them. With someone new.
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And fair enough too… Sometimes the more you learn about a person, the less you want to be with them. This isn’t because you are mean, its because the two of you are incompatible and it is not always fair to bring up a child in that environment.
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So men’s feelings don’t matter and these women are *owed* a man’s seed if he changes his mind about wanting children?
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wow, the things open communication can solve. It’s really disrespectful to treat people who don’t want children this way. To think you’ll “change someones mind” on such a deeply rooted PERSONAL level….and then accuse these men of “stealing” fertility?
Bullshit, you were a weak woman who was too lazy to find THE RIGHT PERSON TO BE IN A RELATIONSHIP WITH….your bad for thinking you can shape the life of another human being rather than SHARING YOUR LIVES TOGETHER ON THE SAME PATH!! .
You do know you can get this one out in the open by the 5th date right? Communication, is it a new concept to you?
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I think his point was the vampires are the men who say they want it and with you but it just never seems to be ‘the right time’ and the woman gets stuck into thinking this is something they will do together if she just respects his position. Yes, in this scenario she has to take some responsibility for allowing her fertile years to be swallowed up in waiting, but it doesn’t mean a man who does this to his long term partner is not a self absorbed and immature twat.
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“…and the dude said he wanted to get married and have kids” – THIS is the scenario mentioned, not some bizarre one that you’ve made up so that you can have a rant about women who are “weak” and “too lazy”.
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Aaaaand I’m once again glad I don’t want kids.
Ladies, if he says he doesn’t want kids but you do…don’t assume he’ll “change his mind” end it while you can. Don’t blame it on him.
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Whatever happened to being responsible for your own decisions? I am sorry but with these men, there are signs. The uncommitted man WILL NOT COMMIT no matter how hard you try and change them. The same goes for a female… when they are ready they will…
I dated a commitment-phobe and was so glad when it ended and I am now finally engaged to a man that is straight with me and we both know and agree with what we want for our future.
Strangely though…I am now the one that is delaying children….
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It goes the other way too. My partner told me on our second date that he wouldn’t hesitate to have children with someone like me.
That’s pretty compelling stuff when you’re almost 37.
Jumped in too fast. If we’d done it the traditional way and got to know each other for a few years, the honeymoon period (and there was one, BIG time) would have well and truly worn off and I would have left).
Two children later and 43 years old, I think I’m with the wrong man.
Delighted to have my girls though and if we split, I have all the time in the world to find someone new to spend my grey years with.
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I see this happening to a couple friend of mine – they’ve been together for 7 years, he won’t marry her until she “gives” him children, they’ve fallen pregnant twice in the last 5 years and it has unfortunately ended in miscarriage…yet he makes absolutely know effort on his part to help their fertility, still eating crap, smoking and taking recreational drugs :-/ This is painful to see her fertile time ticking away with this moron…I know when he was with his ex-wife he had less than optimal sperm analysis results…I’m never sure if it’s my place to disclose this or not…
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It may not be your place, but she has a right to know, especially if she’s going through miscarriages and he refuses to marry her until she ‘gives’ him children (WTF?!). I would tell her.
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your friend sounds like she could use some backbone…and out of this relationship….
It is such an obviously bad situation….will someone please be the adult here? Be a friend and tell her she needs to ditch him and spend time to herself to grow as a person….a kid is obviously not going to FIX something that’s FUCKED.
The stupidity…it hurts….
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Well done Sam De Brito for such an up front blog. However while these men may be sucking the fertile years from women, it’s a woman’s choice to hang out and wait for him to turn the corner.
) to find a man who wont suck away your fertile years.
I think if your man is still trying to “find himself” and you know want you want perhaps let him “discover” himself as a singleton while you also maximise your opportunity (hedge your bets
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This kinda reminds me of ‘starter’ marriages.
The first marriage fails in your 20s or early 30s with no kids, only to remarry again and have kids with the second husband (almost straight away too).
Although, I’m no expert; I’ve never had one.
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I dont believe that a man cant take your fertility away from you.
You have to be responsible for your own fertitlity and walk away from a relationship that is not heading in that direction. It takes guts to walk away, it is much easier to wait, but waiting and not talking about it means you are wasting time.
I watched a friend of mine do this to his older girlfriend and I was amazed at her gumption to walk away from him at 35 when he wouldnt move forward with their relationship. After watching her leave he realised what an idiot he was being and they are now married with two beautiful children.
She taught me a great lesson. When I was in my late 20s and had been with my partner for a few years I brought up the subject. I told him that I didnt want to be dating him into my 30s to have him decide that he didnt want to get married and have kids with me. I didnt give him an ultimatum but we both new that at some point in the future I would walk away, so what ever issues he felt he needed to work through, he had to start working through them.
There is no magic time to bring it up, but once you have started to talk about it, if you both arent heading in the same direction, you have to start to think about your fertility and put that first.
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I love this, recently there have been many articles (sorry can’t quote- but in both the age and herald sun) discussing how women are being perceived as selfish due to the fact that they are choosing to have children later in life- it frustrates me that (until now) there is a lack of dicussion around the reason that a women may make the choice to have a baby later in life may due to her man ‘not being quite ready yet’ – I haven’t read all the comments so my apologies if this point has already been made
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There doesn’t seem to be a ‘like’ button, but I totally agree. Very little talk of men being ‘selfish’.
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You think women who wait to have kids have it bad being called selfish?
Try being childfree.
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Love this too. And, sadly, we need to hear it more often from men. Not the ‘nagging wedding hungry’ women. I’m glad my version ended with me pregnant and having the child alone after 6 years with the father-to-be. There are quite a few of us with the opt-out partners in our fertile years sho then become opt-out dads.
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I love this piece. Penelope Trunk wrote something along the same lines a while back – that if women are serious about a husband and family then they will prioritize that over everything else in their 20s, to avoid the problem of infertility later one. She was pretty heavily criticized but from my experience, it is so true. I have lots of beautiful, successful friends in their mid-thirties who have had relationship after relationship that didn’t end in commitment and are now looking at a life without children and family.
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I was 33 when I met my now husband (over 40 years old). He had been married previously with 2 kids. On our first date I asked him whether he would ever get married again and have more kids. He said yes to marriage, no to kids. After 6 weeks, I asked him the kids question again. This time he said, yes he would be open to more children. He often asks me what would have happened if he had said no and I say very matter of factly that I would have shown him the door. I had invested too much time with previous boyfriends who “weren’t sure about having a family”. I knew what I wanted and wasn’t going to settle for second best. We now have a beautiful 9 month old baby and he doesn’t regret it for a second.
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*sigh!! I wish I was you! I am 32 – so maybe it will be soon.
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Keep the faith. Sending you positive vibes. Also check out Cosmic Love by Yasmin Boland.
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Read the column on Sunday. good on you Sam for speaking out so strongly.
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What a great article! I know of a few women this has happened/is happening to.
I also nearly ended up in this situation myself & I’m thankful everyday that I got out in time. Marriage & babies was always an ‘off limits’ topic of discussion – after 5 years together he admitted we could be together for another 5 years & he still might not want marriage & babies. So we called it a day.
When I met my current partner we had the marriage & babies discussion in the first two months or so & we’re now planning to try fora baby next year
As for the ex? He met someone not long after we broke up – word on the street is that 4 years later they are living together but he still doesn’t know what he wants!
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My story:
Met a man who was obsessed with having a family – wife, kids, settling down, the works.. fell in love and definitely thought he was The One,he was great with kids and seemed pretty stable though there was always a niggling question as to why he had never been married ever eventhough he was almost 40.
The 14 year-age gap between us also had me dragging my feet slightly as I still wanted to do heaps of things before having kids but felt that this guy was definitely the perfect guy to be the father of my children and my husband.
Got married and fast forward a year into the marriage, problems start appearing in the marriage, not just regarding children. He was immature, unstable and extremely controlling, and despite me coming round to the idea of finally wanting kids (and soon!), turns out that he himself is a big kid and was in no way capable of being a stable father or husband to me or any kids we might have.
Finally found the answer to the niggling question as to why he had never married the hard way, as I was the sucker who fell for it and married him, and now, we’re finally divorced, I cant help but feel extremely sad and clucky when I see babies. Doesnt help that all my friends are settling down at the speed of light and suddenly, not only do I feel left behind, but having gone back a page, having to deal with the heartbreak and baggage left from the divorce. I am in no way ready to even contemplate another relationship, but the thought that I might end up alone without kids or a partner in the future does make me panic sometimes.
Most of the other guys I have come across prior to and since this relationship, are only after short-term no strings attached types of relationships, which frankly is not for me..Definitely sending a shoutout to the universe for some decent honest mature and stable men to bump into!
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“You could argue the guy just didn’t want kids – blah, blah – except these dudes always seem to impregnate the next (much younger) woman, about a year after dumping their long-suffering, long-term girlfriend.”
Stats please. The plural of anecdote is not data.
(Was this really written by Sam or his creative writer sister?)
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I can think of 3 in my circle of friends without even trying too hard. It happens.
Then there’s the female friend who’s partner wants kids but refuses to get married. She’s 50/50 on wanting kids at all and has always said she won’t even consider having kids until she is married. Their impasse (also known as ‘So, apparently I’m not good enough to have kids with’ ‘Well, apparently I’m not good enough for you to marry.’ ) has lasted 12 years and counting.
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I know 3 too. Its really common.
And I would never have kids with someone who wasnt prepared to marry me first either. My friend has a boyfriend who has a child with his ex partner, who he didnt marry because he said she wasnt the one!
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Met quite a few timewasting vampires in my time too – thankfully I never dated any of them. But I felt for my friends who did…
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Unfortunately, I know of a few that this has happened to as well. The real kicker is that they ALWAYS seem to be quite a bit younger!
In the worst case, my friend and her partner were three months from their wedding date, having just built their dream home in which they wanted to raise a family. He came home from work one day and told her he didn’t want kids and was leaving.
Cue dramas over selling the house (in 2008) and having to tell all of their guests that the wedding was off.
Five months later, he had impregnated a 17 year old. They’ve since married and have a second child on the way. He still drinks too much every weekend and drives a pimped out Lancer with child seats in the back.
My friend dodged a bullet there, and thankfully, she knows it.
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Got together at 30, split up 34 back together at 36, my partner concerned we were not ready for added strain of kids. I booked us into counseling and now we have beloved daughter but she took two years to concieve so I was 38. Now trying to have second, another two years of trying – do not delay – if there is uncertainty – try counseling to clarify both your positions and early enough so that you’re not bitter if the right decision is to break it off!
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Oh my goodness!!!! That’s exactly what happened to me.. If only I knew then what I know now… I would’ve been out of that relationship in a flash or never have entered it in the first place.. This article made me cry.. I’m now 40. Would love to have had children..
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Sending love to you xx
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Are you sure you can rule that out physically (a child) at 40?
Because there is always the option of a donor and single motherhood if you think you could handle it, if you can still carry. Just a thought before you close the door for once and for all. There’s a great blog on the topic called Bumpy road to Bubba’ – and the writer / mamma posts on here from time to time.
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Hi Kelly, I met my now husband when I was just about to turn 39, we had our first baby when I was 40 and second at 42. Both naturally conceived, healthy pregnancies and bubbas. I would love to have started a family earlier in life, but that was the way it turned out for me, so don’t think it’s too late.
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Oh, I feel for you. I agree with the other comments – would you consider having a child by yourself? My sister had her first one at 42 (a happy mistake!). I am having my first child at 40 (not by choice – my husband has his own fertility issues).
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How soon is too soon to bring this up with a guy? I’m 25 and have been with my boyfriend for 9 months. I don’t want to lose time, but I feel like it’s still too soon to have the baby talk! Is a year an okay amount of time to wait before discussing it??
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I’m 23 and I brought it up quite early on in my current relationship of 4 years! My mum is a women’s health specialising GP and she drummed it into me that it was important to plan IF you wanted kids so that it didn’t get too late. She had seen many many 35+ women struggle to conceive and undergo expensive procedures like IVF.
I worked back from how many kids I wanted (3) by an age (about 35) – I’d like them fairly close together and would like to be a youngish mum so my age to start is about 28. I’m not rigid though.
People around our age will probably be with someone for at least 2 years before we decide to commit (whether marriage or not). Usually kids come after.
Think about what to say, but I think it’s important to bring up – it was interesting to hear my boyfriend’s perspective about how many kids he would like, and how he wants to raise them etc. Talking about this kind of thing can really help you guys figure out if you’re compatible long-term, and if not, you might be wasting your time!
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Good advice. I left my boyfriend at 24 after being with him for 4 years knowing it was never going to move beyond dating. I wanted kids before I was 30 and marriage before having kids was my priority and knew I had to leave enough time to get out there and meet people. I ran into him not long after I got engaged and he asked me out and said he made a mistake and wanted a second chance. It was much too late and I think he only wanted me because I was with someone else. I got married at 27 and had my first baby at 29.
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I brought it up on the first date (which came after the one-night-stand). No way I was going to start a proper relationship with someone who didn’t want marriage and kids. He wanted marriage and kids too, so we both knew we were in the relationship to find out if each other was the one we wanted to settle down with.
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Discussing what you want from life, not just in reference to children, should come before you fully commit. That could be at 9 months or 3 years, depending on your relationship.
Keep in mind that you don’t necessarily have to agree on three kids and a cavity brick home with green curtains by age 30. As your relationship evolves, your plans and desires for the future are likely to evolve with it.
As long as you’re both heading in the same direction, you should take the time to enjoy the journey, not just the destination.
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Green curtains?! GREEN?!?! Ewww!! Nope, sorry. I need to know that information upfront – if he is admamant about having green curtains (what the?) it isn’t going to work!!! lol (**sarcasm**)
Also – loving Adam Sandler’s fart-humour films is a deal breaker.
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9 months, are you serious! I think in the first 2 or 3 months is reasonable (probably not first date). If a guy is incapable of having that kind of discussion you probably don’t want him as father to your kids. My wife and I spoke about it early in relationship, we now have 2 with another on the way.
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you should be able to have this convo by the time you both fully commit to each other-ie; when you go from dating to partners. Some couples are still ‘dating’ after one year, others feel they are partners after a month, it’s very personal. I had this talk very early with my husband, but it was easy as we were both on the same path-if he makes it hard for you to bring up or deflects the conversation, it may be a sign he isn’t ready, and if it is a deal breaker for you, you may need to push the topic to get a clear discussion happening . Good luck x
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oh wow…. this is so true it hurts.
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I know women who’ve been in this exact situation, some were married. Their husbands kept saying they weren’t ready for kids but then eventually left them and had children with new partners.
I do feel they were treated very unfairly. It can be heartbreaking to find yourself unexpectedly single when your biological clock is running out.
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Yep, this exact thing happened to a (married) friend of mine. It’s so tough.
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I am in two minds about this topic…on one hand I can completely understand the ‘vampire’ theory and I think we all need to communicate what we want clearly in a relationship to make sure both partners are in sync with one another and what they want for the future.
On the other hand,my concern is that some women might be throwing away relationships that don’t fit their timelines. Just because your life doesn’t go exactly how you planned it doesn’t mean you won’t be happy or achieve all te thigs you desire.
I guess everyone’s different,but I for one want to live I the moment and focus on being in a healthy,happy relationship that is based on trust and shared values rather than finding a man that fits my idealized time frame for my life.
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I believe the answer is to set a somewhat fixed timeframe for when you both will want children and if either has changed their mind when the set point in time comes around, then it might be an idea to examine the reasons more in depth and then take the continuance of the relationship from there.
I see your point, but believe that relationships must be open enough for partners to admit their wants in the relationship.
I’m five years older than my husband, and luckily he accepted that it was time for me to get started at 32 eventhough he probably wasn’t really ready. Having seen a few tv shows about older women having complications because of their age certainly helped
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Last week I broke up with my ex boyfriend (who is 4 years younger than me) because he did not want kids ‘for at least 4 years’… I’m 32 now and don’t want to wait that long. He didnt even want to discuss the possibility of having children sooner despite him knowing that our age gap is quite an issue…
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People (not just men) should be up front about this from the beginning.
I’m a female, in my mid twenties, and I’ve ended several relationships early on because he wanted children in the (albeit distant) future and I definitely do not.
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I agree if the guy’s deliberately avoiding the subject or worse, being misleading about wanting kids/marriage.
You can’t automatically claim he was a vampire if you’re in your 30′s and a relationship doesn’t work out before you get your kids.
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Silly women who waste precious time with men that wont commit. Be prepared to live a life with a couple of cats….
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I feel your empathy…
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Again, why are these women silly for stickin around? Its suggesting that unsure men are these viscious pre determined arseholes- when you cant do anything about your situation until youre ready. No one goes on a date thinking theyre going to get married and have kids without seeing if the relationship is going to go somewhere first. Those are the silly women/men who beleive its a done deal before the first bottle on the first date is over. You cant have kids to satisfy one persons needs. Thats silly and crazy to suggest.
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Again, why are these women silly for stickin around? Its suggesting that unsure men are these viscious pre determined arseholes- when you cant do anything about your situation until youre ready. No one goes on a date thinking theyre going to get married and have kids without seeing if the relationship is going to go somewhere first. Those are the silly women/men who beleive its a done deal before the first bottle on the first date is over. You cant have kids to satisfy one persons needs. Thats silly and crazy to suggest.
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Anonymous, the story you relayed is our story. My husband and I both wanted marriage and kids. We liked each other A LOT. We got married eight months after we got together. We have been married 12 years. Our story is not the norm but it can happen.
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Of my close soclal group I have 2 great examples. One lost 3 years to a manpire and she’s sooooo cross with herself as she’s almost 36 and tho she’s just started dating another fellow she’s quite ‘burned’ so she’s going pretty gently gently. One the other hand, whilst we all watched, counselled and in the last year flat out told her to leave him as he wasn’t ever going to change a girlfriend learnt and when she started to have those discussions with her man and was getting nowhere she asked flat out do you want to have a baby in the next year – he listed all sorts of lamo excuses so she broke up with him, moved out and started dating almost immediately.
So for one dear friends loss and sacrifice another dear friend learnt.
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Am I the only one whose every single partner has tried to turn into octomum? It’s like I’m attracting baby makers. I had to have the reverse talk with my current partner because I’m done, I’m never having another child again, and he’s a bit younger and thought he could harrass me into a third pregnancy which is definitely not happening…..He has given up now (even saying that he won’t be looking for a more accomodating womb cause he wants to stay with me which is a good sign) but I feel like I’ve been fending off pregnancies my whole life, had I listened to them i’d have 10 kids by now!! (I’m 35). My gene pool isn’t even that attractive , with the autism thing going on there, unless it’s the new “it” gene pool, and guys are trying to breed a whole new generation of geeks…..No idea.
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Sometimes, no matter how mindful of the future you think you’ve been, you still don’t always get what you want.
Exhibit A – I got out of a going-nowhere relationship when I was 25 because I knew I wanted a family. Found and married the right guy at 29, feeling right on track…until we found out he doesn’t have good sperm…still trying and hoping, but the odds aren’t great.
Exhibit B – My clucky mate married a long-term friend in her mid 30s – he seemed like a great choice. Until he cheated and got another woman pregnant. By the time she finished grieving, she felt she’d left it too late to start fresh with a new guy.
It’s definitely important to lay your cards on the table, I feel. It doesn’t have to be presented as an ultimatum, but I think it’s ok to be frank about these things.
It seems like sometimes guys (and probably some women, too) don’t realise how common fertility issues are. I’ve had quite a few friends who say their boyfriends and husbands seem to just assume that babies happen as soon as you stop trying to prevent it. I guess it’s because we all spend our fertile teens and twenties paranoid about it happening…
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I agree.
While it’s worth being smart, it’s impossible to control everything. Just because you get married, or even get married and have kids, doesn’t necessarily mean you’re going to live happily ever after.
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He has cheated on you? He has made it clear that you are not the one for him?
And you are still with him? Don`t you deserve better than that?
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PS The biggest lesson I learned out of this and other experiences in my 30s: take account of his actions, not his words. Words are cheap, and in the end, they mean very little. Actions are the thing that tell you what he really wants/feels/intends. Playing back in your head all the words of love/commitment when he’s gone just drives you crazy. PS And just to add another view, I didn’t get kids, but am now in my 40s and finally in a very happy relationship. I would much rather have a great relationship than kids, so perhaps that was just the journey I had to go on to be able to have the relationship I now have. Yes, I would love to have had both, but life is about enjoying what you do have, not forever lamenting the mistakes that made. Perhaps it’s all just a learning curve, and we should stop pushing to the next generation of women that kids are the be all and end all. If they take it too much to heart they might end up choosing the wrong relationships in their mad rush not to miss out.
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Agree with this. All of it. Hand on heart, I can say I’d rather have the happy relationship without the kids than the other way round.
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Me too.
I’d rather have a great relationship and no kids than kids and a crap relationship.
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I agree that actions count more than words. My ex was effusive in his declarations of love… but was never present for me (physically or emotionally). It took me 11 years to figure it out – worst spent years of my life !! My advice for young(er) girls out there: find a guy who shows you how much you mean to him in little ways not the guy who makes a song and dance about it.
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B I N G O ! Your advice is so spot on I’m buzzing. Actually buzzing!
A man can tell you repeatedly: yes, love you, love kids, want a big family, soon as possible etc etc… but ask yourself – if he wants that so very much, like he tells me – what is he DOING to make it happen? How is he contributing to obtaining that goal ASAP?
It is no different than those seducers who get loads of women into bed by whispering in women’s ears flattering and romantic fluff that they want to hear, and hey presto… they’re in your bed! Relationship timewasters are just a more sustained version of that, and more painful actually. It is hard, because we *so* want to believe the beautiful words and promises. But promises are not tangible commitments. Just remember – you are worth a man’s efforts; so find the RIGHT one.
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Please, please, please get off that sinking ship! Even if you don’t care about having children, have enough self-respect to not be someone’s insurance policy. I don’t know you but I know you deserve better than that. Everyone does.
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Well I met my husband when I was 27 and we became serious quite quickly and I told him right from the start that I wanted my first baby before I turned 30 (my great aunt was unable to have kids so I was always abit paranoid) I just wanted to put it out there so I would know whether he was on the same page or whether I needed a new book! Didn’t want to waste my time with someone who didn’t want the same thing and we now have 3 gorgeous boys and I am 37 and just been diagnosed as going into early menopause so I am so thankfull that I made the decisions that I did, if I had of waited it could of been devastating.
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Does the same apply if you are a woman “sucking the life” out of a man? I am 5 yrs younger than my 39yrold guy and whilst he points out every happy looking family every sunday morning, i avoid the subject and point at lunch instead so as to not highlight the fact im not there yet as i dont want to upset him because i know he is. Im not doing it on purpose as its suggested here, im doing it because the reality is i still feel like a baby myself. So why set him up for disappointment but oohing and ahhing over something that i might never be able to give him? I hope to change my mind- thats why i dont let him go. Im sure thats why guys in the reverse situation do it to. You cant rush what is meant to happen whether youre a guy or a woman.
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Please give him to the rest of us. You are hogging him ‘in case’.
He’s ready yesterday…. soooo not fair!
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Yes, you kind of are doing the same thing in reverse. However, if you decide to have kids at 42, he will be able to, but it may be a lot harder for you.
Stop dodging his fairly pointed comments and tell him what you feel. It’s not fair on him if he wants to be a father. He may actually choose you over kids anyway, but either way you don’t know and you can’t compromise on a baby.
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You’re not dumb
woman are just tend to think of others before themselves.
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What was stopping these ladies from leaving?
I believe that it is unfair just to blame the man when every women know there is such as thing as a fertility clock. I know that I will bring on heat for this but in my opinion it is like a drunk crashing their car and blaming the bartender. It takes two to tango.
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I don’t understand your analogy at all. In some situations you have the man saying he really does want marriage and kids one day etc etc. You may call the woman naive (for daring to trust her partner, how awful of her) but it’s absolutely nothing like a drunk crashing their car and blaming the bartender!
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What stops you leaving is ironically the biological clock – you’ve invested so much already, you think he’s nearly there and will get there eventually, you love him, you don’t want to start all over again. Rarely in these cases is it clear cut – most girls are not foolish enough to stay with someone who isn’t offering them some hope, some sense that he does love them, does want a shared future. If it were clear cut, yes, it would be easy to leave. But mostly, it isn’t. Hence the problem, and shock, and anger, if and when he does leave and then, hey presto, finds a younger model to have babies with. I am far from a doormat, and I have been in this position.And, ironically, I have a girlfriend whose partner would never marry her, said he had an issue with it. They were together for nearly ten years before he relented and started trying for a baby. They are together still, three babies later, although still not married. So there are also examples, plenty of them, where hanging in there does get the woman what she wants.
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Perfect response. It is rarely clear cut at all!
I too have been in a similar situation – and I can vouch first hand for the fact that walking away from someone who is promising you marriage and babies (when they are the things you want most!) is INCREDIBLY difficult.
It’s so easy to say ‘noone made her stay’ or whatever…but yes, there is often hope involved and LOVE as well! It is just not that easy at all, and why women cop the blame for this really saddens me.
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I would really feel like I was selling myself short if anyone ever described my situation as an example of “where hanging in there does get the woman what she wants”… why would you (or your friend) WANT a man who had to “relent”/cave in? I personally believe I’m worthy of a lot more and absolutely wouldn’t hang around if my man made me beg for marriage and children.
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I said that in relation to the point of this article, being that women miss out on having kids if they play this game wrong. I agree re my friend who got three kids with the guy who can’t get married. I wouldn’t want to be her either. But in the fertility race, she got the kids, and that is what we’re talking about here. If we weren’t, then it wouldn’t matter so much. PS The danger for him is if she eventually says “stuff that” and the tables turn and she leaves him bc he never married her. I find it interesting that he doesn’t seem to see this as a risk. Also, it’s not that he doesn’t lover her, he does seriously just have a thing with marriage.
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How strange! I could never have a baby with someone who wasnt committed enough to want to marry me. I feel really sorry for her.
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I’ve had children with a man who I am not married to. We have an incredibly strong relationship and have been together 15 years. We have discussed marriage but both of us feel that we don’t need it and have committed ourselves to each other without the contract. We’ve both also agreed that if either one of us feels that marriage is important then we will marry. Please don’t feel sorry for me anon, I feel sorry for people who feel that getting married is the only way to show your committed.
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Rebecca, I wasnt talking about people in your situation. Not being married is something you both agree on which is fabulous. And its great that you have the mutual respect to honour each others wishes if they change.
To many women being married before having kids is important and thats when having kids with their boyfriend before they get the level of committment they really want is sad for them. Because their wishes arent being considered and they’re happy to settle for less than they really want just to keep their man.
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huh? Why would she leave the father of her children? Just to get cake and a white dress? Don’t get it :/
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Too true – there isn’t all that much diff these days between marriage & living together (especially once you have had the children) except for an expensive party, dress, cake etc.
Let’s face it, it’s just as hard to untangle de facto arrangements if need be… after only six months you are entitled to half each other’s assets!
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Are you seriously suggesting that getting married would omehow protect your friends relationship from failing? Married people cheat, and break up too. Also hy would you say that he relented and decide to hve a baby with her, then you said they had 3!! It was obviously something that he wanted too. So syndicalism
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So cynical. I was suppose to say. I hate this autocorrect, makes so many mistakes. I guess I should double check before I post oops
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Yes you’re right Rebecca, relented was wrong choice of word. What I meant was they broke the impasse together by agreeing to have kids, children they both love. So effectively she gave up on wanting to be married first. I think it’s still a niggling issue there, but they are as much a couple and family as anyone else now. My original point is really that ther are no rules for when sticking around works and when it leaves you babyless. Hence prevaricaton by a lot of women, each case is so individual to its facts and feelings etc.
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Hi Jo,
In all due respect, I don’t think it’s that b/w clear cut. I used to say the same thing too, however watching my sister’s relationship unravel taught me so much over the last decade. She was with her partner for over a decade. It wasn’t like they never talked about the future, they did. They He wanted to settle a life with her. He just couldn’t find the time to pop the question and make that first move. It was always a reason or other regarding the delay, but their “love” was never at stake, as in they both loved each other, but the timing or circumstances (finances, work etc) just got in the way. When she hit 30, my parents made the move and asked him whether he would like to marry in the next few years so they can start saving to help them pay for the wedding. It went awfully quiet, and as much as he said he would like to, he didn’t step up and gave an answer, so we all knew. Within the month they broke up, and within the 12 months afterwards he met someone else and married, went on to have two kids.
These things happen. I don’t think it’s completely fair to compare these women’s circumstances to binge drinking and blaming the bartender for the accident. It’s just people who make selfish decisions and lead the other to a dead end.
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Sam de Brito love your work, love your columns, keep it up!
At 29, after 6 years together, I said to my boyfriend, I want to have kids (which he knew) in the next few years, if you don’t that’s fine but I would rather know now than in 5 years, because I’ll move on. He needed the kick that came with thinking he would lose me, we got married and have 2 awesome kids he adores. It was hard at the time as I didn’t want to break up and that was a definite possibility but I didn’t want to miss my chance of being a mum.
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That’s great to hear
if you don’t mind me asking- did that cause a fight at the time?
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Yes it did cause a fight. After 6 years I felt he should know if I was the right person, and I didn’t want him to get married and have kids with me if he was “giving in”, I wanted him to want to. After a few drinks he told me he loved me and wanted to be with me forever but didn’t see the need to get married and wasn’t sure about kids. So I thought, well, I asked, he can’t be clearer, he doesn’t know, but I do so I moved out. I stayed with a friend for a couple of weeks, not as an ultimatum but really I thought I need to move on and find someone who wants the same things as me. Anyway , we had a big talk, he told me yes we would get married and yes to kids. We then got engaged about a month later. (He then told me all the hooing and haaing was to put me off, that he had been saving for an engagement ring) It was really hard because I loved him (and still do!) but I felt like we would just go on as we were (which was absolutely fine) and I would wake up, 40, no kids. It’s hard but I think you have to ask the question. Good luck!!
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This is exactly what happened to me! I didn’t sound as mature and rational as you though; I think I was a sobbing mess (a little crazy even) but thank goodness he didn’t let that detract too much… He still jokes about how he’d rather be a bachelor just to tease me, but he’s actually the most wonderful husband!!
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Here is another ‘ultimatum’ story that worked out happily.
A friend of mine was with a guy at 29.5, after 6 years together too. He was at least ten years older. They’d been splitting up and getting back together in the last 2 years to 18 months over commitment issues. Finally, she called it off for once and all on the verge of turning 30. She booked a two week trip to NY, started seeing other guys. It was OVER. Just before she flew away on her trip a few months later, obviously realising what he’d lost and that she meant what she said, he popped the question (they weren’t together). She thought it over on her trip to NY. Came back, said yes, got a ring, married three months later in a posh wedding, baby born 12 months to the date of the wedding. I guess the main point is she actually gave warning then ended it for real. And then, only then did he wake up. Funny thing is, anyone I show the photos to says he got himself a prize (but that is a superficial remark based on looks). They probably actually suit each other equally well. She adores him.
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I was 24 (okay, young – but certainly paranoid about infertility even then) and gave my boyfriend of five years, (whom I had been living with for two years) a furious ultimatem one Saturday – either explain why no proposal or we break up today. Engaged by that evening and little did I know I was beyond hormonal, 4 weeks pregnant (and biologically on the hunt for mate). Long story short we have had a happy ending. Unfortunately the science is out there & not in maternal women’s favour, all you can do is be mindful of that fact as you traverse your twenties.
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your approach seems wise – if he loves you he won’t want to lose you!
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You want to move somewhere? Don’t move interstate. Move on.
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He hasn’t got any fear of losing you……and why would he? From the sounds of it, you have done everything on his terms. What are you getting out of this relationship? What do you want? Are you happy? Does he love and respect you? Do you trust one another? Do you admire him?
I wouldn’t say you’ve been dumb. You’ve made the best choices you could so far with the information and advice you have had available to you. That is all we can ever do in life. You’ve no excuses now though! You’ve been on this forum
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Brilliant post, I just got out a two year thing with a man 8 years older than I was because he wouldn’t commit. He even asked me to move out after two months of living together because it was too much for him for now but he still wanted to see me. I didn’t want kids but I wanted a future, he did not. So I put my cards on the table and he declined it all with one line “I am wasting your time.” Via email!!!
So now I’m 25 and off to see the world, on my own. Who knows what I’ll find.
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I suspect in a few year’s time you’ll look back and be seriously glad you laid your cards out to him, and that he set you free (even if it was by email). He misses out on having a partner who was a fantastic communicator by the way. That’s the kind of person we all need to marry whether we’re male or female.
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LaurenMaree; you must be hurting right now but I think you have amazing things in front of you!
You will be grateful for this man’s honesty and I truly wish all men were this honest!!
Best of luck!
xxxxxxx
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You’ve given yourself the gift of time. You now have time and the chance to become a mother fairly young if you wish.
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LaurenMaree, I think you are my doppleganger! Desperately want kids, or at least, the promise of kids (25 years of age), got burned by arsehole in the past year. Luckily, felt a bit better after a visit to my fave spots in India. Enjoy your travels and may we find more suitable mates soon!
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a HUGE high five for Sam de Britto for writing this.
I am so glad to see this topic written about by a man, I feel like it might make men think about what they are doing. they probably wouldn’t read the same piece if it was written by a woman.
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It’s so sad that I had the same thought. In 2012.
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ha. love this topic. just not sure what the right response is.
giving ultimatums in relationships in bad.
but if you don’t, then it’s ‘your fault’ you ended up with the fertility vampire.
seriously. what’s the right thing to do!?
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Adrianne, like you I am SO glad this topic has come up.
Re: ultimatums, read my reply post below to anonymous at 12.41pm today, regarding making a promise to yourself, rather than an ultimatum to him.
You *do* let him know what you want and let his behaviour provide you with his reply, which then shapes your own decision. Men are generally not direct about this if his feelings towards this are negative.
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My tip is dont move in together!
That way if he’s a committment phobe he has no chance of becoming a fertility vampire! Because if you’re not living together and he’s not moving the relationship in the direction you want you can dump him before its too far down that track.
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Good point but my advice has always been to not get engaged unless you’ve lived with someone for a year or more!
I think it’s the only way to really tell if you’re truly compatible. I figure that you need to know if you can keep the romance alive when sharing a bathroom or bickering over whose turn it is to do the dishes!
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Good point, but I didnt live with my husband and I know quite a lot of women who didnt live with their husbands beforehand after livng with previous boyfriends and it all going downhill.
I guess everyone is different.
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i don’t think you need to live together. I did not live with my husband before we got married. I already knew what he was like around the house. Statistics and research don’t back you up. Marriage has a negative effect on the amount of time men devote to household tasks.
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another fab single woman, i like your thinking – in fact, i might even print your comments out to read and remember!
i get scared reading these kinds of things – good to hear your rational viewpoints!
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I guess rather than an ultimatum, you have to let him know how you feel and that this is important to you, and if he doesn’t take it seriously, then you know what to do.
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I don’t think the ultimatum is altogether bad. What is wrong with saying straight out “I want XX by XX. If its going to be with you fine, but if you can’t be in on it, I will leave.” By putting out what your expectations are, giving a time line and sticking to it, no one can really complain it was unfair or unexpected.
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Thank God I was lucky enough to dodge that bullet. I was with a guy from when I was 20-24. He was 4 years older. During that time there was never any mention of living together and I was never invited to family Christmases or anything with him, even though he was always invited to mine. He was the true committment phobe. I finally left him suspecting it was never going to move beyond what we had. And for that I am eternally grateful because through mutual friends who I see from time to time, I have been told he is still a Peter Pan in his mid 40′s, tagging women along for a few years and then moving on when she wants something more. He can get away with it for now because I’m told he is still incredibly handsome but I wonder what will become of him when his charm fades and women arent falling at his feet.
Not my problem anyway as I met my husband a few months after I split up with Peter Pan and we have gorgeous kids.
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I know a man in Melbourne – tall, dark and handsome with a smile to melt you in his mid-40s who fits that EXACT description.
He has always rated himself and keeps dating hotties – so far has been in 8-year, 7-year, 2-year and 4-year relationships. Which always end! Always. He also says he wants kids but never seems to get to it. He makes good money through property development, looks great, has a family dog as his side-kick, is adorable with nieces and nephews, and has sexy hobbies like motorcycling… so he’ll be just fine with girls.
Every woman he dates thinks she can win this prize and ends up hurt. I am sure he’ll marry a 24 year old ex-model and immediately have twins eventually, when he’s 49 or something. Just watch out for guys like him girls – he makes romantic gestures like grand holidays and the odd bit of jewellery (he can afford it) and he’ll promise you the world and make you feel magic for a while. He’s a fun toy saying he wants to be a family man – that is all.
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Not George Clooney hiding out in Melbourne, is it? Lol
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I am not convinced George really dates women – but that is a whole different topic!
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Excellent article, and a very enlightening discussion!
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Sorry to be a pedant but “literally” means actually happened in this way not metaphorically so “literally suck away the fertile years of women’s lives” seems unlikely if if not impossible.
And yes the situation is a bit unfair to women but it’s biology rather than patriarchy so not sure what can be done about it other than the good advice not to waste your fertile years.
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Regarding your first point, you might find the following interesting reading:
http://www.slate.com/articles/life/the_good_word/2005/11/the_word_we_love_to_hate.single.html
I found it food for thought
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