The following story literally made me gag. Then want to take a shower. Then want to hold my children close.
Am I over reacting? Probably, but you’re all fairly accustomed to that by now right?
My sister- in-law related this story to me and it has haunted me ever since.. It is in regards to a “friend” of hers.. (You will come to see why the inverted commas are now around the word FRIEND when before this incident they would not have been required.)
Jill* (my sister-in-law) had a couple of the girls from her Mothers group around to her house last week. Let us call them Mother number 2 and Mother number 3.
As lunch time rolled around it became apparent that there would not be enough food in the house to feed everyone so Jill and Mother number 2 said they’d go and get lunch if the Mother number 3 didn’t mind staying with the kids.
Of course she didn’t mind, so off Jill* and Mother number 2 went.
While they were shopping for cheese rolls, sushi and apple slice unspeakable events were unfolding back at the house.
Jill and Mother number 2 were gone for a total of 30 minutes. In those 30 minutes that Mothers group would be CHANGED FOREVER.. (Forever, forever, forever……… - FYI this is a dramatic echo)
Am I building the suspense enough? I still bet you can’t guess what happened..
Jill and Mother number 2 arrived back at the house to find all three children having a nap.
Well done Mother number 3 they exclaimed! Mother number 2 was especially surprised as her child hadn’t been fed yet and was hard to get to sleep when she hadn’t been fed. No milk = no sleep for Mother number 2′s child.
“I’m surprised you could get Misty* to sleep, she hasn’t been fed yet. I always have to give her a feed before she goes down at lunch time. I don’t know what I’ll do when I stop breastfeeding HER.”
Mother number 3 replied:
“Oh, Timmy* skipped his feed and I had a full boob so I popped Misty on it. She guzzled it down and went straight to sleep!”
OH YES. YES SHE DID. YOU BET YOUR SWEET BIPPY SHE DID!
MOTHER NUMBER 3 BREASTFED MOTHER NUMBER 2′s CHILD!
Let us pause here. This is an act that can NEVER BE UNDONE. Never, ever not once ever can it be undone..
It’s like finding out your flatmate has been cleaning the toilet with your toothbrush. You can’t take back all those times you had the brush in your mouth after it had cleaned the crevices of your toilet.
The image of Mother number 3′s nipple in her child’s mouth can NEVER be erased form Mother number 2′s mind. That milk can never be un-drunk.
Yessssss, I know there were wet nurses back in the day and I know some women today use them but for me it’s JUST NOT RIGHT. I’m not saying you are a bad person if you allow some other woman’s boob to go into your babies mouth for nourishment, I’m just saying don’t ever let it be my baby.
Breastfeeding is an intensely personal thing. It is bonding time, it is boobs and nipples and babies and family and well it’s breastfeeding! Who shoves their tit in a random kid’s mouth without at least asking said kid’s Mother first? (Wow that sentence would be SO wrong if taken out of context.)
Mother number 2 apparently lost her shit.
Mother number 3 was ushered out of the house at a rapid pace. It was excruciatingly awkward and none of the girls have been able to speak since.
I don’t think I would recover from that type of thing either.
Am I being a weirdo? I totally accept it if you think I am.. Perhaps I am not as open minded as I thought I was..
How would you react if this was your child?
*Jill, Misty and Timmy’s names have been changed to protect their dignity and identity.
Em Rusciano appears on Network Ten’s ’7pm Project’ and the Nine Network’s Mornings with Kerri Anne, You should follow her on Twitter here and read her blog here. No really you should
How would you handle it if someone breastfed your child? Would you ever breastfeed someone else’s baby if you could?
Comments
601 Comments so far
I agree with Amanda at 1.09 am.
The article’s tone was began the debate as nothing more than a coffee morning bitch-fest about the poor Mother 3, who is being publicly shamed. I also stand by the criticism of the writing in the context of this. The whole thing did not begin as a thoughtful piece about the topic of breastfeeding another’s child, but rather a coffee morning anecdote.
And Mia, the impassioned response is only imagined because this is what you hoped for. The majority of the replies were actually not hysterical or ‘impassioned’ about the actual topic (breastfeeding another’s child) but rather condeming of the tone of the article, its lack of rigour re the topic and the vilification of Mother 3. The tone of the article itself broke the dinner party rules in the first instance – not cool. Only a small percentage of the replies were ‘Eeeeewwwwing’ and ‘OMG-ing’.
It’s the reader responses that make this website and for you to sift through and delete what you don’t like is a censorship that unbalances the overall response. I didn’t see anyone using abusive language toward the writer. Just saying they didn’t think the article was well written should be well within what is allowed.
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Agree agree agree! Can’t press the like button enough!
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I absolutely agree. Don’t the “dinner party” rules apply to all? The tone of this article, the public shaming of mother 3 really are a disgrace. Here’s a test of how appropriate it is … answer this question “How would you like it if this article was written about you, about your actions and you were not given the chance to defend yourself?” When did this website become about public vilification? And I don’t think Mia’s responses of “impassioned debate” and “isn’t human nature fascinating?” serve as very good justifications. As I said below, if this story is in fact about real people that the writer or her family know (and not an urban myth), I wouldn’t be surprised to hear someday down the track that mother 3 either took legal action about this post or was so hurt and shamed that she was damaged forever.
Really, I cannot get over how nasty this article is and how Mamamia staff justify publishing it. How many posts have been on this website about how wrong it is to judge other women without knowing the full story, without walking a mile in their shoes etc etc. And fine, disagree with her actions and the boundaries she might have crossed. But why write about it in this peurile way?
Really … for shame!
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And of course I agree with you ‘squared’. When you say, ‘And I don’t think Mia’s responses of “impassioned debate” and “isn’t human nature fascinating?” serve as very good justifications,’ my previous point goes further in that they are not really even justifications because the responses weren’t impassioned about the topic, just the dreadful article and attitude of the women.
Mia’s response sounded like it was churned out by a computer and did not relate to the responses here in the least.
You know that eeeeveryone is a wriiiiita these days don’t you, just as eeeeeveryone is a styyyyyylist or a consultant.
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Hi MotherR,
The comments that were deleted were personally abusive to the writer and we don’t tolerate that under any circumstances. On any post.
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No, that is fair enough. I may not have seen the late night additions. I suppose it depends on where on the sliding scale it stops being a negative opinion and becomes classed as abuse.
But as for (to Bowerbird): “there is no need for witness protection here. We’re not talking about a crime.” No one said anything about supression of identity because it might be a crime but more because there is (or maybe not) a poor woman and mother out there who already got ostracised by her mothers’ group when her baby was little – not a nice start – and now she is being publicly lashed.
And as for: “no identifying details were given.” Isn’t it the “writer’s” SiL’s mothers’ group – not a stretch to make those connections. Unless of course if the whole thing is made up, or the SiL connection was a clever red herring.
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So, you don’t allow comments that are personally abusive to your writers, yet you allow articles that are personally abusive to other people?
Shame.
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What about ‘the writer’ being personally abusive to Mother 3?
You seem to have no problems with that.
The poor woman (no 3), I feel so sorry for her.
Expected better from you.
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Wow huge response! I personally would find it weird that a woman breastfed my baby without checking with me, it’s pretty easy to text someone. Especially since it was such a short time away, it’s not that vital to feed them, even for comfort. I think I’d be more affected if my baby was given formula without my consent. But I can’t imagine a situation where I’d Breastfeed someone else’s bub. I’m actually looking after a bub from my mothers group today for a few hours. All food will be provided in advance
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not really sure what all the anger and vitriole directed at Em and mamamia is all about. It’s a BLOG people! Blogs are subjective opinions by nature. lets chillax!
as for the actual story, so rude! If permission was granted fine, but to feed someones child without asking them, particularly breastfeed is just wrong.
great article Em! its a shame some people forgot the dinner party rules…
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I would be extremely freaked out if another person breastfed my baby. But then again I probably wouldn’t leave my baby with a friend alone with 3 babies to look after. Maybe I’m neurotic but the only people I will leave my baby alone with is my husband and my mum.
Saying that, I have been involved in a slightly similar situation. I was at a kids 4th birthday party with my daughter for a girl from her preschool. I knew the mother only through preschool and wouldn’t call her a friend. My other daughter was 2 months old at the time and as the party was held outside and it was a hot day, she was sleeping inside in the pram. I was going in regularly to check on her of course, but I was shocked when I got up to go check on her and the found the mother holding my baby daughter and giving her a bottle! She said she walked in and she was awake so thought she would start her feed for me (which wasn’t even due). I didn’t express my anger as her child’s birthday party was not the place but I think she could tell I was not happy. There were a few raised eyebrows from other mothers there too. In my opinion, feeding someone else’s baby is definitely a no go…
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Agree completely with Em on all points, including the tone of her article which so many have taken offense to.
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I guess if she had called and asked the mother it would be a different story. well for me anyway. But then again i am a serious boundary person
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She did WHAT??
If it was a close friend, who shares my ideas of how to bring up children (the feeding part in particular) I would be able to cope I think. I certainly wouldn’t have a fit and throw the person out of my house. That said, none of my close friends would ever do that…
A random mum from mothers group, who I didn’t know ‘intimately’ (that just doesn’t ring right, can’t find a better word) I probably wouldn’t bother catching up with her again.
I would LOVE to hear the reasoning and discussions following the incident!!!
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wow lots of debate.
my thoughts: yes i would be really annoyed. you don’t tend to know your friends from mothers group that well, they are typically very new friends, so i would be really upset. if a close friend did it i would feel ok. but breast-milk is a body fluid so i think you could end requiring HIV testing if you were concerned.
we are all aware of breast milk banks but those mothers are tested for viruses and the milk is treated, so the link doesn’t really work here.
i also think the story is a bit odd. i wouldn’t have left a new baby for such a long time, esp without being in contact. i don’t know why the mother didn’t text or call to ask permission, but i also think it was a bit unfair she was left with three little babies. why didn’t one go out and get lunch and the others stay? all sounds a bit fishy. as others have commented, i hope the mums involved aren’t reading this…
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I think for the woman to just do it without permission is totally wrong, and if one of my friends had done this to me I would have been very angry. I understand that community feeding is done in many cultures, but this is for reasons such as low milk supply and the difficulties in accessing clean water and formula.
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I’m sad so many comments have been deleted.
Perhaps some were inappropriately unkind towards Em.
However, I gave thumbs up to several that I didn’t think were insulting. I’m disappointed they are gone as I felt they added to the discussion.
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redballoon, the nasty comments were deleted in line with our comment policy – this make the thread nonsensical so some of those comments may have gone with the vitriol. Sorry about that but Mamamia is not a place where we condone bullying or nastiness directed at either our writers or our readers
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She does ask: “Am I being a weirdo?” in the article.
Are we not allowed to answer?
Maybe other people’s dinner parties are not like mine
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kind of surprised the entire article passed the ‘dinner party’ rules myself… not ok to be nasty towards commenters or writers but ok to be nasty about the people in an article?
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Interesting? as the whole article was actually quite nasty.
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And do you not consider the article itself to be bullying? The author has written a third hand account of something based on heresay, villified a mother who we know absolutely nothing about, and called for us all to make our judgements on a matter that, in her words, “literally made me gag”.
That’s bullying.
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Bullying? Come on!
If someone breastfed my child – or the child of a friend – and I wrote about how horrified I was without identifying the person, that’s not bullying, that’s having an opinion!
Has the world gone mad?
Are we not even able to express our personal boundaries about breastfeeding?
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This article was ‘nasty’ directed at the subject. You can have an opinion without being nasty- like your ‘dinner party’ rules, but this wasn’t it.
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Yes, I’ve read this story before too, on SMH about a year ago, I think.
For me, I think the consent issue is the big one. Because there are potential health issues here, and fairly or unfairly, most parents would worry about that. Also, in general terms, I think you don’t do anything to someone else’s child without having permission or being utterly sure it’s okay – and feeding decisions of any kind with babies are fraught so it’s something you should definitely check about. Let alone something as personal as breastfeeding.
I’ve only scanned a few of the comments, but a few people seem to have issues with the tone of the article. I think many of the articles on Mamamia do express strong personal feelings and that’s part of their power. I do think the tone Em chose for the article may not have worked quite as she intended, but that shouldn’t negate her points – she clearly acknowledges not everyone will feel the way she does.
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I’m just wondering why my comment was deleted? It wasn’t defamatory or ‘uncool’ in any way. I was simply trying to understand why posts that aren’t particularly lyrical receive such a bashing, while well-written ones are barely touched? I think it’s a shame we’re so quick to throw stones, is all.
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There have been some really nasty comments directed at Em and her writing. They don’t pass our dinner party rules and so we have deleted them. We chose to publish the piece and we stick by it, insulting the writers (or the readers) is never okay
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Would you stop saying you don’t insult the readers!
You seem to have two sets of rules.
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hmmm we can all drink milk from a COW or a GOAT but from another person is disgusting? Seriously get over it! Breast milk is designed for babies – is the mum a junky? or a meth addict? It doesn’t sound like it. Maybe it was a kind thing to do to help a poor distressed baby that needed sleep. I have a 10 month old and if one of my girlfriends fed him, i don’t think it would be a huge deal. A mum would only do that as a last resort surely.
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I wouldn’t react like that.
I’d find it a bit icky, but see it for the good intention it was, and just be sure not to leave my kid in her company again!
I just can’t help but think calm the hell down it’s a boob, it contained milk, it settled the baby, the baby survived – what can ya do??
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What an interesting response on this post! And an impassioned one. Always a sign that the writer has hit upon a nerve. I’ve just been reading through the comments and learning a lot about the scope of human reactions.
To those who have questioned why MM would publish this piece, I’m a bit surprised by the idea that we wouldn’t.
Em wrote about her personal reaction to a particular situation. Just because you might not have the same reaction, it doesn’t make hers in any way ‘wrong’ or not worthy of being aired.
My husband’s grandmother had a wet nurse 100 years ago in Poland and I’ve never found the idea of that particularly confronting.
But honestly? I would freak out if another woman breastfed my baby.
I would.
I think it comes down to boundaries. If you’re NOT someone who would freak out, that reaction might puzzle you or even upset you. And vice versa.
I’m always fascinated when something pricks some kind of bubble in our consciousness and provokes such a strong response.
And as for why Em hasn’t been interacting in the comments, she’s been working, travelling and offline all day.
Let’s cut the working mother some slack.
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It may not be well written according to your standards but it is after all, all about the context. This website publishes a range of pieces and social commentators have their ‘style’, this is Em’s and i wouldn’t expect anything else but caps lock and her unique colloquialism.
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Mia, can I just ask … Do you consider or how do you ensure the anonymity of the people being written about in the posts you publish? I respect you protecting your writers and those who comment, but what about the people who get written about in such a negative way, who have no right of reply, who may well be quite easily identified, and who may have to live with seeing hurtful comments about her (to her understandable) actions for ever after? With respect, I don’t believe it is very ethical.
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Amanda – fair question. We have a lot of experience in publishing personal posts and our writers always go to great lengths to change any identifying details to protect anyone from being recognised.
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Mia, can you please describe those “lengths”? The author has identified mother 3 as a former friend and member of the mothers’ group of her sister-in-law. It wouldn’t take much work (via facebook, google etc) to work out the identities. But even worse than us working out mother 3′s identity is mother 3 working out that she is the target of this piece of writing. Or did you mean for her to be able to come and read this public whipping?
I too have lots of experience in writing and publishing information gathered from different people, in an academic context. Now if I was to disclose identifying details in this way where the person could potentially be identified I would lose my job, lose my professional registration and probably be sued. I don’t just have a lot of experience and training in maintaining confidentiality, I have to have all of my proposed projects, consent forms, you name it approved by our institution’s ethics committee.
With all respect, perhaps you can describe the processes that you and staff go through to consider these issues of confidentiality, consent and respect before a post is published. Because a great many people have suggested that this process may have failed you with this post.
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Interesting that there’s no response to your question Amanda. Asked fairly and respectfully.
Mia, what are the “great lengths” that your writers go to? Or is this just a turn of phrase?
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Actually this made me chuckle as I identified someone (from real life) only today via an earlier MM article. The writer they were quoting with the little asterix not her real name was actually using her real name. Only she uses a nickname on MM for commenting.
There were loads of other clues, too. But then I would be contributing to the person in question finding this post that has been written about them
It wasn’t an overly offensive post but the comment was made by the writer that it was unlikely to get back as the subject doesn’t own a computer. Well, they do now. And am betting if it was easy enough for me to put two and two together…
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I am genuinely confounded by this, and I have been coming here for long enough for people to know I’m not trolling. The article was verging on bitchy, I feel sorry for the person who is written about because if the story is true then she’s identifiable to lots of people. It might well be the author writing about her personal reaction to a situation but I don’t get putting a post like this up and then expecting something else back in comments. Of course the comments back would be along the same lines.
I honestly read the article and thought, what was that? I’ve liked lots of Em’s other articles so I’m not author bashing, but I really, really don’t get this. And I understand that I have the option to click away and not read, I get that. Thought it was worthwhile expressing an opinion though.
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Many will agree with you about personal boundaries etc. But the article gives a public platform for one woman to ridicule another and invites us to share in the horror and disgust at her actions. This is not what I’ve come to expect from Mamamia. I thought this was a place that promoted a more mature response to problems and differences than this. If you read the comments that have received the most “likes” they touch on respect for mother 3, about preserving her dignity and anonymity. This is why I’m shocked that Mamamia would publish this poorly written article.
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I’m a little disappointed by your response Mia. I wrote a comment about how disappointed I was in the tone of the article and that it was deemed good enough to publish, and last time I checked, it had 68 thumbs up. MM is a platform which is almost always used in a positive way. To rationally discuss issues and support women and the choices they made. This piece was irrational, no doubt about it. From “literally made me gag” to the comparison between mother 3 breastfeeding the child to a housemate cleaning the toilet with your toothbrush. The tone of the article was bitchy and hysterical. There was no attempt made to discover why mother 3 chose to breastfeed the child, instead MM readers were supposed to condemn her. But that backfired judging by the pages and pages of comments. I’m usually a fan of Em’s writing, but this was a rant. A rant based on only one side of the story.
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Agree x 1000 Emma
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Hi Emma – I’m genuinely struggling to understand the issue with Em expressing her genuine reaction to a fairly extreme and unexpected situation.
It was clearly an opinion piece and the writer had a strong opinion – although it must also be noted that she remained open to the idea that her opinion was not a majority one.
Posts have never been the final word on Mamamia – they are merely conversation starters and as such we provide a forum for anyone to express a contrary view.
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Dear Mia, I remain flabbergasted that you cannot see the other point of view here. Of all people, surely you would be well placed to understand that attacks in cyberspace have the power to truly hurt. Haven’t you written about the times you’ve been in tears after being attacked for a post, how you’ve hidden inside all weekend and felt terrible?
Now imagine this poor woman – mother 3 – who is being used essentially as fodder for entertainment. The breathless, sensational way in which this piece is written doesn’t offer any hope of a balanced perspective. What might have been that mum’s motivations? What might she have been thinking? Who knows? By the account we are given, she just wanted to shove her tit in another woman’s baby’s mouth! And by the account we are given, her behaviour is not just out of line or crossing boundaries but disgusting, enough to make you gag, make you want to wash, hug your babies, scream and cry and lose your shit!!!!
Really and truly!
Again, I urge you and Em to put yourself in the shoes of the mother who has been crucified by this post.
How would you like it?
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Hi,
I think its also important to have different writers with different views and styles on a forum discussion based site such as mamamia.
Em is on the 7pm project, tweets and pops up all over the place and this is her style. She’s bubbly, opinionated, emotional and reactionary and more often than not very entertaining.
Em’s style tackling such a passionate issue (breast feeding discussion ALWAYS incites huge debate, be it online, in the press, at the water cooler or at a dinner party) so combining Em’s style and such a hot topic was bound to be fairly inflamatory.
I think people for some reason go a bit loopy about all things feeding – mostly because people can’t seem to not take things personally – they can’t seem to differentiate one persons opinion from a personal attack. I have strangely found myself apologising to people for breast feeding my kids, and justifying why I fed this way. Crazy, I simply did because i could – i had milk, no attachment issues blah blah but still strange reactions all over the place!
I think all i’m trying to say is people get a bit impassioned about certain topics and perhaps in future if you know this to be the case give a little consideration to who is writing about it and their style………….
i love Em and enjoy her writing but I think we all knew what the outcome was going to be when her piece was turned in.
As for the issue at hand – well i agree with you. The child wasn’t starving we’re not in the third world and there would have been a multitude of other options prior to taking this one. Common courtesy tells me asking the mother first, via a phone call, sms whatever in such circumstances should always come first.
But that would have been a terribly boring article wouldn’t it!
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Gotta say, I’m a bit surprised that Mamamia published this story. How many times have I read articles and comments about breastfeeding benefits, breastfeeding in public or breastfeeding in general? Yes, I understand there are some boundary/permission issues here but what resonates is the author’s disgust at the thought of one mum breastfeeding a child that is not their own. “Modern” society is just that – it wasn’t so long ago that we employed people to breastfeed our babies. Just recently the Mercy Hospital for Women launched Melbourne’s (Victoria’s? Australia’s?) first breastmilk bank.
And on a personal note – when I gave birth to my first baby, I realised the importance and dependence of breastmilk. When a girlfriend had a baby only weeks later I distinctly remember feeling safe in the knowledge that, if something untoward should happen to me (yes…macabre) my baby might have an option whilst she adjusted to formula. And vice versa if it happened to my friend. That I could provide another child with much needed sustenance.
Just saying.
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And again, just saying…
The picture of the baby breastfeeding is completely unrealistic. Babies need to suckle from more than just the nipple. They need a good grasp of the breast to be able to extract the milk effectively from the milk ducts.
Sorry…it’s just that after having and breastfeeding two children, the myths and misrepresentations around pregnancy/childbirth/breastfeeding are infuriating!
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That might be true but look at the blissed-out expression on the baby’s face – gorgeous!
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That baby is gorgeous and I always loved the way their eyes look like they are drugged or something. Not a nice description, but I hope you know what I mean. But, those perfect boobs annoy me a bit – probably touched up.
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I haven’t read all the comments below, so I will just comment on the article.
I am saddened to see such sensationalistic writing surrounding breastfeeding. Irrespective of whether it was the right thing to do, with consent issues etc, there is no need to use the tone and language about it. Breastfeeding is not disgusting, it should not make people gag, it is not an unspeakable act. So why should the fact that someone else is doing it to someone else’s child suddenly make it so disgusting??
On another note, I am sure that I have heard this story before. Has this been printed elsewhere? This topic was discussed a while ago on Mamamia http://www.mamamia.com.au/entertainment/would-you-breastfeed-a-strangers-starving-baby-salma-hayek-did/
I am really confused why this topic has been allowed on Mamamia in such a sensationalistc manner.
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after reading the below comments i for one would just like to say thankyou em for another great article.
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Body fluids are body fluids and you can’t share them without consent… I’m sure a doctor would freak out about it.
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Yes, this.
It’s bodily fluids. There was no consent. It’s wrong.
The End.
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I am amazed by the number of people who wouldn’t be as upset about someone else breastfeeding their child! I am pro breastfeeding, ended up with PND because it didn’t happen long for us (for various reasons), but there is something fundamental personal about breastfeeding your child and not in a sexual way at all. Yes there were wet nurses, yes people feed their child with donated milk from milk banks, but these people choose to do this. Breastfeeding is a fundamental part of motherhood and to take that away from someone, however good the intention, is not ok in my book.
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F
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Classic first world problem.
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I totally disagree with breastfeeding another persons child without asking permission.
A dear friend and I obve had the conversation as we had heard a similar story. I breast fed and she didn’t. We agreed it would only be acceptable in a life/death situation where we were stranded and there was no food/ milk available…
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My aunt and I had babies at the same time and talked about breastfeeding each others children should the need ever arise. We agreed there was nothing weird or wrong with that. Maybe Mother 3 should have waited but its not like she did anything that could hurt the baby. She is obviously a very concerned and nurturing woman who got an upset little bub off to sleep. Perspective people.
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After expressing for a 25 week premmie for 12 months, and having a ridiculously large over supply for him, I would’ve loved to have contributed to what is now the Mercy Breast Milk Bank. Ask any parents of premmies (well certainly the terribly critical micro premmie kind of premmie) and I think all would choose EBM over any synthetic substitute…. While I think the reaction is completely over the top, I think permission (or lack of it) is the key to the whole argument.
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Yeah, its not cool for a mum to assume its OK to feed another woman’s baby without permission.
But – Wow. What a reaction.
I would like to see outrage directed to shit that really actually matters in this world like I don’t know – little baby girls being raped in Sierra Leone.
To me, it is god damn outrageous that such horrendous violent acts like this occur in this world to these helpless children. In comparison, I do not find it outrageous that a woman helped a child go to sleep by breastfeeding him. A little bit weird, in fact very weird, yes but its not worthy of capital, shouty letters to get the point across.
3 YEAR OLD BABY HAS GONORRHEA. This is worthy of some shouty outrage in capital letters.
And to find the prospect of another woman’s nipple being on the mouth of another child absolutely disgusting? Wow. That is a seriously low tolerance of what can be considered gross, disgusting and unacceptable.
Wanna know what is truly disgusting and just so incredibly dangerous and unhygienic? ATM – which apparently according to experts is becoming commonplace and completely normal for men to watch in pornographic films. We need to be be much much more worried about this truly disgusting practice, not if your toothbrush was used to clean a toilet. (Incidentally, before it was commonplace women probably thought the idea of removing all their pubic hair, giving oral sex and having anal sex utterly abhorrent and now look at what is socially acceptable)
I think the author needs to get some perspective on what is essentially just a first world problem.
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or maybe you could try sticking to the topic
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Ah, ya know, I blame the baby. Surely the baby should have Just Said No.
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I would have lost it too. Breastfeeding is an intensly personal thing between me and my babies. The actions of mum no. 3 ARE NOT OK!!!!! To do this without consent is crazy, a line has been crossed here and yes Em it can’t be taken back.
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Yeah, its not cool for a mum to assume its OK to feed another woman’s baby without permission.
But – Wow. What a reaction.
I would like to see outrage directed to shit that really actually matters in this world like I don’t know – little baby girls being raped in Sierra Leone (see nytimes article http://nyti.ms/pW2JQ3).
To me, it is god damn outrageous that such horrendous violent acts like this occur in this world to these helpless children. In comparison, I do not find it outrageous that a woman helped a child go to sleep by breastfeeding him. A little bit weird, in fact very weird, yes but its not worthy of capital, shouty letters to get the point across.
3 YEAR OLD BABY HAS GONORRHEA. This is worthy of some shouty outrage in capital letters.
And to find the prospect of another woman’s nipple being on the mouth of another child absolutely disgusting? Wow. That is a seriously low tolerance of what can be considered gross, disgusting and unacceptable.
Wanna know what is truly disgusting and just so incredibly dangerous and unhygienic? ATM – (http://bit.ly/hZaQZ) which apparently according to experts is becoming commonplace and completely normal for men to watch in pornographic films. We need to be be much much more worried about this truly disgusting practice, not if your toothbrush was used to clean a toilet. (Incidentally, before it was commonplace women probably thought the idea of removing all their pubic hair, giving oral sex and having anal sex utterly abhorrent and now look at what is socially acceptable)
I think the author needs to get some perspective on what is essentially just a first world problem.
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I agree with many of the comment below that this piece pathologizes the act of breast-feeding – even if the central theme of the article is about consent – the terms in which breastfeeding is described is really saddening. I remember when I had my first child my mother relating to me that her and her friends sometimes breastfed each others children if the circumstances arose in which it was needed. Far from being disturbed by the fact that I may have once been fed by a breast other than my mothers, I thought that seemed like a very sane arrangement (granted all mothers were in agreement that they felt comfortable with it and fully endorsed such a practice). I know this article isn’t meant to be demonising breastfeeding per se but I think the tone does describe the act of feeding a child in puerile and disturbed terms. I think it is disappointing that this piece was published on Mamamia- certainly this theme could be debated in a more measured and mature way.
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I’m astounded at how many of you think this is okay. If someone breast fed my child I would be really angry. As for the comments of ‘I’d be angrier if someone fed my baby formula’ ..really? Just because you find breastfeeding an optimum way to nourish a child, doesn’t mean the rest of the world does. Isn’t the issue permission? Permission to BF permission to feed with formula. The poor child’s mother has every right to be devastated and if you’re having trouble empathising imagine someone did feed your child a bottle of formula and translate those feelings of betrayal and anger straight back to how this poor mother felt when someone BF her child.This lady crossed the line.
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Actually, I think it is universally agreed that breastfeeding IS the optimal food for a baby. Let’s not get started on feeding choices though.
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I’m sorry, but I think the tone of this article is completely hysterical, bordering on ridiculous. I get that mother 3 should have asked permission and that she stepped over boundaries and perhaps there was a small chance of communicable diseases but:
Made the author gag, want to take a shower, hug her children close? What does this last one especially mean? I thought it might be about breastfeeding a serial killer or something.
Also I’m pretty uncomfortable with some recent posts on this website where the author criticises people who could probably be identified and opens them to public vilification. The birthday party invite mum is another one.
Are you checking with lawyers? If this was me being discussed I’d be having a conversation with my lawyers.
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Just screams insecurity to me, I understand being upset about it if you don’t like it, but come one…
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The condemning tone in this article makes me so sad! Women are so quick to throw each other under the bus when it comes to breastfeeding. Granted, Mother 3 should have asked beforehand, but likening breastfeeding someone else’s baby to scrubbing a toilet with a toothbrush blatantly demonstrates that even amongst women there is still a stigma attached to breastfeeding, like it’s a dirty act!
To take a leaf out of Em’s book, I will put it as suspensefully as I can.
Ready???
…drumroll…
THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NOTHING SEXUAL ABOUT BREASTFEEDING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (!!!! superfluous exclamation points !!!!)
I’d be more upset if she had shoved a bottle filled with formula in my baby’s face, after all my efforts to ensure my bub was purely breastfed. Just because breastmilk comes out of a nipple doesn’t make it filthy.
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I completely agree!!!!!!!!!
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What a third world problem! Imagine the millions of mothers out there who would give anything to nourish their starving babies.. Perhaps watch actress Salma Hayak on Youtube breastfeed another baby, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Spm9ocfYUU, and remind yourself how lucky you actually are.
This practice is not so uncommon beyond our borders and for some infants, receiving another woman’s milk can mean the difference between life and death. Women donate spare breast milk (within our borders) for babies overseas or for infants in the neonatal wards of hospitals closer to home. Gay couples are able to purchase donated breast milk to feed their adopted babies, such as Neil Patrick Harris, a Hollywood TV personality, who had to purchase it to feed to his adopted daughter Harper, who had problems with formula. Many infants (in our culture and overseas) would not have received the necessary nourishment without the many mothers who generously gave their breast milk to these babies. It is not a practice to be condemned.
I’ve read mamamia for two years- this is the first time I’ve commented because I was really disappointed in the writing. It didn’t consider different points of view or anything of substance like different cultures & history. It’s fine to have an opinion against what happened
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But this happened in Australia and the baby wasn’t starving. It was a suburban mother’s group and a story about that – not a post about the complexities of culture and history. I think it should be looked at in that light.
And welcome to commenting on Mamamia – hope you make it a habit
It;s good to hear from all our readers
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I am sure you can appreciate that a hungry baby does not need to be starving to kick up a real fuss when needing feeding, so it is relevant.
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I can’t believe how many comments below actually approve of what mum no. 3 did…. She didn’t just cross a line, she has gone so far over the line she can’t even see it
Ugh just the thought of it makes me feel ill.
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Yes, I believe the writer of this piece over reacted and the writing is in very poor form. No disrespect to the author of this piece, but it sounds like a teenager talking to her friends rather than an adult woman writing for mamamia.
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Calm down, Em. Ever hear of a “wet nurse”? Breastfeeding is a natural thing – it’s less about having a nipple in your baby’s mouth and more about providing your baby with natural sustinence.
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Milk is fairly clean so chill people. We all drink milk out of a cow for gods sake. Out of a COW.
I personally would never think to do it but if it was my child I would be a tiny bit annoyed and ask if she maybe not to do it again as my boobs are full and I have to express now. Then I would enjoy lunch. And the peace
It was intended as a kindness and while weird sould not end a friend ship. The poor lady must be so embarrassed.
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Me neither, that post read like it was written by someone with the emotional maturity of oh, about a three year old. Come to think of it I know three year olds with more common sense and better writing skills. Dreadful piece and I hope it is not true, as that poor Mum is sure to be suffering with this type of bullying by immature idiots going on…
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I heard another story about a friend of a friend (so it is likely to be untrue!)…. several families at a childs birthday party. After they had sung Happy Birthday, cut and ate the cake the mother of the birthday child mentions in passing that she ran out of milk when she was making the cake so substituted with EBM much to the horror of many of the guests.
Personally I would be quite upset about this…. not because there is anything disgusting or wrong with breastmilk but because it is another persons bodily fluid and therefore I want to know before I consume it so I can make an informed decision… and I think I would have still eaten the cake.
The scenario is kind of similar with the breastmilk aspect, I’d expect to be asked if it was ok and would probably say yes to EBM if I thought it was necessary. The physical act of breastfeeding, well that is a whole other story, I would never be able to forgive another women for breastfeeding my baby without my consent. I feel that is such an intrusion into the mother/child relationship and is just not right. I have read many of the comments below so I know many readers will think I am over-reacting but I really do see breastfeeding as an intimate thing. It is in no way sexual however, but for me, the level of initimacy involved is very similar to the intimacy I share with my husband during sex… does that make sense? So for someone to breastfeed my baby would feel like I had been betrayed big time.
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I really would have expected more substance from Mamamia. This is definitely a topic that is worth debate and discussion, not a sensationalised, unsubtle piece by a writer who from past articles as well, has demonstrated that she is seriously lacking in writing skill.
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I think it’s fantastic that Mamamia has ALL sorts of contributors, from different backgrounds, occupations, genders, ethnicity and so forth, rather than just being a site with articles written by professional writers or journalists. It is so much more personal, and friendly. Each Mamamia contributor recounts their story in their own words and style and while it might not be everyone’s cup of tea, I think it’s worthwhile remembering that this site is still FREE and you can unsubscribe at any time.
I’m all for freedom of speech and expressing opinions Gemma, but if you’re going to be critical, make it constructive rather than a mean spirited personal attack on someone.
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No one said the writing had to be ‘professional’, just good and thoughtful.
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Hey Gemma,
Em felt strongly about the subject and wrote her post accordingly. Some of the posts we run examine issues dispassionately and others, well they run the gamut of emotion!
The posts we run are never meant to be the final word, merely conversation STARTERS. And I think Em’s post did that beautifully in this case.
Opposing views have been argued enthusiastically among commenters.
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I think it’s been very unsuccessful as a conversation starter relating the topic of breast feeding. People are barely discussing the topic, they’re discussing the sensationalism of the post and the irresponsibility and lack of professionalism of MM.
Any publicity is good publicity??
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” I know some women today use them but for me it’s JUST NOT RIGHT. I’m not saying you are a bad person if you allow some other woman’s boob to go into your babies mouth for nourishment”
Actually, that’s exactly what you are saying. And it’s stupid and prudish and tries to make some mystical thing out of breastfeeding. Do we think it’s magical when piglets suckle? No not really – but how adorable is it when a tiger adopts piglets? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xqkzJoRua5U naaaaawwww. But should a human being do it its disgusting?
Sorry but I think you are a slight bit insane. It is not like finding someone cleaning the toilet with your toothbrush – a woman’s breast is NOT a toilet.
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So,so hearted. Mystical, my a**.
And you’ve taken my mind off some of the insanity by filling my mind with tiger/piglet nurturing! Awesome.
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I wonder if Em is going to return to participate in this discussion?
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Actually, I suspect she’s off giggling somewhere.
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You know, I’ve been thinking that myself!
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Bradley, you are on fire!
I’ve given you so many thumbs up this post that my mouse clicking finger hurts!
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The poor Mum who was left at home with 3 babies was in a real bind. It seems she was able to get 2 babies to sleep, but was then left with a tired, grizzly baby. Most of us would cuddle the baby, rock it in our arms, walk with it. This Mum may well have done this. The complication for this Mum is that she has a breast overloaded with milk as her own child went to sleep without feeding from it. A grizzly babe she needs to soothe, who is normally breastfed to sleep, who is presumably being held next to a breast which is probably experiencing ‘let down’ of milk because there is a crying baby being held against it.
At the time it would have seemed a very obvious solution.
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Nah it doesn’t bother me. But I do agree with Caro that they could have just texted to check.
Mountain…molehill.
Love the comparison to ‘The Slap’
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Ah, imagine how disgusted Em would be with this then! http://www.oddballdaily.com/2011/03/24/woman-breastfeeds-her-dad-claims-it-will-save-his-life/
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Ooh thats a hard one. Perhaps more exclamation marks?!!! A dramatic pause to draw out the story, create some tension… …? Or include melodramatic phrases to describe this UNSPEAKABLE EVENT!
She obviously possesses excellent journalistic skills though so i reckon she could easily find a way to convey the HORROR!!!
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Or the chef that made cheese with his wife’s excess breastmilk and served it for canapes:
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2010/03/09/breast-milk-cheese.html
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I don’t “get” breastfeeding, hated every single second of my whole two days of doing it with my first child and felt such a sigh of relief when I changed to formula when he was three days old. Didn’t even bother trying with child number two. But that’s me, hated it so not doing it. So perhaps I don’t understand the whole issue here, yes she should have asked for permission… I agree, but she didn’t, I don’t feel as seriously freaked out about it as others, but I can also understand where they are coming from.
When my sister was a baby she was breastfed by my auntie all the time! I think if my mum couldn’t do it my auntie would, that’s just how it was. But I guess the difference is that there was that permission given.
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OMG! Who would do this? I would want to physically harm a woman if she did this to my baby (I probably wouldn’t though, I’m quite passive aggressive like that). It would never even occur to me to offer my boob to another baby unless it was a life or death situation obviously which mothers group is not! I feel especially qualified to comment on this post as well because I’m currently on my first night away from my baby (stupid work!) and am pumping my breast milk onto a hotel wine glass because I left bottles at home lol.
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So many people have said what I want to say better than I can, but I’ll weigh in as well just to get the strength of numbers!
I would happily have fed another child (still would, actually, I have enough milk for my bub and 12 of his closer friends) and after some thought would be happy for someone I knew and trusted to feed my bub. Formula on the other hand – I would be FURIOUS! But I like to think we could sit down and talk about it like adults. Not asking, big FAIL but come on, nobody has been hurt, I really can’t see the biggie here. I am happy to mammia to publish things like this because they do make me thin, but I am less impressed that Em wrote it.
Fascintaing stuff!
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Oh God, thinK not THIN. I wish it would make me thin, then I wouldn’t have to do weight watchers anymore…
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I think the negative comments regarding formula are out of line and completely judgmental. Why are we, as mothers, so harsh on each other. As someone who has just swapped her baby to formula, after 9 months of breastfeeding I find it really insulting to hear comments like “I would be angrier if she gave her a bottle of formula”. As if the process of swapping a baby to formula isn’t hard enough, as if the guilt isn’t bad enough you then have all these types of comments to put up with. Yes people are entitled to their opinion but really shouldn’t we all just give each other a break?
As to the story, the whole issue is with permission and the author seems to have missed that point in her article.
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I totally get that it’s difficult to formula feed a baby, and the judgement you get doesn’t help at all. It’s awful! But I think this comment was about formula feeding a breastfed baby, not weaning a baby onto breastmilk. So I don’t think Josie was judging your choice. And I’m sorry about the comments you’ve had to put up with. So uncool.
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judgement from the sidelines can be disheartening
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Disgusting!!!! I breastfed my daughter and if someone had breastfed her especially without my consent I would be furious. I know this is an extreme example but HIV is passed through breastmilk and who know how many other things. Two many people in this world think they can do whatever they want without consequences. They are the ones who need to grow up not the people who find sharing fluids without permission wrong. So gross!
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