My dream: sleeping baby + cupcake
I’ve never had a baby who slept through the night. Not spontaneously. Not even close. Not without help.
And for me, that help came in the form of my beloved Sleep Whisperer. I wrote about Elizabeth Sloane and what happened when she came to give our family “the gift of sleep” as she calls it here – and boy, was it the best gift I’d ever received. The gift that keeps on giving. And giving. Every. Single. Night. Ever since she first came four and a half years ago.
When I was in hospital having just given birth to Remy two years ago, I texted her: “It’s a boy! Book me in 6 months from today!” And she did. I receive at least one email per week from desperate, sleep-deprived mothers who remember reading about the Sleep Whisperer in my book, begging me for her number.
So I thought I’d do an interview with her for Mamamia. We sat down on my floor (I DO like being on the floor…) a couple of weeks ago and had a big chat about sleeeeep, controlled crying, the effect of sleep deprivation on new mothers and why we seem to have turned sleep into an industry.
(we also discovered we were wearing the same bras under our t-shirts but I digress….)
We chatted for almost half an hour and I tried to edit it but then I realised that if you’re interested in this topic, you will happily sit for 17 hours and gobble up every morsel of information about sleep and how to get more of it. So I kind of just left it. It certainly covers all the bases and at the end, it says how you can be in touch with Elizabeth direct.
Even if this isn’t relevant to you right now, please share it with your friends who have babies…..sleep deprivation can be a horribly lonely experience and it’s vital to know you’re not alone.
Without further ado…..
The other reason I was prompted to interview Elizabeth was this bit of research that was released a few weeks ago. ABC reports in part:
“Paediatrician Harriet Hiscock from The Murdoch Children’s Research Institute was part of a world-first study that followed up 225 six-year-old children who had received behavioural sleep intervention as babies to assess their health including emotional wellbeing, behaviour and child-parent relationship. The study showed intervention during infancy significantly reduced sleep problems in children and depression among mothers during the first two years of the child’s life.
It found techniques including ‘controlled crying’ – which helps babies learn to put themselves to sleep by letting them cry for set periods of time – and positive bedtime routines, had no adverse affects on the emotional and behavioural development of children or their relationship with parents when compared to children who as babies had sleep problems but received no sleep intervention.
The study helps to reassure parents and health professionals about the safety of sleep interventions in infants aged six months and older, especially as a strategy to prevent and treat postnatal depression. Parents can feel reassured they are not harming their babies by using sleep interventions like controlled crying.”
I know this can be a huge area of contention for parents – the whole idea of sleep training or controlled crying or whatever you want to call it. Elizabeth and I will both get amongst the comments as much as we can over the next few days.
What did you do with your baby? Any sleep tips for your fellow readers?
To start your family sleeping, click here to download your copy of The Gift of Sleep now.
Comments
313 Comments so far
I think that many parents out there take it for granted that the ability to sleep is innate. Sure all babies will eventually go to sleep, but for how long and can they get themselves back to sleep when they wake up? I believe that babies need to be taught how to sleep. I used two different methods with my two children but have the most wonderful sleepers now. My sleep is now only interupted when the kids are sick or teething, otherwise they ALWAYS sleep through and at the ages of 3 and 21months they both still have at least 3hrs nap during the day most days.
With my 3yo I used the controlled crying method at around 6 months, never leaving her to cry for more than 5mins and usually only for 1 or 2 minutes. My neighbor (the child whispering genius) guided me through it and it worked within days. With my second I knew I had to implement the eat, play, sleep routine from day one always watching for tired signs during the play bit and putting him to bed the minute they appeared. I would put him to bed awake and leave him to go to sleep. If at some point he started crying I would go to him, shh him, pat his tummy and stroke his hair until he stopped crying, then I would leave him again. I never left him to cry unattended until he was 8 months and then it only took leaving him to cry for a minute twice before he got the hang of it and started sleeping all by himself. He has only fallen asleep in my arms once or twice and not since he was a newborn. That is something I kinda missed but so worth it for the quality of sleep I am now getting
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I usually bristle at the thought of sleep training, sleep whispering and controlled crying but I have learned to accept that not everybody can function on no sleep like my son and I did. You really have to do what is right for YOU and for your baby.
I never let my son cry EVER. I thought, and still do, that if I called my husband in the middle of the night and he ignored me and then patted me and came back again in 5 minutes I would hit him. And I would definitely sulk with him. And feel like he was not listening to me or understanding me.
I feel the same way with my child. As a baby he had no means of communication other than crying and so I always listened to him. That said I did not sleep a full night till he was 4.
BUT he is very happy, content and he can self soothe. He sleeps out at friends, he falls asleep by himself and is just a wonderful child. I am sure he would be just as wonderful a child if he learned to sleep at a younger age but I will never know because I cannot listen to children crying. Ever and at all
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I am on exactly the same page Lana, thanks for sharing your alternative view (and making me feel like less of a weirdo!)
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You mean you don’t agree with me?!?
You’re fired.
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If you fire me I will wake your children in the middle of the night…. but I wont let them cry
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ahhhh…. Lana, then i can come and give them back the GIFT OF SLEEP
YIP peeeeeeee!!!!!!!!!!
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I think that sleep training for babies makes the first two years of baby’s life easier for mum and bub. All kids WILL eventually start to sleep through the night of their own accord or fall into a sleep pattern of their own accord. It just might take a year (or 4!! Lana!!)
When J was born my business was 3 years old and in a key growth stage. Necessity dictated that my baby HAD to be a good sleeper and in a routine of some sort so that I could get help with his care.
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Thank you for sharing this. Definatly worth reading. I really reasonate with how she states that we cannot love as well when we are tired. This was one topic that I found difficult, as my son woke up 8-15 times a night and I was so scared to do controlled crying. I found something that helped me, but if it didnt work, then I would have no choice but to revisit the controlled crying. It is simply not possible to function…
I agree that there are two extremes views in this topic. BOTH are dangerous. My son was waking up 8-15 times a night and it had become quite traumatic. BUT I was told I was abusing him if I did controlled cryintg. NOT good at all for someone who has vowed to never be that way. It traumatised me even further. Thankfully, I found a soltuion.
On the other hand, it is also dangerous that we are told to do controlled crying before we even have our babies. We seriously do not know the true ramifications of this…Please visit a blog I wrote about a woman doing this from 2 weeks of age.
http://explorenewheights.com/wp-admin/post.php?post=159&action=edit&message=1
I must investigate it further the research presented, as I have research stipulating that ignoring a childs cry even for one minute will increase the amount of cortisol to the brain. In fact, they found that the anticipation alone had elicited this response.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-1305892/Six-month-old-babies-stressed-ignored-minutes-mothers.html
It is so hard as a mum, lacking sleep etc. It is worse with the conflicting information..
I would love to get a copy of the origjnal study and look at the design and statistics used. It would be interesting to learn how many times this controlled crying was done on each baby, as if it was only the few days then that would probably be fine, but what about the parents who have to revisit this method time and time again? There is no way in hell that it could benefit them. The amount of cortisol will permanently damage their brains… BUT, as I said, if it is not done over and over, then it would be worth it. I just do not know how often it works permanently, just like that! Just like a magic wand! Seriously, what happens when the child is sick, or teething or geniuenly needing your attention? You have to attend to them, then they would fall out of the pattern again etc….
I am only now seeing proper research on this topic. I searched every single academic journal and found NONE a year ago. Its a start at least
I like how they only recommend it from 6 months on. As so many are starting from the very begining.
We need more research into this topic, as this method is one of the most popular parenting methods.
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I looked after my best friends bub earlier in the week. She’s been having trouble with sleep, not so much at night but more he only catnaps during the day, ends up over tired and then bedtime is a nightmare until he finally goes to sleep and then he’s generally ok for the rest of the night. he’s almost 4mths.
So she dropped him over about noon and headed off to various appointments. He’d had a feed @11:30 and she said he’ll possibly have a catnap @30mins, another feed (she left expressed milk) @2:30 play etc and she’ll be there to get him at 5.
So by 1:15 he was looking for food (or comfort – the dummy worked a treat) and was all jerky and clearly tired. She’d not said to let him sleep but having 2 bubs myself, I knew he was tired so I thought I’m going to try some sleep whispering on him.
Anyhoo 5 mins later after a small fairly half arsed protest he was sound asleep.
He slept for 4 hours. He was that over tired.
She picked him up, gave him a feed and took him home and rang the next morning to say he slept like and angel and bedtime was a breeze – what had I done??
I explained very gently that he needs more than two or 3 30min naps a day. Sleep feeds sleep.
So she came over the next morning and we did some whispering together. At the point he was protesting she wanted to pick him up – as she normally would. I said no lets push through it so we patted him and shushed him and in minutes he was sound asleep. He slept here for 2 hours.
She used the same teqnique in the arvo and he slept 2.5 hours and went to bed like a dream.
She now thinks I’m god. but I simply know bubs need sleep and some protest, Pushing though and persisting can help some kiddies but the key is having someone there to support you through it as its mums instinct to pick up. My sis in law was my person with my first at @3mths and now I’ve been my best friends and I assume she’ll be someone’s person.
Some things you can’t do alone – and shouldn’t have to – as so many of us are having kids later and don’t necessarily have parents nearby to help etc this is perhaps where the sleep industry came in? They are people’s person.
Perhaps a small symptom of our generation having kids later.
So mums, get a professional or find yourself another mum to be your person and see how you go.
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Every new mum needs a friend like you. I wish I had a friend like you for when my bub is born in about 8 weeks!!!
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You can be my friend!
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AND MINE TOO…
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That’s amazing that your friend took on your advice. I have learned that sleep/letting babies cry is a very sensitive and personal issue and to NEVER offer my opinion in this regard!!
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From 3 months our son slept all night.even when having night feeds they were short and sweet and he often went back to sleep before I got to change his nappy. he was sleeping 7-5 night after night for the last year, going to sleep at night with no fuss at all (day sleeps? – not so good!).
all of a sudden in july (when I fell pregnant) he started to wake at 4/4.30 and a couple of times thru the night.tried differnt room/curtains/clothes/no sleep bag/new sleep bag/different bed/more dummies/no dummy/more cuddles/pats etc.
as a busy little toddler (17 months) he is just very tired alot of the time. so we are trying crying it out in the mornings so that he can sleep a little later than 5am.
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I too am a great believer in routines and sleep training. Not only has it been great for my girls but also for my own sanity! I chose to allow both my girls to self settle from an early age and it has been the best thing for our family. Our eldest slept through at 5 mths and our youngest at 7 weeks.
I do believe that consistency is they key. Elizabeth I will also be applying your three C’s ( calm, committed and consistent) when dealing with my toddler’s tantrums!!
If you do branch out into toddler behaviour, PLEASE let us know
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HA HA…You beautiful girls dont need me for that……keep up the consistency… x
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I know this may seem a bit commercial, but if you have Foxtel, tune into Super Nanny. She has some wonderful, practical ideas for encouraging positive behaviour in toddlers. As a teacher and Mum of a 2 year old, my mantra is catch them being good… when they start getting your attention for all the great things they do, it can really cause an energy shift in the whole household.
Keep smiling….
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YEP….ignore the BAD…praise the GOOD……
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Elizabeth’s caring and consistent approach is mirrored in the book I have used called “ON BECOMING BABYWISE”. This approach to infant management has worked for my 2 children, 10 nephew and nieces and countless other friends, with babies of all different personalities. It is truly the best “gift” for babies and their parents. It differs from Elizabeth’s approach, only in that it encourages a gradual implementation of basic ideas (eg self settling) from birth. It makes sense – get off to a great start and you won’t need the ‘magic wand’ of a baby whisperer at 6 months.
The basic idea: it follows a routine of FEED, PLAY, SLEEP every 3 hours (approx, depending on your baby) That sequence is repeated all day. Then at night it is just FEED and straight back to bed for SLEEP. It quickly teaches babies the difference between NIGHT and DAY (a key in achieving healthy, extended nighttime sleep).
Most babies using this approach achieve 8-10 hours of continuous nighttime sleep by 12 weeks, many by 9 weeks.
A key element of the FEED stage is that baby must receive a FULL FEEDING each time. No snacking. This goes against the advice of well meaning midwives, who encourage ‘demand feeding’. With a full feeding (eg 15 minutes each side for breastfeeding) babies receive the initial FORE MILK then after a few minutes the rich and fatty HIND MILK which fills them up. If they are only ‘snack feeding’ for a couple of minutes here and there, they never get that rich hind milk – no wonder they are looking for food again 45 mins later. I never realised this scientific fact – but it just makes so much sense.
Also, with regard to demand feeding, it seems the breast or bottle is offered every time the baby cries. This can be so confusing for Mums – not every cry means “I’m hungry”. It can mean bub is tired, has wind, has a dirty nappy, needs a new toy, or just a cuddle. The BABYWISE method gives Mums the confidence to know that they’ve had that full feed, so there must be another reason they are crying, and encourages Mums to use their intuition to solve the problem. Truth is, after a few weeks, BABYWISE babies tend to cry a lot less than unroutined babies.
A key element of the SLEEP part is that when nap time comes, baby goes into the cot awake (no rocking or feeding until they nod off). They learn to self settle, and as they have a full tummy and have had some nice play time, they are tired and ready for a sleep.
I’m not saying this method is all sunshine and roses from day one. Yes, there are times of crying, yes there is that feeling of uncertainty that every Mum feels. But it gives your day structure, and gives you confidence.
I don’t know what I would have done without it. I would recommend it for any Mum who is a fan of a flexible routine. It probably wouldn’t sit well with parent who prefer a more unstructured approach to babies.
Also my other tip for sleeping is put bub into their OWN ROOM from the 1st week home. Babies are noisy sleepers. You don’t want to be kept awake with every grunt, squeak, fart or snort. You’ll lie there awake thinking “are they going to wake up?”. Probably not – they are just cycling through a sleep faze. If they are in the next room, you don’t hear all those little sounds. But don’t worry, if they really want your attention, you would hear a real cry from anywhere in the house!!!
As Mia and Elizabeth said, sleep is truly a ‘gift’ for both parents and baby. Implementing some very simple ideas early on, can save so much heart ache down the road. Hugs for all the new Mums out there. Your not alone in your journey to have a sleeping baby, but help is at hand.
xx
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hi HOLLYBOO……Ta for kind words….yep!! you are on the right road with all your tips for parents…….sleep is a GIFT…..keep up the positive energy. eliz x
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Hi Hollyboo
You make some good points, thank you.
Just a comment on demand feeding though (for those unsure of terminology)… It does not have to mean snacking and feeding at every whimper. The way I understand demand feeding is watching for your baby’s signals that s/he is hungry (as opposed to tired, uncomfortable etc) and feeding then ie “Watch you baby, not the clock”. That way your stated principles of full feeds, plenty of hindmilk etc are still achieved without a strict routine if that does not suit the family. Demand feeding in this context worked well for me.
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Midwives usually advise demand feeding because they want mothers to get a decent initial supply of breast milk, that’s why.
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i certainly demand fed which to me meant fed when the baby was hungry, but did not mean snacking, i gave FULL feeds each time, i wouldn’t have put a timer on but it would have been at least 15 mins. i just didn’t try to fit it into a schedule which is what i have heard about babywise.
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Isn’t it against SIDS recommendations to have a baby in their own room from birth…?
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Yes it is Kbomb but we put our girl into her own room after 6 days and we all slept better for it. I think like everything you have to weigh up the risks/benefits.
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love babywise, used it for both my kiddos and its worked so well!
thanks for explaining it all on this post so i dont have to, lol…. the whole series is hugely helpful and gives mum annd baby the gift of sleep and a sense of order in a chaotic time of life!
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I am a firm believer in sleep training. I had a horror start with my first (reflux including a stay in hosp due to her vomiting blood) and absolutely no more than 40 minutes at at time sleep. Once her meds were working she was in the habit of still waking every 40 mins around the clock. My husband and I were absolutely ‘crazy’ exhausted after a few months. After sticking to a strict routine she took to it easily and things improved dramatically for everyone. She still has reflux issues even at age 6. My son on the other hand is and still was a dream baby. I started a similar routine with him in the hospital straight after I had him and I can count on two hands the amount of times I have got up in the night to him in three years and it is usually when he is sick. I have two very happy well adjusted kids that get 10-12 sleep every night and so do we!!!
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Thanks so much for this Mia. I too went to tresillian about day sleeps when my first was 6 months and that gave me the confidence to let him cry for 10 minutes before going in to see what was up and reassure him. I was a lucky one – in that he never ever made it to 10 minutes (to my amazement as when he cried I always felt that he was in dire need).
What would be REALLY helpful now for me would be if you could find someone like Elizabeth but who helps families one on one with toddler discipline/training. I have been to the positive parenting course, which is great, but am finding that there are just so many iterations of behaviour and contexts when things occur that I am never sure I have got it right. And I am having trouble getting a time out to work – we have created a naughty step but our place is very small and it is difficult to get anywhere which is separate, also difficult to get him to stay in it. And then of course difficult to work out when to use it consistently between mum and dad….
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Oh Petra, I’m so with you. I really need a ‘Toddler Whisperer’!
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I have helped friend with advice on toddlers more than once, the key to manageing toddlers is to lower your expectations and be consistant with what you expect from them.
I find that as mothers we forget that theese little toddlers are just that – toddlers.
So often we expect them to be grown up… they still need sleeps and food far more frequently than we realise and sometimes they don’t have the means of communicating that yet. The number of times tantrums have been averted around here because I realised that a child needed a cracker/banana/drink or was just tired are amazing.
I have 3 and the youngest is 2 1/4 …. and they have all thrown a woobly or 2 at the shops, but are generally good kids.
Hope this all helps a little. I am by no means perfect and make mistakes too!
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What I would like to say is that I beilieve it is horses for courses. There a couple of points I would make
1) We did this as a total last resort to get an exhausted infant to get some sleep to be healthy. Not for convenience or to fit in with any ‘ideal’ but to help my child function.
2) I felt I also needed to do it as my very lively son would take the presence of someone in the room as more opportunity to play. Playing is great until you need to sleep. He has to sleep at some point, therefore he needed to be left alone in a supportive way to learn to sleep by himself, because he would not do it with someone else in the room.
3) It was two nights in the context of a loving family all the rest of the time. He was spending hours crying anyway with me there, so I felt we needed to do something different.
All kids are different, but my gut feeling is that I did the right thing for my child.
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hi pixi, I agree with your coments for 2 nites of discomfort …to have sleeping bubs…know which i would prefer… so important for little ones to secure good sleep…it helps them grow and become calmer little people. keep up the grat work. eliz
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I sympathise with sleep deprived parents, (sleep deprivation has been used as a form of torture). However, I can’t say I agree with letting babies cry too much.
Reason: If you go to any orphanage you will notice the babies don’t cry much. They learn there is no reason to cry as there aren’t enough staff to come and meet their needs. Very sad. Ie; babies cry for a reason, even if that reason is just comfort and love.
Just a thought.
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You’re absolutely right about babies in orphanages and other neglected children, but I’m sure no-one here is advocating letting babies cry unattended for extended periods. Most parents attempt a sleeping program when they are desperate. They are desperate because their child is not only not sleeping but also spending a lot of time crying despite the parent’s best efforts to soothe them.
I hate seeing my kids upset (and the oldest is 15 now!) and I tried everything to soothe my firstborn when he was a newborn. For the first 10 months of his life he didn’t sleep for longer than 45 mins at a time – night or day. Despite my best efforts – breastfeeding on demand, cuddling, rocking etc – my much loved baby was clearly unhappy a lot of the time. Finally at my MCH nurse’s suggestion I sought help through a sleep “school”. The program was gentle. My son was never allowed to cry for more than a few minutes at a time without intervention. He sorted himself out in a few days. Once he learned to settle himself he was a much happier baby.
I’m not saying it’s for everyone, but I think that it does need to be recognised that parents who take this option have their child’s best interests at heart and are not doing this to ‘punish’ their child.
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I take your point that parents are just trying to help their child sleep and are often feeling pretty desperate. Sorry if I offended. Peace.
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The REALITY is this- We can USE what we KNOW from what happens to children in orphaneges as a guide on what we should be doing.
If controlled crying works like MAGIC, then that would be perfect. BUT the REALITY is this- What would you do when you bay gets a temperature every 6 weeks? What will you do when your baby has a sore tummy? You will attend to them. Then what happens next? You have to do this OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! that is for MOST people anyway. If it was only the few days. THEN IT WOULD BE WORTH IT. BUT be HONEST PLEASE. It is NOT a magic wand that you do just once for most babies. I was traumatised by this and I WOULD DEFINATLY agree if it was just for a few nights. THAT IS NOT TRUE. JUST BE HONEST about this!!!!!!!
ELIZABETH- what do you tell parents to do when their babies are likely to get temperatures reguraly? Do you tell them not to attend to their babies? You seem lovely and with geniuene intentions, BUT could possibly be unintentionally doing damage.
IF you agree that babies should be attended to when they are unwell, then you must agree that this magic wand is something parents need to revisis TIME AND TIME AGAIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Both Mia and Elizabeth have a beautiful energy about them. This is not personal at all. I am not judging.
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No offence taken
I just wanted to make the point for all those mums struggling right now. It can be soul destroying when your child doesn’t sleep. All you want is your baby to be happy.
People who care enough about their children to seek professional help need our support, not judgement. (This is a general comment not directed at you specifically, Sceptic. It’s clear that you comments were well meant.)
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This is a sensitive and touchy topic. But I think all mum’s do whatever they do, with the best of intentions. And you can only do what you feel comfortable with. No point following some text book method if it doesn’t ‘feel’ right for you. I do agree that all children are different and what works for one may not necessarily work for another.
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I agree completely.
I know a number of people who swore by Save Our Sleep, so I diligently started reading it. However, it just did not sit right with me – did not resonate with me, the theories didn’t gel for me and I did not feel it was right for my son. I had to endure lectures from said friends about why I *must* follow it, but I stuck with my instincts. Fantastic that it works for others though.
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This is the most distressing post I have read in a long time – for any one even vaguely interested, please consider some of the other research that is absolutely opposed to controlled crying. For example, the Australian Association of Infant Mental Health says in their position paper; ‘the widely practised technique of controlled crying is not what infants need for their optimal emotional and psychological health and may have unintended emotional consequences’. Just because a baby goes to sleep with this technique (after hours of crying in some cases) does not mean that they are learning to sleep. Equally, just because they appear to be happy the next day does not mean that emotional damage has not been done. Imagine that you are barely 6 months old – as in the case of your daughter, Mia – you are completely reliant on someone else for all your needs – how would you feel if you were crying for hours and nobody came? Remember a baby does not have the brain capacity to understand that ‘mum is tired and just trying to help me to learn to sleep’. Psychologists such as Robin Grille (Parenting for Peaceful World) say that ‘by the time the baby has given up on calling you, he has gone through a defeat response… a state of shock or numbing out. Ignoring a baby undermines his trust, sense of safety and emotional security which can have adverse effects on his later behaviour and relationships.’
YES – mothers and fathers need their sleep. But there are far more gentle techniques on hand – check out Elizabeth Pantley’s website for example. So much of it has to do with our unrealistic expectations of what a baby is capable of and our own inability to put our needs aside and understand that this is a stage of parenting where perhaps we have to give up on achieving the perfect career, house, social life etc etc. It is also very much about how, as a community we need to support mothers, particularly those who are unable to afford paid help, – it does take a community to raise a child, and lets remember that this is what we are raising – children not dogs who need to be trained by the time they are 6 months old!
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And yet the practice of wrapping a baby, kissing it goodnight, and walking out of the room and shutting the door has been common practice for generations…Are all those millions of now-adults harmed by it?
I don’t believe it was for my own needs. I don’t need much sleep anyway. I did it because babies don’t know how to put themselves to sleep and so you have to train them. And that they need a lot more sleep than a lot of them get to grow and develop.
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Babies don’t know how to walk either but we don’t force them to start before they are developmentally ready, why do it with sleep?
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I don’t think Elizabeth advocates unchecked crying for hours and hours. Probably start with 5 mins, go in and pat, soothe or rock. Then back to the cot. Leave for another 10 minutes, repeat the calming techniques, then 20 minutes etc.
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I understand what you are saying, but lets face it- 1 in 3 will experience depression. I do not think they are ok.
We do not know the true ramifications of controlled crying. We just dont.
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You raise some critical questions. What actually happens throughout those nights? She probably makes them cry for 1 min, then 2, then 3, and builds it until they are allowed to cry for 20 minutes. I have seen time and time again throughout this thread are deep sense of DENIAL by most people using this technique. That is- “we are not leaving them” “we are attending to them”. How can people say that you are NOT leaving them? You are! How can you say you are attending to them, when you are purposefully leaving them for an unbearable amount of time. What is going on in peoples minds when they think of 20 minutes is just fine for a precious baby? I do not believe Karitanee advocate leaving your child for that long?
I have asked Elizabeth time and time again throughout this thread if she is aware of cortisol and the dangers of it. I have no response.
She looks lovely and seems geniuene in wanting to help, but may not necessarily understand that what she is doing can be harmful to children.
I agree that you did the right thing by your child. It is fabulous that you have had the training in psych to know and understand different temperament styles and just how critical it is that we meet the needs of that child. My concern is that there are millions of parents out there with children who have similar temperament styles leaving them to cry to sleep, because they trust the advise from well intentioned so called professionals.
This approah needs so much investigation. I am so tempted to do my PHD on it!!!!
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sorry the above message has appeared twice as it is in response to Amandas concerns above..:)
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Well said! I agree babies shouldn’t be left to cry, they do get it eventually, and our job at the beginning should be raising that baby…so you can nap when they nap, and not feel teh pressure to ‘perform’.
I know some people think they can’t afford to not work, but for most it is a choice. We rent a small house (yes, our babies will share a room when we have our second next month – gasp!), live off one very modest income, and we simply give up extras, because we believe it’s better we look after our bub as much as she needs. And this means picking her up or reassuring her when she’s upset at night.
Babies aren’t machines, they are all very different, and I think they need to be loved and cared for accordingly.
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Wacky, you sound like a wonderful mum, and good on you for providing a wonderful nuturing home for your child/children.
Sadly your solution is not available to everyone.I was able to stay at home when my first came along but I know many women who truly do not have this option, and not because they have a fancy house or take overseas holidays. I’m a teacher and many families whose children I have worked with live just above the poverty line and that’s with two incomes.
As for napping when your baby naps, that’s not always possible either – my first baby never slept for longer than 45 mins at a time. I’d just be falling asleep when he’d be waking up. My second and third babies were much better sleepers, but there was no way I could sleep when they slept during the day because of the other kids. When you have several children you need to take everyone’s needs into account.
It really is a matter of not judging others and doing what works for your own family.
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I feel this induces way too much guilt in parents who do try controlled crying/comforting. I get sick of seeing upset tired mums and overtired babies.
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My daughter is now 20 months and when I put her down for a sleep in the evening, or during the day and she waves goodbye and blows me a kiss, I thank my lucky stars that at 4.5 months I went to Tresillian. I wasn’t going to go until she was 8 months (that’s when our appointment was) but apparently my folder was marked “URGENT” and I managed to get in on a cancellation 10 days after registering with them. It was a godsend. The nurses there were ALL caring, thoughtful, kind, considerate and understanding. I was so apprehensive about my little girl being in her own room and also aware that she was not yet 6 months, but as she was only sleeping a maximum or 8 out of every 24 hours (on a good day) I was prepared to go even if it meant just her day time sleeping improved.
Whilst in there a few people (other mothers and a nurse) commented that when she was put onto solids (I was exclusively breastfeeding) her sleep would improve – but actually it was much simpler than that – she was not a back sleeper. Everything we read tells us to put the baby on the back but when my little girl was rolled onto her side, patted on her bottom and “shhh shhh’d” to, she settled and in time learnt to go to sleep.
“But SIDS says no side or tummy sleeping!” I argued, but after much reassurance (and me constantly checking her) we discovered that once out of her wrap she would roll herself onto her side anyway, and a month or so later onto her stomach – something which you may not even be aware of unless you watch your child the whole time they sleep.
At Tresillian they had parenting courses, cooked all meals, offered counselling and daily feedback sessions – it was like going to a retreat in a way. When we went home I stuck to the routine of feeding 3-5 hourly and feed/play/sleep as much as I could and now we have a child (have had since she was 12 months who has 1 daytime sleep (ranging between 45 minutes and 2 hours) and says “bye bye” to us when we put her down at 7pm and sleeps through until between 7 and 8 in the morning.
Tresillian were amazing. I read every book there was and I think a lot of them have great routines, if only the babies had read the books too. In the end, biting the bullet admitting I needed help and going to the residential unit were the best thing for us.
Ironically, a few months later, all the babies in my mums group who had been perfect sleepers were the ones that couldn’t put themselves to sleep, while my little girl had learnt how to do it. It did involve leaving her to cry but I was always “allowed” to go in, there were no time restrictions, it was more about listening to her cries and learning the difference between a tired cry, a hungry cry and a “there is no way I’m going to bed now cry”!!!
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After another shocking night this post has given me hope.
Do you know of any good sleep whisperers in Perth?
We haven’t slept a full night in over a year and sometimes get woken up to 4 times by our lovely 13 month old. We need sleep……Zzzzzzzzzzz
A thousand thank yous for the post!
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Yes http://www.saveoursleep.com good luck.
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Thanks Kim. I’ve read the book (twice), had my partner read it and read everything on the website. I have tried TH’s routine and whilst it worked OK in the day my baby always wakes at night.
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I went to the Sleep Works program (free!) run by my local Child Development Centre in Joondalup – was fantastic. Im sorry I don’t know the number but i think all councils run them so try your local council first. They are run once a month and it was was just two morning (one each week).
Good luck!
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I’ve heard that NGALA (near Rockingham) do overnight sleep help stays and day clinics, it helped my cousin heaps
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Andrea Bogue. Friends of mine swear by her.
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leonie clements mobile mothercraft nurse dont know her number just google will do night visits ,phone supports etc.
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Hi
My sister-in-law and her husband recently adopted twin girls .. both barely 3 months old .. and they are staying with us. It will be a huge understatement to say that only the mother is depressed because of the crying and lack of sleep of the babies!!
Your talk with Elizabeth has thrown up quite a few interesting observations and it is something am going to suggest to my s-i-l.
Jose Steeple
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I have a ten year old girl and 6 year old twin girls. I practised controlled crying with all of them and they all had sleeps through the day until they were four. It was the best thing I ever did. They were refreshed and happy having the appropriate amount of sleep.
When my twins were born I was given a good tip from a close friend who also had twins – no matter what, feed them at the same time during the night. If one wakes to feed then wake the other to feed too otherwise you will be up all night feeding both whenever they decide to wake. Also, they learn very quickly to sleep through if the other baby is crying so don’t panic if one is still crying and one has gone off to sleep. My saviour was Dr Brian Symon in Adelaide. His book is “Silent Nights” and he does phone consultations.
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I have just sat with my hands poised over the keyboard for about 5 minutes, wondering where the hell to start. This is an emotional topic for me I guess…
This time 3 years ago I was a crying, cranky, fat mess. LittleDude fought sleep from the word go, along with any methods we tried to get him to stay down a little bit longer. The basic ‘rules’ of controlled crying state that you should leave the child for increasing amounts of time, going in periodically to reassure them that they are OK and it is safe for them to go to sleep on their own.
NUP
LittleDude figured out very early on that each time I came into the room to comfort him, I was just going to go away again. Every time I went in, he would cry harder knowing that I was going to leave. After trying a few times, I thought that it would be best not to go in at all, just to let him cry himself to sleep.
NUP
A solid hour of screaming, choking hysteria, and I knew that this was not for me. He was waking up about every 2 hours, round the clock, no matter what we tried, so to spend an hour each time screeching just wasn’t working. LittleDude was breastfed or rocked to sleep until about 18 months, and still now I sit in his room until he is asleep.
AJ, however, is wired differently. Controlled crying theory actually translated into practice quite easily. He can put himself to sleep when I pop him into bed (anyone’s bed actually), and he only wakes once a night, possibly twice.
You cannot imagine the RELIEF when it became clear that AJ was not going to cause us the absolute shattering sleeplessness that LittleDude did. And does. I genuinely think that it is just because they are two completely different temperaments that doing the same strategy worked in almost polar opposite ways.
I don’t have much to offer in the way of advice, except to hang in there. You will get through it, you will look back on it, and one day you will just be glad to know where they are at 3.00am!
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totally agree. it depends on the child. even though most babies “should or are able to” sleep through by 6 months, i think there is a lot more going on wtih 6 month olds than just their need or lack there of, of milk through the night. i have 3 kids, my first slept through at 11 months and never stopped, my second didn’t even consider it until 18 months and had to be taught with a lot of convincing that it was good for him and my third new how to do it from almost the beginning. when i look at the kids now, aged 8, 6 and 1 and half, my 8 year old has never thrown a tantrum in his life and does not need a huge amount of physical contact to feel secure, my second child is the most affectionate boy i know and still needs lots of physical contact (hence his distress when i left him in a dark room to cry himself to sleep) and my third, a little girl is extremely independent and very happy to hang out in her cot with her blanket until she is tired enough to put herself to sleep. i did try a sleep whisperer with my second child at around 8 months and the trauma it caused me was not worth it. i waited until he was 18 months and i knew he understood what i was saying when i said good night and slowly but surely we managed to get him sleeping through.
my favourite saying as a mum at difficult times is “and this too shall pass”. keep it in mind when your baby wakes you for the 5th time in a night.
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Baby whisperers are fantastic!
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Such a sensitive topic with so much conflicting advice for mums. As a psychologist I see so many women struggling with lack of sleep and then at the same time dealing with peoples judgements about what they ought to be doing with their baby!! I have 3 gorgeous boys and now hitting the 6 month mark with the baby. My own tendency has always been to spoil them rotten (and keep all their doting carers happy) by lots of cuddling rocking co sleeping and breast feeding. And then come six months when I am tired out of my mind and over having little koalas I bite the bullet and follow a sleep programme. Always works a treat. Keeps my mother guilt in check but end up with happy mum and bub.
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I took my son to the Tresillian (Nepean ) clinic only 2 months ago. He was 9 months old at the time.
He had ” slept through ” from 8 weeks old until around 4 months of age at which time its like someone flipped a switch in him and he stopped sleeping through and started getting progressibely worse and worse. Its started with one wake up a night, then two, until he was waking up to 6 times a night, and wanting to STAY awake for hours at a time. After one night where my son woke at 11pm and didnt go back to sleep til 6am i finally cracked and begged for a referral to Tresillian.
Its the best thing i ever did – the nurses were so lovely and though i cried on the first day because i felt bad leaving him to cry when he was upset, it was the right thing for us. Its now 2 months later and he sleeps 11-12 hours EVERY NIGHT…. bliss!
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Again, please contact your local child health clinic for help. We run (in our district), sleep appointments, day stay (where you have 1 on 1 with a nurse for about 6 hours) and we can refer to the residential Ellen Barron centre (where you can stay for a few days. It’s not perfect, but we get mums from other districts coming to us for help. I’m sure other states provide a similar service.
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Am 4 months pregnant with my second at the moment as was thinking yesterday about what things i would do this time round. My first answer was to not feel guilt about sleep training and controlled crying. My first is now almost 4 as all the guilt I felt about how I was emotionally scarring her while trying, trying to cope with her constant crying has been unfounded….
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1st,where can I get that cupcake?!(lol)Just wrote the longest post in the world about all 3 of my babies, but while downloading a photo forgot to click submit.Oh well,it was a nice,”thinking back” blog anyway.
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Well my experience of having triplets is that it was a bit like having a home based child behaviour experiment. I did everything and I mean everything by the book (or rather by mulitple books!), was consistent, stayed calm, followed a routine, wrapped etc etc from very early days and one baby got it straight away, one took a while (about a month) and one needed that extra little push in the right direction that is controlled crying. I very much doubt that you could tell which was which now.
I will add that on occasion I had 2 or 3 crying at once. When I was on my own this would mean picking one to settle by walking and rocking etc. Often the other(s) would settle by themselves while I was rocking and walking. Made me realise that sometimes the rocking bit was about me “doing something” rather than about baby needing the movement. Oh, and yes I did have a convoluted system for deciding who got picked so I wasn’t playing favourites!
Good luck to all the mums out there struggling with sleep deprivation and babies.
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doneanddusted – you win. The end.
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Hey done and dusted, I want to tell you that you are awesome and tough to deal with triplets!
I have friends who have triplet girls and it was insane how little the parents slept during that first year. The Father worked long hours and needed to get up at night and help feed and do all those baby things. In the end they got a nanny to help just at night. It was insane!
And my friends said that the doctor asked if they were up for the challenge as the statistics are terrible for marriage breakups. Something like 75% of couples break up during the first year of parenting triplets. Scary! Lucky they are still together and going strong – the triplets are 6 now and they were renovating for 3 years of that, trying to live in a small 2 bed apartment while they were 2. That is why they – like yourself are……Done and Dusted.
xxxx
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I can definitely understand that statistic but so glad I didn’t know that at the time!. I had a few moments when I thought we were not going to make it BUT we were lucky to get healthy bubs (no reflux etc) and generally pretty easy going bubs. However, mine are approaching 2 now and I can’t imagine them in a 2 bedroom apartment – sends shivers down my spine. Kudos to your friends. Mine have definitely learnt at an early age how to work together to wreak a trail of destruction.
My paed told me that the one advantage of multiples was that you realise how little is your fault! One of the wisest things I think I have ever been told. 3 babies, same parenting and 3 completely different personalities. Makes me a firm believer that mums should go easier on themselves!
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my friend hated his mother in law until the triplets arrived and she moved in with him and his wife. he now says he loves her and she is amazing and they are a very happy family!
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Something in the air or maybe Mia also got the same press release….but on this subject there is also a great article on Essential baby yesterday.
http://www.essentialbaby.com.au/baby/caring-for-baby/australian-babies-most-sleepdeprived-study-20101123-18524.html
Worth a read- essentially saying that Australian babies are sleep deprived.
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It was on the Today show as well…
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Yeah – I meant to put that in also but didn’t want to detract from the Murdoch Institute research which was scientific!
One of the things I realised when I considered the arguments around controlled crying is that when your baby is waking through the night, you’re not the only one exhausted – so are they!
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I agree that they are tired too. However, it depends also on how many times they wake up and for how long they stay awake. When my son was waking up 10 times a night, he still slept as long as I was rocking him. It was just too much.
But if he only woke up 2-3 times and had a quick breastfeed, that will not hinder him at all. He is still getting all the sleep he needs….
Mia, have you considered the research on how a stressed baby will have elevated levels of cortisol in their brain, which can affect their neurochemistry?
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I think it is very important to remember that they seem to come ‘programmed’ and it is not always possible to take one routine and apply it to all babies – I have had pretty good sleepers but there are times when the routine fails for a few months for no apparent reason and then we settle into a slightly different, but effective routine. I still put my 5yo and 3yo to bed before 7pm every night and one will sleep until 7.30-8 if you let her and the other is up between 5.50 and 6.30 every morning – what can you do??? They have a very similar routine and eating habits but apparently my older daughter needs more sleep than her sister.. one piece of advice I would have is that if you don’t plan to have a 4yo in your bed, you are best to set the rule early as it is a hard habit to break, especially once they are in a bed and can get out and climb into yours!!
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When I had my first I never put him down as I was gazing at him so much. Everyone wanted a nurse and he loved the attention. He used to be put to sleep on the breast and then quickly and quietly put down with the skill of a bomb defuser. So hard – I would get him to the cot and put him in there and Wahhhhhhh!
This went on for 6 months. I was so tired and ended up trying controlled crying in the day. Only thing, I was naughty and put the dummy in and picked him up and fed him every little bit and kept sticking him down. Eventually he slept through the day and once he learned that he just went through the night too.
Second child the same thing happened. I rang Tresillian in a meltdown at 7 months without a break and was ready to jump on a plane to Sydney and I got some sympathetic help over the phone and I palmed the older 2 year old off to my sister in law’s for the day and I proceeded to control cry my second boy. Same thing – once he learned during the day, he slept at night.
I thought this was what would happen for my third baby and he was a self settler. So I thought he would be so easy. He was easy and I would just pop him down and he would sleep well, but he was always waking for a night feed. He was good and would just go back to sleep, but he didn’t go through until he weaned from breastfeeding at 17 months. So I never got a full straight nights sleep for 17 months. I was pretty buggered, but being my last baby, I was quite happy most of the time to get up to him.
I do think that I sleep better without a baby in bed with me and I always had them in their own room. Only thing – when I go somewhere and stay at friends houses, my baby won’t sleep as he thinks it is fun when mum and dad are in the same room. Can’t wait for him to get to that age where he doesn’t care so much about that and sleep anywhere for me.
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I haven’t yet watched the videos but as I’m nearly 7 months pregnant – absolutely will be…. I’m still scarred emotionally from my first experience with now 2 yr old daughter.
She actually had silent reflux. I’m not sure if this makes her an excpetion to the sleep intervnetion rules, but she cried constantly, and rarely slept for more than 2 hours at a time in the first 6 months.
After seeking advice from my paedeatrician on the subject of ‘just letting her cry herself to sleep’ at about the 3 months of age mark, he flatly said no.
He went on to tell me that crying for a minute or so is ok. But just leaving a baby to cry will promote the release of adrenalyn, which will if anything; make the child’s cry more intense and make the baby more awake.
I asked why. He told me that if a baby is left to cry for too long, the baby automatically goes into danger mode, thus releasing adrenalyn. That freaked me out and I never let her cry for more than 1-2 minutes in the first year.
Look I realise no 2 babies are the same, and different sleep theories work on some babies but not others… but I just don’t sit comfortably with the idea of letting my helpless baby cry.
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hi cindy, lets be clear…no one suggesting babies should be left to helplessly cry…totally not appropriate… or okay in any form… elizabeth
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You don’t attempt controlled crying with a reflux baby, doesn’t work. Unfortunately your other baby may also have reflux, it tends to run in families. You could be lucky hough, here’s hoping…
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It’s important to establish that ‘crying it out’ and ‘controlled crying’ are two completely different techniques, and often get confused with one another
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Every mum is simply doing the best they can.
My concern is this- The peadiatrician has said no more than 1-2 mins of crying. The research presented below suggest that even 1 minute will elevate cortsisol levels.
However, this method requires you leave your child for up to 20 mins at a time. Yes, we are encouraged to build on it. But, what are the ramifications?
It is certainly an interesting topic for scientist to investugate extensively as thus far it has been a neglected area.
You say leaving a child to cry helplessly is never ok. I agree. The issue is that the cortisol levels wouls have leveated way before a baby gets to that stage of distress.
This is a hard topic for mums. As I can certainly see both sides of this debate
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I’ve read that the people who originally developed the concept of ‘controlled crying’ never intended its use on infants under 6 months of age.
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You’re right about that.
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Seriously Mia, you have no idea how timely this post is!!! Not only am I going to sit here for half an hour and gobble this information up, I’m going to devour it. I am desperate and so is a friend of mine, who I will be forwarding this post on to immediately! Thank you, thank you, thank you for being a mind reader xxx
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Oh…good luck!
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Oh a topic very near and dear to my heart!!
I am very routined with my girls (22 months and 4 months) and have been big on setting good sleep habits from early on with both of them. I often get people scoff at routines and then in the next breath say how lucky we are to have good sleepers and how happy my girls are… it’s not a coincidence people!
The things I’ve done with both mine are:
* Let them self settle from early on. That is put them down for every sleep awake and let them drift off themselves. With my first this was from 4 weeks and with my 2nd from 2 weeks.
* Anything before 6am is counted as a night feed – done in their rooms, minimal interaction and straight back to bed afterwards. Anything after 6am is counted as starting the day – so noise, stay up for a play after etc.
* The 7pm bedtime and a bedtime routine. We had this in place by 3 weeks with my first and from the day she came home with my 2nd. Dinner is at 5pm followed by family time and play, bath at 6pm, final feed (for the youngest) at 6.15pm and in bed by 6.30-7pm. Every. Single. Night. My first slept through 12 hours from 10 weeks and every night since. My 2nd slept 10+ hours from 11 weeks and is still going strong.
* During the day I initially watched for tired signs and kept a watch on their “awake time”. Now with my four month old she goes down at the 2 hour mark and sleeps for 2 hours. She doesn’t look tired at the 2 hour mark because she doesn’t need to – she knows mummy is keeping an eye.
* I also think a good feeding routine goes hand in hand with a good sleep routine. Discourage snacking and you’ll get better feeders and sleepers.
I am unapologetic about this approach. I’m happy and rested and my girls are too. And for anyone who says having a routine makes it too hard to go out, I disagree. It makes it easier as I know what time to take my girls out when they will be well rested and happy… therefore making it a less stressful event for all!
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Ditto to all the above – with the slight difference of bedtime being 5pm (she did that on her own and nothing I could do would shift it) from birth to 12 months – 5pm – 5am. 1 – 2 was 6pm to 6am and we are finally out to 7pm to 7am.
Other than that, couldn’t agree more.
I honestly don’t see how kids who don’t get enough sleep can be a good thing. They need a lot of sleep and as their parent its your (my) job to make that happen.
I think the trend to follow their lead, do whatever they want etc is the first step to ‘being your childs friend’. I’m not her friend. I’m her mum. My job foremost is for her to feel loved, fed, well rested, healthy and educated. Even if it means she has to do stuff she doesn’t want to.
Sleep is like food for little people. They need it to grow and develop. a 5 minute cry (and anyone who has controlled cried knows that is only the first few times) is a small price to pay to help them get the rest they need to do all those other miraculous things we love about them.
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James…..totally agree…sleep so vital for little people…They do need it to grow..and develop strong gross motor skills…spot on your response.
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This is EXACTLY how I did it with my two kids and I too have what I refer to as “genius sleepers”
I have a routine and putting it in place when they were young as possible has meant that I can predict their behavior at different times of the day and can plan my day accordingly, meaning less chance of supermarket tantrums 
While I did controlled crying with my now 3yo at 6 months, with my youngest I encouraged self settling from day 1, and never left him to cry until he was 8 months. The younger they are when you start, the easier it is to implement.
In my experience routines centered around sleep and naps have resulted in good sleepers. Now as they get older we are able to be more flexible with the routine, there are days when they don’t have a nap but make up for it overnight and sometimes they go to bed later for special occasions, but then the next day we reinforce the routine and everything is back to normal.
This also means that while we did miss out on some social stuff for a couple of years while they learned to sleep, we now get to enjoy it even more than most mums I know because we can happily alter their routine to fit or leave them with babysitters and know that they will go to sleep (also then the babysitter gets an easy night and is more than happy to come again).
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Shamelessly agree with you Kate.
My two kids are both great sleepers and we have a third on the way that I plan on doing the exact same thing with.
I get so over swallowing the ‘oh you just got lucky’ comments from my sleep deprived friends juggling their difficult, exhausted babies.
I now say nothing of my methods when the subject comes up as I am a bit over the implication that I am somehow cruel for having ever left them to cry- whilst they think they are doing the heroic thing by exhausting themselves.
But since this blogged asked…(thanks Mia)- here has been my method:
- from day one feed them every 3 hrs during the day (wake them up if necessary) and leave them to do whatever, whenever they need at night (10pm to 7am)
- never feed them to sleep- ie always follow some kind of a feed, play(awake), sleep pattern.
- look for tired signs, always wrap them and put them down to sleep whislt still awake to help them learn to settle themselves.
- never get stuck in too rigid a pattern of ‘having’ to ahve the same bed, room, light, noise conditions etc. I gave them the same pattern every day- but always felt free to go out and about whenever and they have always slept in the pram, car, friends house- wherever.
My little girl slept through from 4 months or so- but was only waking for one 4am feed before then and never really cried at all.
My little boy was a dream till 4 months and then started waking repeatedly in the night. We were moving house heaps at the time and so I didnt feel I could do anything about it. After a month of sleep deprivation I decided to do the control crying and take away his dummy. It took 3 nights like everyone says it does and he has been a dream since then- a lighter sleeper than my little girl. But still regular and reliable.
My view is that 3 days of intermittent crying to get a lifetime of good sleep habits set up is the opposite of cruel.
It just takes a little bit of persistence and a sense that you are the parent, and you do know best- on this subject at least.
Good luck- whatever your choice!
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It really annoys me too when people say ‘oh, aren’t you lucky to have two such good sleepers’. NOT LUCK. LOTS OF HARD WORK. Sticking to a routine, staying home when necessary in early months, lots of planning ahead and like you, lots of attention to bedtime routine and time. From the moment they gained back their birth weight I worked at their sleep patterns.
Now, if only someone could tell me the routine necessary to deal with 3 year old belligerence….
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Oh my god, so good to hear someone else say that! I too am tired of people saying “you just got lucky” with my two great sleepers. My first daughter slept through at 10 weeks – bed at 7, quiet feed at 10, then sleep til about 6, 6:30. I was really strict with routine & teaching her to self settle. People would say I just got lucky & “wait til your second, it’ll be totally different!”. Well, my second daughter just turned 1 & she is an even better sleeper than her sister! I used the exact same techniques with her, and she was just a dream right from the start.
Now I’m pregnant with my third, and I plan to do the exact same with this one. However, I’ll probably keep it to myself, as it’s gotten to the point where when people are talking about their terrible sleepers, I don’t say a word because I’m kind of made to feel guilty! A bit of luck maybe, but also a HUGE amount of hard work!
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I have three children, aged 4, 2 and 13 months. And I have another baby due early January. Because we have had our kids so close together, I always felt that without proper sleep, our whole family would suffer.
We’ve done the controlled crying thing with each of our kids from 6 months old, and generally it’s only taken about 3 or 4 nights before they get the idea. It’s saved our sanity, and my kids are all refreshed and happy in the mornings. They happily go to bed at 7.30-8pm, all three of them will sleep straight through for 11-12 hours.
I think it’s all about just doing what you feel is right, my sister has co slept with all five of her kids and hasn’t slept alone with her husband in 7 years…personally I couldn’t think of anything worse, but she wouldn’t have it any other way and her kids are always happy, content and generally thriving!
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cara jane, you’ve just summed it up perfectly. If you tried your sister’s methods, you’d go insane. If she tried yours, she’d go batty. Different things work for different families, and once you find what works for yours then stick with it!
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Couldn’t agree more! No one knows your babies like you do. Do what works for your family and be supportive to friends and family who also do what works for them. There’s no right or wrong way, there’s only what’s right for your family, the same thing doesn’t work for everyone and that’s OK.
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Two weeks ago Elizabeth came to our place.
She changed our way of life.
Before she came, our little boy loved a dummy, a wrap and a boob with his evening sleep. Days were a dream but when the sun went down, a sleep monster emerged. I was exhausted – mentally and physically. If you’ve been there … I don’t need to describe what this is like. Oh, the tears … !!!
Since Elizabeth came, our son has been able to self-settle. It didn’t happen straight away … in fact, he’s still learning. Elizabeth touches base with us every few days and we give her an update and she guides us through. Ultimately, we’ve given our baby the ultimate gift … and in that, we’ve given ourselves the ultimate gift.
Last night, my husband and I had a wine, ate dinner and watched TV … while our baby slept … I was so excited, as fate would have it, I couldn’t sleep!
If you can find someone like Elizabeth to help you – do it. It’s an investment and it’s worth it … for you, your relationship and your baby.
Don’t be ashamed to reach out for a helping hand. It takes a community to raise a child …
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Love love loved this. I could listen to you guys talk about this all day!
One of the most important things for me, when I was trying to teach my little boy (now 16 months) how to sleep, was having a plan. It was so liberating to work out a course of action and stick to it. And a few painful nights were more than made up for when we could all sleep through the night again.
Mothers (and fathers) need to look after themselves so that they can look after their babies.
Thanks for this great post Mia and Elizabeth.
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thanks.. am happy you enjoyed it. x
Best of luck to your family.
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Hi Elizabeth, I’m actually really interested in this line of work and was wondering how you were trained and if you ever trained any staff yoursel?
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hi k…started out as nurse aid in nursery…many years ago. did a maternal and child certificate but stemmed off to sleep programes by myself really as so many families were struggling with bubs not sleeping. in receny yeras say last 10yrs have done prob over 500 sleep programmes..north shore sleep unit often has info which may help…but need to be honest real gift comes from experience and loving what you do..Am blessed to really enjoy my work and beautiful families i meet along way. LOVE what you do in life….will always do it WELL……X
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Hi I’m a very exhusted mum of 3! My 15 week old will wake 10 to 15 times a night. Also will not fall askeep alone. Do I have this right, you come out to peoples house’s. Zoe
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I was one of the mothers who emailed Mia for Elizabeth’s details and seeing her beautiful face just now and remembering what she gave to my family (but mostly me) makes me want to cry. Elizabeth definitely delivered gift of sleep to my son but more importantly she gave me confidence and helped me realise that i was not a crap mother and that sleep just doesn’t come naturally to some kids. At a time when I was desperately lonely and at a loss, she was like a ray of sunshine, cup of coffee and bag of lollies all rolled into one.
Mia, thank you again for sharing her with us and Elizabeth, Angus, Ed and Justine send their love. X
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Honestly, I don’t know anyone who either wasn’t blessed with a great sleeper from the beginning (jealous!) or who doesn’t do attachment parenting who hasn’t had to listen to their child cry themselves to sleep. It’s gosh awful and heart breaking but I knew I had to do it for my little man’s sake and my own. I knew he needed sleep as much as I did and that he would need to learn self settling. It took 3 nights to get him there though I must admit that he’s still not that fabulous a sleeper waking for hours at a time at least once a week aged 2. It was horrid to listen to him cry and I did it on my own as my husband was away at the time. I love the idea of having someone like Elizabeth come in and do the training as it takes the emotional attachment out of it. Not that Elizabeth doesn’t care about the little people, she’s just not their Mum or Dad and won’t be biologically programmed to respond to those cries like we are as the parents.
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hi cat, think you make good point…apart from anything else..i to agree i act as a circuit breaker…hence not as much CRYING.. x
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Loved the videos. What a beautiful woman Elizabeth is.
I’ve just read through the comments on what mums have tried to do with sleeping and I think it just reiterates the point – we’re all different and so are our children. So we need to do what suits each of us.
I remember watching the ABC series about different parenting styles – can’t remember it’s name, but it had the crazy lady Clare Verity in it – and I remember the two couples that tried the attachment parenting. One couple took to it like a duck to water, and absolutely flourished using it – whereas the other couple struggled as it was what they thought they SHOULD do, rather than what they really wanted to do.
I know some people are anti controlled crying/settling and have some concerns about the impact on the baby, but if it helps a mother be functioning and manage in the daytime, well that’s going to have a very POSITIVE impact on the baby and the relationship the mother has with it as well.
Good luck everyone.
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Hi MRS m….so get your thoughts on the A.B.C. series ..I too think a sleep PROG is not for everyone, but having lack of sleep in the family unit can be tough and as the Beautiful MIA says..;LONELY;……how wonderful at the end of the day we can be supportive of each others choice. ta so much for kind words…I do love my work and feeled blessed to be able to spread the GIFT Of SLEEP. eliz
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My 4 kids all had very different sleep patterns as babies. One was amazingly easy and went to sleep when she was supposed it and the other 3 differed greatly…to the worst who would scream the house down day and night for nearly 2 years. Admittedly she was my first and I had no idea about how much difference a routine can make. And for my kids a routine made a world of difference. My very settled son became unsettled around the time we moved him from a cot to a bed (because he was climbing out of the cot) and he would continually escape from his bed. I did the Super nanny trick and after 2 weeks of nearly going insane it worked. I would put him to bed and sit in a chair at his bedroom door facing away from him. Each time he escaped I would pick him up and put him back to bed. Each time he did this I would move my chair closer to his bed. Until I was sitting in a chair with my back to his bed right next to it!! Some nights it would take a few hours. I spent many nights sitting in that bloody chair crying into a glass of wine wondering when it would end. And then bingo, it finally worked! All I can say is for some kids it is hard work but if you persevere you will reap the rewards. A good nights sleep and a happy well rested child.
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I was a single mum from the time my daughter (now 6) was 7 weeks old. As a consequence she did not have her own bed until she was 4 – and still only sleeps in it for 1/2 the night.
If I was to have another child I would almost definitely do things differently, because circumstances would be different, but I truly treasure the experience I’ve had with my daughter. I love co-sleeping with her. However, I have not had another grown ups (or any other children’s) needs to consider, and I know that I could not share my bed with another full grown adult as well as my daughter; noone would get any sleep!
I did try to let her cry it out a few times when she was a baby, but it went against every instinct I had and felt like torture, so what Elizabeth said about the need for a circit breaker made a lot of sense to me. What I found for myself at that time was that when I slept with her I would not have to get up to feed her or comfort her and thus co-sleeping made life easier for me. She has always been an extraordinary sleeper (I’m talking 12-13 hours a night – still), but only if she sleeps with me. But it is a BIG committment.
I now live in the knowledge that at some point she will realise that it’s pretty uncool to sleep with her Mum and stop of her own volition! Until then I do not encourage her to sleep with me (other than not barring it).
For now, I sit with her (not patting or anything) until she falls asleep in her own bed at around 8pm, and at some time between 11pm and 2am she comes trotting into my room with pillow underarm.
It works for us
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My daughter will be 5 in January and STILL doesn’t sleep through. At 15months I did controlled-crying out of desperation and it worked! But then at 2.5 years we took the side off the cot and since then she never stays in her bed. We have tried everything. One memorable night she chucked a tantrum that lasted until the dawn birds started. The neighbours came round to complain. Our son who is nearly 2 occasionally sleeps through but mostly not, but we are so busy trying to cope with my daughter that if he wakes up, well come and join the party in the big bed.
I haven’t had a proper nights sleep for years. My daughter is too old for any sort of official sleep training. Rewards charts don’t work, kindness doesn’t work, harshness doesn’t work NOTHING WORKS. At this late stage the only thing i think MIGHT work is if she grows out of it, but I’m not holding my breath.
When I read the comments of mums who couldn’t cope with a few weeks or months of bad sleep I think HA! try a few YEARS!!! (obviously I do feel sympathy with these mothers, it’s just the sleep deprivation that makes me narky!!)
It’s fairly miserable but I still function and remarkably I don’t have depression, although I don’t get much done in my life!!
Does Elizabeth have any suggestions for this kind of hard-core case?
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hi A…nothing HARD CORE..but happy togive hought maybe email later…but need to be honest if you stay consistent she will get there…Wakes are behavioural..not naughty but behaviour she assocoiates with resettelling.. gates work very well with older toddlers..that way no fear and stops the nite walking to mum and dads room..good luck. eliz
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I have a four year old who sounds the same we have tried everything my only hope to is that she will grow out of it to, so when you have a bad night your not alone there is others out there
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My sympathies to you – what horrible neighbours. If they complain again, I’d suggest a sleep over at their place to see if they think they can do any better.
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Hi A. I know you said your daughter is too old for “official sleep training ” but when my son and i were at one of Tresillians clinics in Sydney two months ago the youngest baby there was 5 weeks old…and the oldest child was in kindergarten.
It could still be worth a try… either way, i hope you get some sleep and some sanity back soon!
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AFor. My eldest of four didn’t sleep through the night until she started school at nearly 5. By then I had the fourth child and luckily the next three were great sleepers ( we knew to do everything different after our first).
It will happen. Good luck. All mine are adults now 19, 21, 23 and 24. Biggest problem now is getting youngest 2 out of bed by noon.
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Don’tcha just love how as a society we serve up a side of guilt for mums to take with their sleep-deprivation?!?! Psychological damage etc.
Elizabeth seems so tentative and moderate and compassionate I can’t imagine a sleep-deprived parent not wanting to give her ideas a go. At least.
On the point of giving a ‘gift’ which seems counter-intuitve for your baby. It’s endless having to remember I am the parent, I am the adult and I know what is good for you. Self-settling might’ve been the first time I took that parenting approach but many times since then I have had to parent along a harder line “for his own good”.
I don’t completely ignore the heart strings, but I don’t want to be at the mercy of them either.
Ahhh and the 9 week mark dummy spit. Literally. It took my daugther the whole of 10th week for her to find her thumb. It was the worst week we’ve ever had with her, the poor thing. But now? She is the happiest, most well-rested, sleep and food loving 16 month old you’ll ever meet. I’ll cherish this stage till we turn the next corner
What a wonderful job Elizabeth has. And obviously does. Thanks for sharing.
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I’m sure that each baby is different, as is each parent, but I think this article raises some interesting points:
http://www.bellybelly.com.au/articles/baby/the-con-of-controlled-crying
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We’ve seen this report before and for some parents it just doesn’t help. I’ve lost count of how many teary mums I’ve seen due to lack of sleep, thanks to feeling guilty for putting baby down. There is a happy medium between rigid controlled crying and never putting the baby down.
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I think that there seems to be a few different definitions of controlled crying and certain stigmas attached to those labels. In the end, it is about finding a happy medium that works for bub and the parents. Prolonged sleep deprivation doesn’t do anyone any favours that’s for sure!
I wasn’t playing devil’s advocate, just think that it’s interesting reading different points of view on the topic and then each to their own making an informed decision or trying what works for them best.
It’s heartbreaking to see women that think they are failing as mothers all because their bub won’t settle. There’s too much pressure and guilt around how you are supposed to be parenting these days it seems.
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I am the mother of a 14 month old girl and a child psychologist.
My husband and I co-sleep with our daughter. I believe that an “attachment parenting” approach is best for my daughter’s psychological and physical wellbeing and her cognitive functioning. I understand that this approach isn’t for everyone, but, for me, it has been the most amazing experience of my life. I feel so intimately connected to my daughter.
Based on my personal and professional experiences, I have a lot of concerns about controlled crying and would only recommend it as an absolute last resort.
Some of your readers might be interested in reading about the physical correlates of crying in the following paper (published in Evolutionary Psychology in 2007):
http://www.naturalchild.org/guest/natural_parenting.pdf
Here is an excerpt (pp 113-114):
Support for the view that crying is not a necessary part of an infant’s behavioral expressions in everyday situations but rather an alarm signal reserved for critical circumstances is provided by an examination of the physiological correlates of crying in both the infant and the caregiver exposed to the signal. To begin with, crying is an activity that requires considerable physiological effort. It is an intense state of bodily arousal involving increased heart and lung activity as well as muscle movement and is associated with increased energy expenditure (Lester, 1985; Pillai and James, 1990; Prechtl, 1974; Rao, Blass, Brignol, Marino, and Glass, 1993). During crying episodes the child’s heart rate rises (Pillai and James, 1990; Walsh and Gyulai, 1973) and augmented levels of plasma cortisol are observed (Anders, Sachar, Kream, Roffwarg, and Hellman, 1970), while at the same time blood oxygen level decreases (Huch and Huch, 1976; Levesque, Pollack, Griffin, and Nielsen, 2000; Treloar, 1994). During the first few days of life crying can even reestablish a fetal pattern of blood flow in the heart, leading to poorly oxygenated blood being returned to systemic circulation rather than flowing to the lungs, with additional negative side-effects on cerebral blood flow (Anderson, G. C., 1988, 1989; Brazy, 1988; Walsh, Meyer, and Lind, 1974). On the whole, crying is a taxing experience for the child that is counterproductive to general wellbeing and potentially harmful to the organism (see also review: Ludington-Hoe, Cong, and Hashemi, 2002).
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Hi M, Wanted to ask you a question but preface this that I am no way trying to be defensive – sometimes hard to tell over email! But if a baby doesn’t settle with parents in bed, what are the other options besides a form of controlled crying/comforting? Interested in your professional perspective on this as well. Thanks, Mrs M
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My daughter has never wanted to sleep with us. As a newborn she never settled in our bed and as she has got older and I’ve wanted her close when she’s been sick she doesn’t sleep til she is put back in her own bed.
Its all about balance – even if I accept the assumptions of the research you posted, where is the research about disrupted sleep/the amount of sleep little babies/children need to develop and grow?
Every choice you make as a parent has pros and cons.
(and on teh co-sleeping – you girls who do it have my admiration – I don’t even like sharing my bed with my husband leta lone chidlren! Sleep is a solitary thing in my book)
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I often WISHED my babies would want to co-sleep! None of them did…..
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Hi James,
Research about those areas is touched on in the paper I cited above:
http://www.naturalchild.org/guest/natural_parenting.pdf
Here is an excerpt about the sleep experience of co-sleeping parents and infants (p 124):
Investigations into the sleep experience of breastfed infants who share their mothers’ beds during the night have found it to be profoundly different to that of solitary sleeping children. In one study, cosleeping children spent 28–99% of the night in physical contact with their mothers, compared to only 2–14% when spending the night alone in a separate room (McKenna et al., 1994). Furthermore, bed sharing infants breastfeed about twice as often as regular solitary sleepers, with the total duration of nightly nursing episodes amounting to almost three times of what is observed in lone sleep conditions (McKenna, Mosko, and Richard, 1997). Cosleeping infants are also less likely to be placed in the prone position, and lie most of the night facing their mothers, commonly near breast level, which may be attributable to the facilitation of breastfeeding in such positions (Richard, Mosko, McKenna, and Drummond, 1996). Mothers, too, face their cosleeping infants about 74% of the time, and when lying face-to-face, the bed sharing partners are most typically at a distance of 11–30 cm from each other (Richard et al., 1996). In addition, mothers inspect and adjust their infants’ sleep environment by actions such as repositioning or reblanketing considerably more often during bed sharing than when sleeping separately from their infants, and frequently display affectional behaviors such as hugging, rocking, kissing, patting, whispering, speaking or singing that are rarely exhibited when mother and child sleep in separate rooms. The great majority of these behaviors take place in reaction to infant movements or sounds (McKenna, Mosko, and Richard, 1999). Bed sharing is also associated with more frequent arousals during stages of deep sleep in the infant (Mosko, Richard, and McKenna, 1997a). While mothers also experience a greater number of arousals during bed sharing, these are shorter in duration than those occurring during solitary sleep (Mosko, Richard, and McKenna, 1997b). Therefore, mothers who cosleep with their children get as much sleep as non-cosleeping mothers (Mosko et al., 1997b).
Here is an excerpt about the positive effects of attachment parenting, including co-sleeping, on child growth and development (p 156):
…touch and skin-to-skin contact have been associated with many important physiological processes such as thermal regulation, physical growth, decreased stress hormone levels, and enhanced immune function.
When further considering that bodily touch, movement stimulation, and familiar sounds signal safety to a newborn, and given the fact that physical contact is often the only intervention in early life that can calm a distressed infant, then the development of basic trust in one’s world (Erikson, 1963) and thus the formation of a secure attachment to one’s caregiver can be concluded to be greatly facilitated by the provision of an immediate postnatal environment that recreates the familiar atmosphere of the womb. By offering the child such a tangibly secure and predictable environment for early growth, parents tailor their caregiving behaviors to match the emotional needs and the limited cognitive and perceptual abilities of their newborn. Over time, as close physical proximity as a sign of secure parental presence slowly decreases in importance and as distal interactions become more meaningful to the child, caregiving practices can be adjusted accordingly, with the whole process reflecting a secure and smooth transition from pre- to postnatal life. In that way, backed up by such a history of emotional security, the child gradually grows and is released into increasing independence rather than being pushed to that stage abruptly and prematurely right after birth. Increasing knowledge regarding the decisive early stages of brain development further suggests that repeated positive experiences in early life leave distinct traces in the initially highly plastic physiological matrix that forms the basis for all subsequent development.
Best wishes,
M
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Hi Mrs M,
I can recommend using gentle sleep strategies and trying to create a womb-like environment for your baby. Strategies include swaddling your baby, carrying your baby in a sling, playing gentle music, using soothing sounds (as parents, we instinctively say shhh to our babies), and patting your baby on the back 60-80 times a minute (maternal heart rate).
Many of these strategies are described in more detail in Pinky McKay’s books (Pinky is an International Board Certified Lactation Consultant, Certified Infant Massage Instructor, and Melbourne-based writer and editor) and in Dr Howard Chilton’s books (Dr Chilton is a neonatologist based at the Prince of Wales Private Hospital and the Royal Hospital for Women, Sydney).
See the following websites for more information:
http://www.pinky-mychild.com/index.php/sleep
http://www.babydoc.com.au/index.html
I hope this helps.
Best wishes,
M
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Hi M, Thanks so much, am familiar with some of Pinky’s ideas. My 3 year old and 9 month old are sleeping well – just wanted some tips for a friend who is going through the ‘no sleep’ stage at the moment and is a bit freaked out by controlled comforting/crying. I just want to give her some different options so she can work out what suits her best. I did a bit of what you said and with my first some 3,5, 7 minutes crying then comforting. I was lucky – I had a baby (my first) who never had to cry for more than 5 minutes before he fell asleep and then my second just self settled from early on. But I am a BIG believer in routines which I think have helped. All the best to you too.
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The SIDS council don’t recommend co-sleeping in preference to sleeping in ones own cot. Co-sleeping isn’t for everyone either. Here can be more effe tie ways to get a child to settle.
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Hi Faybian,
I agree that co-sleeping isn’t for everyone.
I also believe that co-sleeping, when practiced safely (i.e., no alcohol, no drugs, no cigarettes, no waterbeds, no doonas, no soft toys), is associated with a decreased risk of SIDS.
Here is (yet another!) excerpt (p 124):
…the sensory-rich sleep environment of bed sharing, which leads to more frequent arousals during deep sleep and more light sleep, from which it is easier for the infant to arouse, appears to confer a survival advantage for children at risk of SIDS (McKenna, 1996; McKenna and Mosko, 1990; McKenna et al., 1993). In addition, cosleeping mothers usually place their infants in a nonprone position, a practice that has been associated with a decreased risk of SIDS (American Academy of Pediatrics, 2005b).
And another (p 125):
Societies or parts of societies in which mother–infant cosleeping is widely practiced, generally have a relatively low incidence of SIDS compared to cultures that encourage solitary infant sleep. This is the case despite the fact that these people often live in suboptimal conditions, which would be expected to predispose them to increased infant mortality (Davies, D. P., 1994).
Best wishes,
M
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I agree that safe co-sleeping reduces the risk of SIDS, and Its one of the reasons u chose to co-sleep
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Woops I meant one of the reasons I chose to co-sleep
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I was co-sleeping and then read this article and it scared the hell out of me…
http://news.smh.com.au/breaking-news-national/cosleeping-a-risk-for-young-babies-20100930-15yyh.html
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My wife and I never intended to co-sleep or adopt natural parenting practices with our daughter. In preparing for her arrival, we blindly followed the trend of western culture and bought a cot, a pram, and prepared the spare bedroom as the nursery.
Then, on the arrival of our baby, my wife did one simple thing that changed these plans, and for which I am forever grateful: she followed her instinct. From that first night in hospital, she held our baby in bed with her. On our return home, we welcomed our precious daughter into our bed, where she was happy to sleep within close reach of Mum, who was able to respond to a breastfeeding urge before it ever got to tears. Now ~15 months on, the cot remains unused in the spare room, and we have all enjoyed long sleeps, typically >9 hours, with minimal disruptions, since the first month. We also love waking up next to our girl – those first moments each morning are a joy, the best start to the day. I will never regret our choice to trust the instinct to co-sleep.
I read the SMH article cited above, and essentially it is saying that the only SIDS risk associated with co-sleeping is when parents sleep on a couch with baby (one of the five cases cited in the article), or use heavy bedding, or other risk factors cited by M above. To quote the forensic pathologist: “What we’ve done in the west is we’ve made co-sleeping dangerous”. Our rules for co-sleeping: no heavy drinking, no doona for the first 6 months, hard mattress, keep pillows out of way.
People should know that despite the stigma associated with co-sleeping, if you do it safely, there are many benefits for you and the child.
Along these lines, the other main ‘natural parenting’ approach we adopted, again driven by my wife’s instinct, was to carry our baby in a sling, instead of using a pram. My wife walks a lot, and each day she and our daughter have long conversations as they explore the world together. The experiences of cuddling, breastfeeding, interacting, and teaching are all enhanced. I believe that this, and the co-sleeping, have allowed our girl to thrive to her full potential. She is the most sociable, affectionate, enthusiastic, securely attached, and communicative little baby I have met. Her developmental milestones were all reached very early, and her language skills are extraordinary. I know I’m a proud dad, but trust me, other less biased people have told us these things too.
I cannot recommend natural parenting based practices enough. They do require more commitment and more patience, as you can’t just plonk your baby down and leave them for hours. I am thankful that my wife trusted her instincts from the beginning, and that she is such a loving, selfless and patient mother.
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People who don’t follow ‘natural’ parenting don’t just plonk their children down and leave for hours. They put them down to sleep and pick them up and interact with them when they are awake.
I’m glad what you are doing works for you but don’t judge others for doing differently. Every parent thinks their child is
“the most sociable, affectionate, enthusiastic, securely attached, and communicative little baby (they) have met.” And friends always say that to parents (it’s what people do when they are being polite – even if they think you’re child is a brat).
What is it with alternative types who not only think their way is the best but have to act all morally superior about it too?
Give us a break.
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I enjoyed watching this video and even though my darlings are sleeping through and know how to self settle themselves, the discussion brought tears to my eyes, the memory of sleep deprivation is still so real. Sleep deprivation is pure torture, oh it’s so tough and not easy. I liked the idea of giving your child this gift, teaching them, just like we teach them manners etc. Very good viewing.
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THANKYOU…sleep deprivation is horrible…and unless you have been through it..one doesnt realize how HORRIBLE……ELIZ
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I only had one firm idea about parenting when I had my babies and that was that they would settle themselves to sleep. Like everyone else I scrabbled through teething, feeding, etc, but in my haze I was convinced that we could get through any sort of day knowing the baby could settle herself at night.
You can write off the first 6 weeks and just take that time to cuddle and rock and smell your baby to sleep. It’s definitely not the time to stress.
From around 6 weeks, I always put the babies in bed when they were awake (not wide awake, don’t get me wrong), but alert enough to know they were being put in bed and sleepy enough that they couldn’t be bothered to put up too much of a fuss. It really worked for my girls and they were able to settle themselves if they woke during the night.
I also wrapped them both so they couldn’t move. My first one loved it, my second one not so much because she is a thumb sucker so in the end I just wrapped her from the waist down. One thing I did was to tuck the blanket under the mattress to stop them kicking and staying awake.
The first one would wake up for her dummy and as soon as she could find her own mouth we would put 3-4 dummies in the bed with her so she could find one in the night herself. It worked. Both girls were sleeping 10-12 hours by 3 month and I know that is mostly luck, but I also believe it’s because they knew how to settle themselves.
The other thing this made me realise (and this only happened with the second one) is that when she does wake during the night and doesn’t settle it usually means that there is something going on with her – a tooth or maybe a cold coming on – so we (ha! me) just go with the flow those couple of nights and then the sleeping returns to normal.
Good luck to all you baby mummies out there.
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OMG! This is so timely for me and my 13 month old baby girl. She is the youngest of 3 and has been the worst sleeper of them. She sleeps in our bed and still wakes at least once sometimes twice for a breastfeed! I’m exhausted and usually fall asleep when I settle her at night. It’s not great as it means that my other 2 children miss out on my time. I’m grumpy and fairly useless with my time and make incredibly bad decisions as a result of my tiredness. Just yesterday I decided to bite the bullet and try to teach her to settle in her own cot. I’m faced with crying – hers and mine but I’m trying to keep focused on the aim as I’m certain it will be better for her, for my well being and my relationship with my partner and other two children. Watching this interview has given me confidence to keep at it. Thinking I’m a hopeless Mother is the absolutely worst feeling! Thank you for putting this message out!
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Beatrice, you are the opposite of a hopeless mummy!! You have done the best thing you have known to do. That is all we can do.
Good on you for recognising the effect this is having on the rest of your family. You’re right, the other kids suffer and it is hard to make the correct decisions in life.
It will be hard to train her at 13 months, but I’m sure you will be able to do it. All the best xox
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hi Beatrice…so not a hopeless mum..now email me any concerns at all am happy to give you some tips.
stay CALM COMMITTED AND CONSISTENT..
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Thank you so much. I’m e mailing you immediately! x x x
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hi Beatrice…so not a hopeless mum..now email me any concerns at all am happy to give you some tips.
stay CALM COMMITTED AND CONSISTENT..X
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Thank you for your kindness. It’s wonderful to get such encouragement. x x x
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I really liked this post, and all the comments are really great and helpful to read through – I hope that I have an ok time with my first baby (due next year). If not, I hope I will not hesitate to call someone for help.
I have a question for whoever knows the answer: Can you do this with toddlers? My sister has a 3 year old, and I would be interested to know if sleep intervention would be helpful for her and her boy of need be.
Thanks Mia!
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yes…you can..any age up to 5yrs..can be taught gift of sleep. best of luck with new BABY… eliz
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When my first born was 6 months old, I was at my wits end, being woken up every hour on the hour. We called Elizabeth, who finally managed to get her to sleep through the night. Then I had twins, and when they were eight months old, and I was again at my wits end, I called Elizabeth. Because we had moved out of the area, I got the impression she wasn’t really interested in helping us, but I pushed because I was desperate. I had to cancel an appointment due to one of them being ill, so we rescheduled for three weeks time. The week she was supposed to come, she called and said she hadn’t heard from me so she assumed everything was fine and that I didn’t need her or else I would have made contact etc etc. The only thing that had kept me going was her visit and she let us down in such a monumental way. I told her we had struggled through the last few weeks and had attempted to do some CC on our own and her response was that if we had tried so hard on our own and had no success, then there was probably not much she could do anyway! Well, I was totally devastated. Those sleepless nights led to a very deep dark depression that I had to fight very hard to get out of. The twins finally managed to sleep through the night at 26 months, but it came too late and at a very high cost to our family. The point of my story? Not all our experiences with Elizabeth are the same. Plus, I guess I am still very bitter.
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hi, am sorry to hear this…yep..need to be honest dont always get it right all the time and managing nites and 3 beaUtiful boys does lead to slip ups in over booking..anyhow…am sorry if i caused you sadness, but delighted i came through with first born. all the best to you and your family…i am a Twin…it also is a GIFT….
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My sleep whisperer – Brian Symon – he is a god.
Book is Silent Nights – website is http://www.silentnights.org/
He saved my sanity and his book is known as the bible among my friends – it was handed over to me like an induction into a secret society of happy, well-rested mothers and babies.
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@miafreedman I’m for whatever works for each parent. I have two little angels who were not great sleepers but for me control crying was not an option. I found that around 6-9 moths babies start becoming aware of their surroundings and at this time they crave extra love and assurance. Today’s society is about time management and even babies have to preform to our robotic lifestyle. Last time I checked no one o.d on too much love.
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what is ‘robotic’ about a self-settling baby?
I don’t think any of this has anything to do with ‘today’s society being about time management’ but about parents who are sleep-deprived and are seeking some guidance.
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Yes but babies suffer when there mothers on the verge of a nervous breakdown because they aren’t getting enough sleep. Those babies aren’t getting enough love are they?
You may be fabulous for being able to cope with less sleep than others but have some compassion for those who can’t.
And as the research shows, no baby has ever o.d. on learning how to go to sleep by themselves.
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If you have left it til 6 to 9 months to do something then sure, maybe they’ll find it a shock. But to me a 9 month old should have a solid and good sleep routine instituted weellll before then.
Its not about ‘todays society’. My grandmother wrapped her kids up and put them in the cot and they cried or didn’t and wen tto sleep. she was a SAHM without any obligations other than her children – she just knew it was good for them!
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I agree wholeheartedly with James on this. My approach to teaching my babies is not based on being too busy to comfort them – my husband and I have planned it so that at least one of us is home full time for at least the first two years. My approach is based on believing that good sleep habits are vital and can influence so many other areas of your life. I feel that if I didn’t do my best to teach my children how to sleep and settle by themselves that I would be doing them a major injustice.
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actually, being routine based took me more time initially than not having a routine would have done. Had nothing to do with time management, and everything to do with what I thought would make my children the happiest and most content – which to my mind is safety, a sense of security, (which I think a routine helps with), lots of sleep and lots and lots of love.
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