I’m going to reveal a fundamental truth. Evidently this will come as a shock to some.
Newsflash: straight white men are not an underclass. They have all the rights. Still do, always have. More rights than anyone else.
A few weeks ago we ran this piece from the Prime Minister about the importance of continuing the good fight for gender equality.
What we didn’t expect when we published it, was to unearth a new underclass of ‘oppressed’ people who objected to the idea of our PM (or anyone) singling out women for special mention. I’m paraphrasing:
‘What about men? We have issues too!’
‘How dare you mention women’s rights when men are suffering’.
‘We shouldn’t focus on women’s rights until we fix the problems men have’.
Ah, of course, it’s the loud and noisy Faux Oppressed. A minority of individuals in a social majority of straight white men who cling desperately to the notion that the rest of us have come to rob them of the immense privilege they have in this world. Priveleges they don’t even realise they have.
We must have completely missed the subtext of that article (apparently only obvious to a few white men) which was, more or less, a call for women to subjugate men everywhere.
Battle stations fair wenches, you have more testicles to crush. And what about gay people and their search for equality? That’s a right too far for some!
Let’s be perfectly clear: if you have all the rights, you are out in front. You’re winning. Somebody or some group gaining a few more rights so they begin to catch up isn’t going to alter the privilege you already have. Rights are not a finite commodity. Rights are not, for example, coal. You can’t run out of them. They’re as infinite as society wants to make them.
Equality isn’t a question of Robin Hood economics. We don’t have to take any rights to grant new ones. That’s the beauty of it.
Now, far be it for me to couch the debate over gender equality (or any other social issue) in terms of winners and losers. Truth be told there should be no winners. And no losers. It should be a tie. But currently, there are losers in these particular debates: women, gays and lesbians, transgender people, Indigenous people. Every time this subject comes up a chorus line of the Faux Oppressed emerges with arguments about how they’re really doing it tough. Tougher than the lot we’d originally gathered to discuss. When Julia Gillard says that women aren’t paid as much as men for doing the same job, that’s a fact, not an opinion.
In almost every scenario imaginable, the Faux Oppressed are of the dominant gender, skin colour, religion, political party, club, group, whatever.
We’re talking straight white men. This is important: Not all of them. Not every straight white man is pining for lost rights (where did those ‘rights’ even go?) but almost every person who is outraged by any talk of equality is a straight, white man. Most of them get it. They know they’re out in front. And they’re OK about stopping to help others. Mostly Because:
When Indigenous people got the vote, men didn’t lose their vote.
When women are given pay increases, it doesn’t come from the pay packets of men.
When gays are eventually allowed to marry, straight marriages won’t self combust.
Want to argue with some facts? Sure!
Two thirds of the 800 million people worldwide who lack basic literacy skills are women. Globally 1 in 3 women and girls experience physical and sexual violence with rates as high as 2 in 3 in some Pacific countries. Australian women still earn, on average, 18 per cent less than Australian men in the workplace. At almost every turn, women are not out in front. Men are. So why anyone would get all huffy that we want to try and close this gap (note: close it, not widen it in the other direction) is beyond me.
“Can you just shut up about your ‘equality’ now? I’m sick of seeing gay stories all over the news.”
That’s an actual quote from somebody whose fundamental human right to not hear stories about the gays was being infringed right that minute on the news.
My favourite is ‘we have more important issues to worry about, like asylum seekers coming here and taking our privileges’!
It’s not that being a straight white male makes you immune to problems. Yes, some men are abused by female partners. But the vast majority of victims of domestic violence (to pick one example) are overwhelmingly women and children.
Of course men have problems. But women are still not equal.
Of course straight people have issues too. But gay people are still not equal.
Narrowing the headstart you have on equality does not suddenly mean you’re losing. It means society is learning to run a fairer race.
Need a funnier argument? There’s a bit of swearing but Louis CK has the goods:








Comments
291 Comments so far
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Completely agree with all of this. With one rider – poverty and economic inequality never quite make it to the table in these discussions. Women and non-dominant groups of most kinds, really, are poorer than men. On average. BUT there are also a lot of poor, white men, and it is often poor, white men who get the most upset abou gay rights, anti-racism, and women’s rights, because they are told that they are the winners in society. Quite obviously, in many ways, poor white men are not the winners in society. Though they may be better off than poor white women, and there are certainly less of them than poor black people etc etc.
So, we can’t forget economic inequality and the fact that it is quite true that some white men are far more subjugated in our society than some (small number) of white women.
Just to note, though, this in no way diminishes the fact that there is huge gender inequality in our society, and continued disadvantage for sexual minorities and those who are not white, that must be addressed. And we must always shout down the small sector who claim that men are now disadvantaged relative to women etc etc. As Rick so rightly says, it’s always the straight, white man who says this, scared that his dominance may be eroded and his unequal access to opportunities reduced.
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interesting point willa way
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Beautifully said Willaway. I wholeheartedly agree with the sentiment of this piece but I was thinking that class (that terribly ‘unsexy’ word that people don’t like to use these days) does play a part in the opportunities afforded to men (and obviously women) and that it can undercut the supposed privleged status of the White Straight Male
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I agree, there are some poor white men worse off than some white women who aren’t poor etc, but I think it’s more a point of equality in equal situations. Ie poor men vs poor women, male CEO vs female CEO et al. I get how poorer men would feel more than hesitant at accepting that they are ‘doing the best’, but in relation to women or indigenous people etc in the same position, he probably is.
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I really do love this post. One of those necessary rants.
My name, though, should give an indication that I will say the following: a middle-class female medical specialist does have more social power than a blue-collar 10th-grade educated man. I know that you aren’t making blanket statements, Rick, but I often feel that issues of class are just as important as gender and race (especially as Australia’s class gap seems to open up), but are often overlooked, especially on this site.
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Completely agree. Someone pointed it out below and you’re right. Class matters. My only beef is with the privileged thinking they are under-privileged and obviously somebody who is from a lower socio-economic class isn’t necessarily privileged and deserves access to opportunity too. And we should all fight for that, no matter their gender
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you make my bogan heart glad
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I think the thing is that gender / race / class will make a difference when ‘comparing like with like’ (not exactly the phrase I wanted, but it’ll have to do). So the middle-class female medical specialist is probably in a less favourable position than her male middle-class medical colleague. And the blue-collar 10th-grade educated man is probably better off than his similarly educated sister.
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Yeah, this is a really good point but risks descending completely into useless relativism. This CEO isn’t privileged compared to that one who only got a $5 million bonus last year.
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Love Louis CK and love this piece.
There’s an interesting parallel to Bec’s piece about cake.
One of the biggest problems is how do you engage with people who feel this way?
You are never going to change their minds, they will always feel hard done by.
I have given up with some family members (luckily I don’t see them that often) as their ideas are fixed and no amount of logic will sway them.
Perhaps I should try cake.
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Have you noticed how all men on television commercials are portrayed as fools or airheads. I never noticed until my hubby pointed it out. Husband does something stupid, wife rolls her eyes, brings out product/service, man looks on like an idiot.
Women are the purchasers of these products/services so the advertisers must think we’re all married to fools so we can relate to the ad and buy the product.
But I can kind of justify it, men had been making fun of women for years (think 50s Mad Men advertising) and still objectify women (think sexy girl in bikini selling carwash). It’s time we get a little back for ourselves.
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Agreed, it’s silly. And no, you shouldn’t have to expect silly treatment in return. I think the whole point of equality means we stop treating each other in ways that are dismissive or disenfranchising. Which should apply to everyone.
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Yep, definitely one of my pet peeves is advertising portraying women as the housewife and then the men and/or kids as hopeless/useless at household duties. Insulting to all parties.
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I recently wrote a blog post about this. It pisses me off. It’s insulting to men, it’s insulting to women, they’re insulting my intelligence by thinking I want to view men as bumbling idiots.
Bah!
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I love it Rick!! Well done! I’m sick of the ‘but what about teh menz’ moaning every time anyone wants to so much as discuss the fact that maybe dome people are disadvantaged under our current system(s).
One thing that does get overlooked, and to be honest I think is the real complaint of a lot of the men who troll here and over at news.com.au, is the issue of class. I think there are a lot of disenfranchised people who are doing it tough and that a lot of the anger comes from things like the increasing difficulty for the less educated to find good jobs as we offshore traditional working class jobs and the difficulty of moving out of a welfare cycle if you were born into it.
What I’m saying is, there’s a big difference between the Jeff Kennetts and the Eddie Maguires of the world, and white, straight unemployed Bruce from Minto.
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I wonder if men suffer more from class differences…I don’t know, just putting it out there…discuss…
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Men suffer from class differences, but not more than women. Of the poor, women are poorer. Ditto black people, or ethnic minorities. The hierarchy is maintained through every strata of society.
That said, obviously, some individual straight white men benefit more from existing unequal power relations than others (see my comment above) – but, as a group, men are always out on top.
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Yeah, that was my gut feeling too…it’s strange, but this is what the novel I’m working on is all about…good timing…
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I’m not a social researcher but I really doubt it.
There are many more highly paid jobs available to uneducated men than uneducated women.
Welfare dependent women are much more likely to have dependent children which reduces their mobility and opportunity.
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I think men are socialized to expect that they’ll be breadwinners, able to provide a nice, safe home. Possibly not as much now as my gen(x), but it’s still there. If they don’t feel they measure up to that, then yes I think they suffer from class difference in that way.
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Having a dissenting opinion is not trolling.
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Correct, that is not the defining characteristic of trolling!
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Thank god for this post.
I was one of the vocal ones speaking out against the ‘men’s rights activists’ who were trolling (or always troll) mamamia on any post which outlines female oppression.
Thank you so much.
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Oh and ps as a feminist I also consider myself a masculinist (in that I greatly consider men’s rights in situations also). However, we cannot deny that straight, white, men, have not had the same societal oppression as other groups. I say this as someone who is engaged to a straight, white, man, and who is someone who loves their straight, white, male, father deeply. I will also go further in saying that I am often pulling my mother up in situations were she expects waaaaay too much from my dad due to patriarchal notions of ‘the provider.’ Patraiarchy hurts everyone ( as I have seen this with my father and the fact that he is 65, still working many hours overtime, doing odd jobs around the house, and cleaning://).
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I understand your viewpoint but it could have been written in a more respectful and less generalized way.
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Really? How do you mean?
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It was assuming that a lot of straight white men are like that when I dont believe they are. The occasional one is but the post does make some big generalisations and almost seems like a whine. I do appreciate the author’s use of data to back up his claims however. The post is valid just could have been written a little better
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I don’t think it was assuming that at all. Rick wrote “a minority of individuals” and that most men get it (about being in front).
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This is some of your best work Rick! thanks for the article, it’s well written and was a great perspective that i had never previously considered.
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I am flabergastered that a site that is so about fairness, equality and diadvantage can publish something like this, saying that just one group have to shut up and stay out of the discussion. Hypocrisy much.
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I don’t mind that you disagree Anon,but you’ve now left 4 comments from the same IP address and others may assume they’re coming from 4 different people!
And to make sure you know where I’m coming from: it’s not about shutting up or being quiet but about not distorting the debate. There is still REAL disadvantage that needs to be overcome for women and LGBTQ people and Indigenous people and pretending you have it worse when the statistics say otherwise isn’t helping anyone’s cause.
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Show me now where I have EVER said men have it worse, this is more about you suggesting we dont have any issues of our own worth discussing AT ALL. And where do we stop the segmentation of who is allowed to have issues rick? Are blue collar white men allowed to be heard, the mentally ill, left handed me. See how stupid this game is.
And so what thst I leave multiple posts, so do you.
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People know I do, my name is Rick. Not asking much, just pick a name (any one! It can even be Q) and then people know who’s who.
As for discussing men’s issues, we can and should talk about them. But this article was directed at a specific group of people who claim that we *shouldn’t* be talking about women’s issues (or other minority issues) because we should focus on them. Don’t twist the message please
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Who are these ‘people’ you speak of rick, as most male commentators on here have reasonable balance, and dont suggest mens issues are more important. I think this is all in your head.
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Anonymous, please! He wasn’t saying straighr white men can’t join the debate, simply that their point in any argument shouldn’t be that margianalised groups are taking their
privileges. And what I’d say is hypocrisy is that you’re attesting to your right to join any debate, yet you want to do so with your identity “anonymous” rather than openly debating your viewpoint.
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Following on from the recent article on Internet trolls, is this an example?
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This article is not actually saying that at all. What it is actually saying is that, statistically speaking, white, hetrosexual males are the beneficiaries of more rights and freedoms than other groups. This article is not saying all white hetrosexual men are automatically better off than any other group, and it doesn’t say that just because you may be a white hetrosexual man that you don’t experience anything on an individual level. What it is saying is that when, as a society, we take steps to make life more equitable, it doesn’t take away from the rights and freedoms of white hetrosexual males.
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Amen!
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Bingo!
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I think what a lot of white straight males don’t realise is that nearly all moves towards social and gender equality has actually brought a lot of freedom to men as well…
Feminism is a great example. Feminism was a reaction against the strict gender roles in western society at the time. Men were meant to be the bread-winners and household leaders. Women were meant to be the child-bearing home-keepers, and to be subservient to men. The obvious problem with these gender roles was the subjugation of women as a class. But men were also victims of the strict social structure as well…they were expected to provide all the financial support to their wives and family…imagine the pressure of having all that responsibility…
What the feminist movement achieved was the merging of roles between genders… nowadays, men and women share the burden of both financial and child-caring duties…and in any combination they feel comfortable with…men and women have equal rights and responsibilities…at least, enlightened couples do…
I think straight white men who feel threatened by any further moves towards all types of equality are still stuck in a 1950s mentality…for whatever reason…and can’t see that they already have these freedoms…I think they still feel trapped in old gender roles when they don’t have to be anymore…
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I think I love you (just a Lil’ bit ) for that comment JJ. More and more people like you please.
The best quote I have heard in recent years is “my kind of feminism requires men to be involved”- I love that, because that is how I feel. Not us vs them but how can we all work together to help both the sexes (not to mention other “minority” or class groups) to achieve the best outcome.
with comments like yours, and the men in my life i have hope that this is achievable (in this country at least!)
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“My kind of feminism requires men to be involved” – if I do recall correctly, that was Leslie Cannold on Q&A about 5 months ago… a beautiful response from a beautiful human being!
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Exactly! I attended a very interesting film screening by the Sonke Gender Justice Network yesterday. They were arguing that traditional gender roles actually have an adverse effect on men too. For example a refugee man feeling less than a man because he couldn’t protect his family or men not feeling as if they should share worries with their wives because it makes them seem less strong. Similarly mental health issues and men not looking after themselves can be traced back to the expectation that men should be strong and not ask for help.
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My understanding, from my personal exprience and what i hear friends say of their marriages, and what i witness there, so no statistics to back it up, is that men have gotten confused by the feminist liberation movements and what they have achieved. In terms of “rights” in the household, and I am NOT talking about the enlightened men you speak of, they seem to still equate “being a good wife” with “taking care of your man” (after taking care of the children of course). Having dinner ready, even if you work as many hours a day as they do. Keeping the house neat, feeding the baby, giving the children their bath, and getting up to bring the children to school if you BOTH have the day off that day, is still seen as a “nice thing to do for your wife” if the man does it, and the wife in question has been raised to be grateful for that. But they still expect the woman to contribute financially. It’s not a “nice thing the wife does for the family”, it’s part of the “expectations” bundle. Somehow, things are not a matter of “rights” but “expectations” for many women. My main point being ” your last paragraph is so true”, please disregard the absence of a conclusion lol……
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. Such a well written & persuasive article Rick congrats. Agree clarinette, in my experience my husband works extremely hard at a business that is breaking even with little prospect of improvement. I do everything at home & pay all our personal bills. I work part time at present, Currently living on my maternity leave as we have newborn & toddler. I juggle feeeding, household etc etc. Husband hardly ever here but when he is it’s feet up time. As a wife I I’m expected to do all of this & be supportive. I always read that new mums should cop it on the chin when husbands are working hard to support the family after arrival of new baby & think how much pressure they’re under?! Well I think there are slot if women like me who have both the family & financial pressure…But I’d be an unsupportive wife if I ever challenged everybody’s ‘reality’ that it’s husband paying the bills!. Think I’ve gone way off track here
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You’re not off track, i didn’t even find the point of my own post. I think we need a new term or phrase to coin that particular feeling we’re trying to explain in a billion words……
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Thank you, thank you, thank you! This was articulated beautifully! I was losing hope with these forums as they appeared to have been flooded with these ‘faux oppressed’ trying to subjugate open discussion about human (other than straight white male) rights. I haven’t read such an enlightened article for a long time! Thank you again.
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Great, great article. I was so angry after the Julia Guillard speech was printed on MM- the amount of faux-opression opinions that came out was truly disturbing. What saddens me more, and this is not taking anything at all away from you Rick, is that this message will probably be taken more seriously because it is written by a man.
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Also, just because I know it’s killing you not to have written it in the original article:
They took our jobs! Dey tekk err jerbs!!
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“They took our jobs! Dey tekk err jerbs!!”
AND DEY JUST COME HERE TO LIVE ON THE DOLE!!!!
(Never mind that these two things contradict each other – logic isn’t a strong point in such arguments.)
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This what I hate most about the asylum seeker arguments:
If they come here and work they are taking jobs from Australian workers or they come here and are on centre link payments for various reasons, they are a drain on our society o
They cannot win.
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I know, i believe we (as a country) are wealthy enough to share the grain with people who have suffered so much more than we have. i understand that we don’t have it 100% right for all the people that already live in this country but that is no reason to deny a little bit of help for people that want to come here.
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“Back to the Man Pile!”
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This is my favourite quote about equality, closely followed by Morgan Freeman talking about Black History Month (youtube it, trust me).
Equality to me means equality for all. I hate the women vs men, gay vs straight divide that can come when arguing equality.
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Love that quote MissT, who said it?
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Cynthia Nixon
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Have you seen the video with the voice-over guy doing Morgan Freeman impressions? He is so right when he says that Morgan Freeman could talk about carpet and it would sound fabulous and interesting. He is such a compelling speaker! *runs off to youtube the talk*
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haha he is so funny and its so true.
rick your fabulous! but those stats are just so incredibly sad.
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Great article Rick! Spot on.
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I think quite often a logic trap is fallen into by the faux oppressed – when a Mum is criticised it’s seen as an attack on that Mum, or Mums in general. When a Dad is criticised, it’s seen as an attack on all men.
It isn’t, of course, and there are certainly examples of individual injustice, but your article is spot on.
The only only ONLY thing that really pisses me off is when I’m told, as a white middle class straight married man, I can’t possibily understand what it feels like to be oppressed. As if empathy isn’t a thought proccess or emotion available to me. That tends to get my goat a bit. So boo for me?
LOL.
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…and I also think it’s wrong to say that there aren’t any freedoms left for white straight males to aspire to either…I still think many people expect men to look and dress in a certain way…short hair, suits, clean-shaven…I obviously don’t worry about that, but I think a lot of men are forced to “look” a certain way because of the profession they are in…wouldn’t it be great if men had more freedom of choice about the way they choose to look and dress?
I know this isn’t as important as other inequalities, but it still exists…
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That’s not an inequality is it? Women who are lawyers cannot come to work dressed in a pretty little flowery dress, or sweat pants, either…
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Yeah, I’m not talking about being a complete slob like me, but if I wanted to join the army, I would HAVE to have short-back-and-sides…my female compatriots could choose to wear their hair long or short…
Yeah, I know, not really a big issue…but I would like to have the freedom to serve my country AND have long hair if I wanted to…(I clearly have issues about men and hair…
)
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Alright, i’ll give you the hair thing. Although women can’t have their hair touching their collars either, so it’s either short hair, or complicated updos that have to hold through practice….
I undertsand it’s a personal beef you have there though, i wouldn’t cut my hair for any type of workplace….
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Actually, there are rules about hair for military women. When they’re in training, they can only keep it long if it can be wrapped entirely in a bun on top of their head (e.g. no fringe). Otherwise they get a crew cut, just like the blokes.
For the men, each of the forces has their own policy re facial hair – Army clean shaven at all times, RAAF tidy moustache or clean shaven, RAN full, tidy beard or clean shaven. At least that how it used to be last Century
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As a service woman, I promise the female hair restrictions are just as strict as the men’s.
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Excellent point Idle – I do feel we sometimes can slip into the “man-bashing” state, and that is never cool, and can assume that if someone has the “upper hand” that they cannot empathise with others.
I think there should be some message that pops up on our screens that says, “Before hitting enter on that angry message, perhaps make yourself a nice cup of tea and think about someone you know and love in that situation. Now would you like to hit the edit button first?”
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You sure play the victim card on here tons rick, like most others. Why is it only one group of people do not have the right to stick up for themselves. I thought feminism, despite the name, was about equal rights and equal compassion when due. I find the notion that there is only one group that have to just shut up incredibly insulting, especially when coming from someone so apt at pointing out his disadvantages in every single post
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“Sorry, i cannot employ you, as a white straight male, i would be taking a risk regarding -paternity leave, losing our black and racist /straightophobic/feminist clientele, insert any ridiculous thing-”
i see how it’s hard being a straight white male.
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* like*
“Ah, of course, it’s the loud and noisy Faux Oppressed.”
Oh, THANK you for that phrase!
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Rick – You are a legand !! If only we had more men like you !!!!!!
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For the first time ever I am going for jobs and am being told – by others – that as a female I won’t be hired over men because I’m at ‘about that age’ when I’ll go off on maternity leave. I am so mad. For starters, I’m bloody well not about to go on maternity leave, and secondly, shouldn’t it be about my skills set not my sex? When a straight white man experiences that then he can tell me about his oppression.
Also, being a very female dominate industry I’m in I know that people jump at the change to employ a man. For no other reason than… he’s a man.
Argh.
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“We don’t have to take any rights to grant new ones”.
Love it. Particularly with regards to the right to marry whomever you choose.
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Bloody good article Rick.
One omission from the straight white men privilege – straight, white, men who are middle class. Australia isn’t as classist as other countries, I admit that, but I do think that the most privileged group are the straight, white, middle class men.
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Has anyone mentioned Tara Moss yet? Very interesting comments Age reviewer Cameron Woodhead made yesterday on a blog post Tara made to talk about an inequality in representation of female crime writes in crime writing awards… If you want to see a privileged white male whining about privilege (but refusing to acknowledge it), check it out: T http://blog.taramoss.com/index.php?itemid=648#more
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Mmmmm. On the gay marriage thing I think ‘oppressed’ is hard the word for it.
Having said that oppressed is one of those words that has such a broad meaning it goes from not being allowed to use the word married to being raped and pillaged and not allowed to speak in public.
I doubt eevryone will ever be equal. A little more getting on with life and a little less carrying on will probably get people there a bit quicker though.
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I’m with you in a sense. I don’t see myself as oppressed necessarily. But I’m certainly not equal. I’d love it if we all just got what everyone had and then we could go sip some tea or something and be jolly about life.
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Now there is something I will raise my glass to
I guess I consider myself equal because I don’t place any importance on being able to get married, to me it’s just a word.
Lose the tea, let’s have a beer!
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Um…. carrying on? We should all just be happy that we got the vote and that people aren’t allowed to own other people anymore? Sit back and consider how lucky we are compared to where we used to be?
Interesting perspective. I personally think it’s worth aiming for all the good things that SHOULD be in this world, even if you think they never will be.
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Didn’t say we shouldn’t be aiming for them. But I am seeing a lot of people getting so caught up in some battles (like marriage equality for one) that they’re forgetting that they also have a life to enjoy.
Just speaking from personal experience. Not judging anyone for wanting anything, but am a little over being told what that I want marriage equality, when honestly, I don’t care.
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You’re allowed not to care though…and thus not to fight for it! Is anyone forcing you to care, or do you get your gay card taken away for not caring?
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Your gay card is well and truly taken away from you (which isn’t something I’m worried about) but the majority of gays do tend to carry on like porkchops when you tell them you won’t don’t care about it.
Ah well. It’s always good to keep the discussion going though, that’s how things happen.
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Rofl , porkchops. I understand why they’d be mad though, most feminists are apalled by women who say “i don’t give a crap about earning as much as a man for the same job, i’m a stay at home mum so there”….
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Is that the twilight guy holding the sign?
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Oh dear, here we go again. Try telling the average divorsed working class bloke about all these so called privilages, he will look back at you blankly. All most of us blokes on here ask for is balance and recognition that there is another side, we dont suggest our issues are more important. We can all play the ‘my disadvantage list is longer than yours’ game. To suggest life is easy street for males is a joke Rick.
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It’s not a case of individual versus individual. That’s the point. Any one person can be worse off or better off than another. BUT, straight white men as a whole enjoy more privileges than any other group on Earth. That’s a fact. Nobody’s saying your personal problems don’t matter, however.
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We are not living in the congo here rick. Men and women have equal issues that need consideration in australia, and women have a minister to look out for theirs. What do you want, that we just shut up so women can tell us continuously how bad they have it. You have lost the plot on this one dear boy
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No what ‘we’ want is for people to stop with the Monty Python style comparison of ‘so you think YOU have it bad?! Well I____________ and its NOT FAIR’. That behaviour detracts from the original issue, and it also shows that you rate problems against your perception of your own.
Of course I am using ‘we’ and ‘you’ in a general sense but hopefully it will lead to a bit more clarity – because I know that there are many heterosexual men that CAN avoid this pitfall, and there are obviously some men who can’t.
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Exactly Rick! We are not talking individual circumstances here. Maybe life is tough for you anon but you know what my male co-worker earns more then me for the same job, AND never has to queue for the toilet!!
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I hope you realise that the reason children are usually placed with their mothers is because women are still seen as the primary caregiver of the family. The patriarchy hurts us all, not just women
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What a great argument. Like.
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That’s because men are seen as “having a full time job and making more money”, and women as “having a less important job that noone cares if they struggle to hold down while caring for kids “. I guess.
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Rick, we will NEVER be equal. You have an iPhone, and I don’t……
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Then I shall stop and help you my friend. We can play Angry Birds together!
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Oh, cool. Hang on while I wind my phone up. It’s clockwork, you see…..
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Ten pin bowling is like Angry Birds but without pigs.
Just trying to think of something you’ll have heard of so you can work up to the concept!
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Oh Rick, I’m a little bit in love with you right now. Those commenters have been maddening with their constant derailing and self-pity. There’s not a single topic relating to women and women’s experiences that they don’t seem to be able to turn into complaints about the Terrible! Oppressive! Women! So happy to see this posted (and I am totally stealing the phrase “faux oppressed”).
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To be honest, I’m thinking about turning it into fauxppressed and then throwing it everywhere..
Yes, I have terrible jokes. I’m fine with that.
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Kudos Rick!! I work in a very “male” industry and myself and female co-workers face bullshit discrimination every day.
An example- smart intelligent and extremely gifted female co-worker was given a promotion which involved lots of OS travel to source new products. After many months of the new role not eventuating, our business director whom she would be travelling with drunkly told her at after work drinks that she can’t ever travel OS as everyone would think they were f*cking…. I’m sorry, since when does being a woman make you a slut AND if it was a man he would have no issue. I’m so angry for her and our company is going to lose a talented employee (she is looking elsewhere)
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That is seriously disgraceful. What the hell is wrong with people!
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I know! I told her to go to HR, but the HR manager is a sleazeball, who tried to shag another newly married and very shy co-worker at last years xmas party (she has also since left). We are a part of a massive company, you would be shocked….
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Of course, once gay marriage is legal he won’t be able to travel overseas with anyone, because gay marriage will be forced on any two men found together alone without women! Or something.
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just like it is being forced on Bert and Ernie….
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Is it? What do they have to say about that?
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hehehe you’re funny idle dad!
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As soon as I read the title I instantly thought of that Louis CK bit.
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I like your work Rick! Great post
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Fabulous – thank you!
I have two little girls and the equality thing is hard… like trying to explain why some boys at kinder (we’re talking 3 and 4 year olds) chased my daughter out of the construction area telling her she couldn’t do it “because you’re a girl”. Really?! I didn’t come across this at all with my older daughter so it came as a bit of a shock that these tiny little people had that attitude.
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What a bad bad attitude, I hope you sued the kinder for gender discrimination…..I mean 3 and 4 year olds should really know better shouldnt they??
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Ha ha (genuine, not sarcastic). Of course I have no issue with the children or with the kinder. This is learned behaviour and obviously there is someone in their lives who does have this attitude.
Anyway, why can’t three and four year olds be encouraged to know better?
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That ‘Anonymous’ above was me.
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No they are not oppressed, but why did I know this article would be written by Rick?
Everyone is not going to be equal ever, I’ll just worry about equal pay and things that matter. I don’t want to do everything straight white men do anyway. A lot of perceived oppression by many groups is self imposed, you can’t change everyone’s opinions. Some people get sick of groups that think everything is based on the one thing that makes them a minority, like some races are known for jumping up and down saying it was all because I’m a foreigner! whereas other foreigners just get on with it.
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I’m not even sure what you mean by your first line!
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You say ” I don’t want to do everything straight white men do anyway” but that is exactly the point. You don’t have to, but you should have the right to if you choose.
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I mean I wouldn’t fight to join a men’s dinner club in town, join an all male sports team – sure could fight for it, but what’s the point?
Just a matter of picking your battles.
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yes but the rights don’t exist purely for you.
you seem to be completely missing the point.
things like joining an all male sports team is not what the issue is about at all.
Rather, the very real glass ceiling which exists within our society is an issue that needs to be tackled.
As is the fact that women get paid less than men to do the same jobs. The fact is the gap between male and female average full-time weekly earnings does exist and is currently almost 18 per cent.
That is why you should fight for equality.
And man, I’m cynical, but I was even taken aback by your attitude. Statements such as ‘everybody is not going to be equal ever’ really don’t help.
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Very. Well. Said. Rick.
That’s all I have to say.
Aside from thanks for articulating something I have had difficulty doing.
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Love it Rick!! So true! Hilarious clip too.
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I grew up with a father always banging on with ‘men’s rights, enough women’s rights already!’. Thinly veiled misogyny methinks.
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Hands down this is your best piece for MM Rick!
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Can I frame comments?
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What you need to do is save them in a ‘positive feedback’ file for your quarterly review.
Or do non-corporates even do that kind of thing?
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i totally agree. it is brilliant. i think it should be plastered EVERYWHERE
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Two very enthusiastic thumbs up!
Video made me ‘lol’ too.
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Right on.
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There’s a name for this, it’s called ‘downward envy’ … being jealous of those who are worse off than you because they appear to be getting something you’re not. Indigenous people getting help to stay at school, refugees being flown to family funerals, gay people getting a headline .. it’s small minded, whingy and selfish. Great piece, Rick.
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Downward envy, that’s fascinating!
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It’s how Republicans get the poor to vote for them. “You might be poor, look at how the left is trying to help those mexicans” or something.
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Downward Envy…I haven’t heard of that before but it fits perfectly.
A disease of the small minded, and also of those with deeply impaired self worth.
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I remember being in grade four and getting so angry when an Indigenous girl in my class got a birthday cake on her birthday from the Koori centre at the school, which was two days after mine (when I bought in my own cake for the class). It just didn’t seem fair that that girl got something I didn’t and it was because she was Aboriginal. I went home crying and mum explained it exactly like that – I was being jealous of someone worse off than me, for getting the same thing I did, but from someone else. Perfect example of juvenile ‘downward envy’ – luckily I grew out of that pretty quickly xD
Things can seem unfair until you actually think about whether or not you’d swap your whole life/situation for that one thing…
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I’m going through it at work at the mo. (Govt dept).
WE have an Aboriginal co-worker who did nothing. Bugger all. Youtube and Facebook. For six months. He then got a new job, with $20k extra.
I’ve been looking for another job for three years (although I’m admittedly very specifc in what I am after).
I am furious. Mad that he got away with doing nothing, while I feel scrutinised to be productive every minute of the day. Mad that he got another job (he must have got a decent reference, right?). Mad he got a pay rise.
But mostly: Mad that by being lazy, he is letting down his people, while the rest of us work really hard to try to empower them. And that his position is Aboriginal specific, which means that he has less work and educational experience than the others in his team, but that is ok bc he a role model to his community and has other experience and knowledge of value.
Some role model…
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I also work for the govt and I’ve seen this with a lot of indigenous support workers. One goes off on saras (study) leave frequently leaving me to see the clients alone. Another has been bombarding me with sexually explicit emails. These are just the more recent examples. The ones that have been good with our clients end up being promoted and don’t see clients anymore. It’s frustrating, but I do know the job is frustrating too. Sigh, what to do?
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Great article Rick! Hilarious video too.
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Rick, if I were a man, a gay man, and we were allowed to marry, I would propose to you over this article.
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And maybe I’d say yes!
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Make that 2 proposals
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No no, you can’t have him … Rick, I want your genes in my family gene pool …. I have a really, really nice gay cousin and he’s in a relationship already but I can fix that and …
I so love what you have written today
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Love your work Rick.
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Brilliant Article. Well written Rick.