Mia Freedman
BY MIA FREEDMAN
When you have a skirmish with someone on social media, the world is watching. OK, not the world. Nelson Mandela and Lady Gaga are usually pretty busy but there are always plenty of strangers keen to jump in and pelt you with tomatoes.
And that’s how it went down earlier this week when I became the public target of some pretty choice insults from iconic Australian feminist Anne Summers. It started innocently enough – it always does. I was having a chat on Twitter with my friend, journalist Julia Baird, about Hillary Clinton.
I’ve always loved Hillary and never more than now. She’s at the top of her game, in the prime of her career. She’s no longer defined as someone’s wife or mother. She’s kicking goals, kicking arse and winning international acclaim as secretary of state (which is the equivalent of our foreign minister but with actual power and immeasurable influence).
As Julia and I tweeted cheerily about how magnificent Hillary is, the subject of whether she’d run for president in 2016 popped up. Could this be her time? Her window?
The image that sparked the tribute tumblr Txts from HIllary
A US president can only serve two concurrent terms so assuming Obama is reelected this year, he cannot run again in 2016. He’ll be done. This leaves the way open for Hillary to contest the Democratic ticket for the presidency, something she missed out on when her party picked Obama over her in 2008.
Except. Hillary will be 69 in 2016. Is that too old to put your hand up for the most important and demanding job in the world? I mildly observed on Twitter that perhaps it was. That perhaps 2016 would be too late for Hillary. Not because she’s a woman but because I think being the President Of The United States (POTUS) is a younger person’s game. Not a 30 year old but not a 70 year old either.
That’s when famed Australian feminist and author Anne Summers unexpectedly parachuted into our conversation:
When someone suggested that was a bit harsh, she replied:
I was a bit reeling after that very publicly back-hand and replied:
but she wasn’t finished:
Except I never said anything about a ‘scrap heap’.
Her words, certainly not mine.
Others quickly chimed in crossly, citing Ronald Reagan who was President from age 69 until he was almost 78 and republican candidate John McCain who was 72 when he ran against Obama in 2008.
They brandished these examples triumphantly as evidence that 69 isn’t too old to run for POTUS except I don’t think either man sells the idea of older political leaders very well. Reagan was plagued by health problems during his Presidency including recurring skin cancers, hearing and prostate problems.
There was also wide speculation that the Alzheimer’s with which he was formally diagnosed after he left office had begun while he was still at The White House. Some journalists later admitted they were conflicted about whether to report some worrying behaviour they witnessed towards the end of Reagan’s presidency that suggested dementia.
Meanwhile, McCain had a heart condition, leading to speculation that if he was elected, his running mate Sarah Palin would be ‘one heartbeat away from being President’. Many say that cost him votes.
Still, when a tweeter called @olderworkers began accusing me of being ‘ageist’ and others began piling on, I took a breath and walked away from a barney I never meant to have. I also wanted to consider the criticism and gather some thoughts that were longer than 140 characters.
Is it really ageist to question the physical stamina of a 69 year old who could be 77 by the time her hypothetical presidency is finished?
Looking at the POTUS’ job description from the bleachers, it’s hard to imagine a more demanding gig. Mentally, emotionally, physically. The stress is relentless. And people do slow down as they get older. We all do. That’s just biology. And the more stressful your life, the bigger toll it takes. How exhausted does Obama look? And he’s only 50.
It’s a sad fact that wisdom and life experience are woefully undervalued in our society. Perhaps that’s why Anne Summers lashed out. There are many skills you can’t download via Google, many aspects of emotional intelligence that can’t be fast-tracked.
But US election campaigns are extraordinarily hardcore – they last up to a year and there are 52 50 states to visit, multiple times each.
And that’s before you win and have to start actually running the country. If Hillary runs for President in 2016, she will have just come off the back of eight years as secretary of state with all the travel and stress that entails.
Is it so offensive to suggest she – or any 69 year old – may lack the stamina to be the leader of the Western World?
For a job like POTUS, I think it requires a balance of wisdom experience and enormous stamina. I’m not sure what the magic age is. Somewhere between 45 and 65 perhaps? I’m you have your own view.
I cannot state strongly enough how much I value the contribution of older people in our society. There should be more of it.
In fact last week Mamamia published a post about older people by 20 year old Sean Power. It was a call to other Gen Y’ers to look at the older generation and see wisdom, not someone who doesn’t use lol in the right way (you can read it here).
Being a political leader is not a beauty contest or a triathlon. Age and experience are a necessity. But at what point does your age become a liability? I don’t know the answer but it’s one that American voters may have to consider well before 2016.
How old do you think is too old to be a political leader? Or does age not matter at all?
Comments
228 Comments so far
Firstly, I agree with Mia’s point. This doesn’t mean that Hillary should be discounted from the race but there should be escalating attention paid to the physical and mental health of ANYONE after the age of 55, this should be formalised in the case of a person who has the power to cause incredible harm if they lose it while in performance of the their duties.
Secondly, I think it’s a shame that Anne chose to open ‘debate’ by name calling and rudeness instead of reasoned discussion. I have lost a degree of respect for her as a result.
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I think the main thing everyone forgets here is that ‘IT WAS MIA’s OPINION” and the last I checked everyone is entitled to their own opinion??
Hang in there Mia – I think you’re wonderful, a role model and decent person, regardless of any opinions I agree or disagree with.
T xx
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Hi Mia … I think you come up against comments like Anne Summer’s so frequently because of the way you are willing to literally throw your thoughts out to cyberspace. It’s a brave thing to do but you would have to be a little naive to think that it is not provocative. However, that is no excuse for other’s nastiness.
I don’t think the responders actually understand the tone of your thoughts being more as a question than an absolute statement of an opinion that you might hold that cannot possibly be changed.
Perhaps, I am giving you a lot of leeway here too. It may be that your intention is to “spark debate” which becomes quite personal towards you but then it is your thoughts that you are throwing out there too.
It would be interesting to see how responses changed if you changed the wording of your thoughts to show that your opinions are still in progress on a particular topic.
I enjoy your courage and ability to throw stuff out there but if you are worried and hurt by the responses then maybe you need to rethink it?
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100% agree with this. I agree Anne should not have spoken by name calling and completely disregarding any positive changes to feminism that Mia has made. However if Mia is going to continue to make provocative statements to get a reaction she will need to understand that she will occasionally get a negative reaction
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” I’m not a fan of elderly presidents “.
But……but…..but…….but…..but
Mia, I believe that in this instance digging a hole for yourself was the last thing that you had in mind. Then someone gave you a shovel and you decided that it wasn’t such a bad idea
As someone once said, you’re only ever as old as you feel.
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It’s sad that we live in such a politically correct world that we can’t even ask innocent questions like this… Sure, if Mia has said, “Hilary is waaaaay too old to be president, she should just retire already!”, I can understand some offence being taken, but it is such an important position that all of these factors are very important when considering if she might be the best person for the job.
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This is a tough one as I can see both sides of the arguement. You want someone with a depth of experience, knowledge and ability to cover all bases but then someone with stamina, youth and ability to take the country into the future. Personally, I think Hilary would make a fantastic POTUS regardless of her age. BUT I wouldn’t be surprised to see her step down and want to hang out with her grandchildren either. I believe her daughter has at least one child – maybe two.
Girly comment coming up…
I love that she has let her hair grow – go the older woman with long hair.
And finally, I think Anne Summers inital comment is out of line. Her last comment which actually explains her point clearer is much better. Name calling and attacking Mia personally is just rude. Manners people… manners.
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Age is such a relative thing. I remember my partner being shocked when he realised my parents are only a year or two younger than his. “But my parents are old” he said “yous are young”. And he is right, my parents have such a young at heart attitude to life, I don’t see them slowing down anytime soon.
I suspect Hillary Clinton (who I also think is great) is like that. She strikes me as the type of person who would decide to run a marathon at 90.
BUT I don’t see any issue in questioning age when it comes to an important job like POTUS. People, even fantastic capable people, do develop age related illnesses, we can’t help it, it is just how things are. So how do we stop a situation like Regan happening again?
Maybe the question Mia should have asked is where is the line that you can ask for medical tests? Older workers are really important and shouldn’t be discriminated against, but where issues of safety etc are involved, where can you ask for medical tests to show that you don’t have an age related illness which we know can be very hard to detect in the early days. I honestly have no idea, how do you follow this stuff up without discrimination?
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I’m interested to see if Summers would have got all up in a tizzy if you’d been referring to a male.
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Hillary already does a job that is almost as demanding as being President. It might be more so, because she possibly has less support staff. So by saying she’s too old for President, we’re essentially saying she’s too old to work in her current role too. At what age should we force her to retire?
My big problem with this is that by saying you have reservations because of energy levels and health, then I wonder how people would feel about a mother of small children, or a cancer survivor, or someone who *looked* unhealthy (obese/thin/elderly)?
I think Ms Clinton will be under so much scrutiny and so well supported, any health problems will be quickly made obvious.
What she needs to do is buy a Wallabies tracksuit and go power walking every morning….
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I agree with your first paragraph. Your final paragraph is so true!
But. Your second paragraph. I can understand the small children thing – I have an 18 month old. But cancer survivor? Do you think people who have cancer and survive it spend the rest of their lives with poor health? I had cancer 13 years ago. I was given the all clear 6 years ago. At that point the oncologist told me that if I was to get cancer again, it would be considered a different, new cancer.
I really want to know, because if this is the way people think, maybe I should stop being open and honest about having cancer in my past!
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My granddad got his doctorate at the age of 86. He is now 97 and still lives independently in his home, writes articles for various publications and passes his many years of wisdom on to his grandchildren and great grandchildren. He was able to handle the rigours of study in his mid 80′s and by all accounts enjoyed it immensely.Yes its not running a country, but a doctorate is not an easy task for anyone of any age. I think age is irrelevant, it is simply about ability. We already know with average age expectancy increasing and more people choosing not to have children that this country faces a future with a large population of elderly people and not enough younger people to support the tax base. In the future we will work well past what is now considered retirement age. You mention Reagan and McCain as examples of failing health but make no mention of previous presidents who suffered numerous health and other problems. Roosevelt suffered congestive heart failure and hypertension whilst JFK had Addison’s disease. George W. Bush was a reformed alcoholic & cocaine addict. Hillary’s own husband was a philanderer. If none of these illnesses or vices precluded these men from being President, I fail to see why Hillary’s age even rates a mention.
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When talking about the future US president, the issue of age has always been up for discussion. In every US presidential election the health of the respective candidates is scrutinised in great detail, and age is a part of this. John McCain’s medical history and age were debated openly in the public realm during the 2008 campaign, and rightly so. Given that all past US presidents were men, and their health has been held up in minor detail, I think that gender is irrelevant to a discussion of whether being elderly makes you unfit to fulfil the role of the US president.
I agree with the points that Mia made regarding age and the US presidency. Barack Obama is in his prime age-wise, health-wise, and he’s aged considerably since taking office. That’s how stressful the job is.
Also, the 140 characters of Twitter mean that choice of phrasing is limited sometimes. I think this is a case of deliberating choosing to take offence so that an inflammatory response could be given.
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I think saying “I’m not a fan of elderly Presidents” does sound ageist.
There are some fair points made in this article about concerns over the health of certain people of a certain age but you didn’t say “maybe she won’t feel up to being POTUS at that age” you just stated that *you* are not a fan of the elderly doing such things…
If someone at age 69, or 109, feel that they have the stamina to do a tough job then that’s for them to decide…some people ARE up to the job at that age, others aren’t. But to say you’re not a fan of someone who could be the best person for the job simply because they’re “elderly” is ageist in my opinion.
Your intent may have been different but your words did sound very ageist. Perhaps just see it for what it is and own it or apologise for a thoughtless and hurtful remark?
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One of the reasons it’s so hard for younger people to get into politics is the time and money required.
The time and massive support team is another reason why it’s hard for women to get into politics as well. I’m thinking Kate Jones and her little boy’s ear infection on the eve of election.
As for the age question – the older I get, the more I see how different everyone’s energy levels are. Me – I don’t think I could do this at 69, but I have no doubt Hilary can and lots of others could. Should they? Would they be out of touch with younger people? Again, it depends on their persona. I still listen to Triple J and I’m mid-forties….
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I swing the other way. I want to see more younger people in Government and running for presidency. Sometimes I think politicians are so backwards in their thinking and so behind with what they think the public wants that we should get a 30 year old to run the country.
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Yes, I used to think that too. Then I grew up.
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Love your work Stephan.
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Well thankfully I have already and my opinion still stands.
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Why not get an 18 year old whilst they still know everything. The trouble with “younger” people in government is they dont have the life experiences to make informed decisions. There are always consequences – expected or unexpected – to decisions. The older you get the more you understand these things and factor them into the decisions. The politicians that make the biggest mistakes are the ones that have spent their entire life in the political system and dont posess any real “life” skills. Try running a business with your own money before you start playing with other peoples money. That way you will know what it is like to make a poor decison becuse it will effect your hip pocket. Youger politicians bring fresh ideas and enthusiasm but this doesnt mean they are good ideas. Cast your mid back to Kevins 2020 summit. There were 1000 of the “brightest” people putting there heads together to come up with ideas. How many exactly have been acted on ?
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Mia, do you ever want to step away from being a social commentator? You get a lot of flack sometimes. People who know you or read this website know you’re not nasty. You have my support.
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Lola? Yes. And thank you. x
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I think it’s a legitimate question and one that will certainly come up if she pursues the job.
Haven’t read all the comments but hope that there aren’t any along the lines of ‘this is only an issue because she is a woman’ as it’s not true. As Ms Freeman notes, it certainly came up in Reagan’s case (and he probably was too old in his second term although he did manage to bring down the Soviet Empire in his second term which is not a bad alternative to playing law bowls). His response when asked whether it was an issue was ‘I promise not to make my opponent’s age and inexperience an issue’.
If Hillary runs (why do we refer to female pollies by their first names and males by last name?) a lot will depend on how she handles this question. She’s never struck me as overburdened with a sense of humour but if she can’t defuse it in a humourous way she’s toast. Just as Obama had to avoid the ‘Angry Black’ label to get elected, Clinton must navigate the ‘Humourless Feminist’ trap.
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I guess with her it’s because her husband is ‘Clinton’ so it would all get confusing?
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Let’s not forget what was originally said “I am not a fan of elderly presidents”. It seems to me that there has been a lot of backpeddling from there.
One of the things I like a lot about American public life is that there are more older people in positions of authority than in Aus or NZ.
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But remember that comment was on twitter where you only have 140 characters
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Hence why you shouldn’t “chat” on twitter!!!!
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This is such a brave and honest article. I think lots of old people should just retire and live the good life. 69 is heaps too old to do such a young job as running the number one country in the world. Relax, have a few martinis and take up knitting or something. lol
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As an American (living here) and Hillary fan, I don’t get what the issue is with raising the question about age…it’s a fair question as is any real question about the health of a potential US President (or any national leader). I would not not vote for Hillary because of her age, but I’d want to be comfortable that she (or any candidate) was up to the job health-wise … and I’d want to be comfortable with the VP choice … as I would with any candidate.
I can and will continue to vote in all US presidential elections and I would LOVE to have the chance to vote for a healthy 69 year old Hillary!
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I must be a failure as a feminist. I didn’t even know who Anne summers was until I googled her.
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I think her Wikipedia entry speaks for itself – so many notable achievements in journalism and women’s rights.
Her book ‘Damned Whores and God’s Police’ about the history of Australian women is fantastic.
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Yes I saw that book and I have actually heard of it.
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As long as you didn’t get her confused with the UK underwear shop!
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I think it’s quite inelegant to dedicate a whole column to a personal Twitter stoush.
It seems the column is more about ‘nasty’ people who are mean to Mia and less about age and politics. Otherwise, surely the argument would have been better researched with notable examples of Mandela and Romney.
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Cara for president!! (hope you are aged somewhere between 45 and 65!!!)
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Really well said Cara! I 100% agree. Mia often blogs about how something she has said has been reacted to adversely by the public and, more often than not, other members of the media.
It’s like you say these things without thinking about the implications, and expect people to agree, or not state that you – shock! horror! – may actually be wrong, and, in saying that, ignorant.
Please stop playing the victim on your blog every time people say something “nasty” to you, or you don’t get the response you want from a particular comment/post/article. Anne Summers, who is an extremely well-respected and professional journalist, had the right to call you up when she did.
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I agree Mia. Age is at least a factor and there’s nothing wrong with talking about it. It’s why we have compulsory annual driving tests for people of a certain age and why we don’t have elderly people in the army.
I don’t think what Mia said was insinuating elderly people belong in the scrap heap. They have certain limitations. It’s ok to acknowledge that.
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Ditto to everything you’ve said, GJ.
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Absolutely. Just as someone in their 20s or 30s may have limitations in terms of experience. Age *is* relevant. Its just not determinative.
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The Australian High Court has a mandatory retirement age of 70.
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US Supreme Court does not have a mandatory retirement age. Both Justice Oliver Wendell Holmes, Jr., and Justice John Paul Stevens served on the US Supreme Court until they were 90 years old.
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I think so much depends on the individual. It’s possible Hillary has more stamina and capacity than someone half her age.
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I think you are ageist on this occasion Mia. Age is a number. Hilary needs good health and intellectual capacity to be POTUS. I know a 90 year completing a PhD and nothing stops her. We need to stop seeing age in terms of illness but rather as a person with the experience and ability. Illness is not the province of the elderly after all. The US has a President who survived polio after all.
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Age is not just a number, it’s a biological indicator of what’s happening inside one’s body. Of course life experience is incredible important, but it’s no more legal for a mature-minded 17 year old to drink alcohol than it is for an immature one. Why? because biologically the brain is still developing and alcohol can cause lasting damage.
of course, there are many specific cases of biologically older people achieving many amazing feats that are usually reserved for the younger population, and congratulations to them for that. but for many people their age, biologically, their body has begun degrading.
as another comment above stated, Mia never said Hilary shouldn’t be president because she’s too old, merely raised a question and gave her own opinion as one possible answer
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Look at that photo of Hillz used in the Texts from Hillary site – tell her she’s too old, go on, I DARE you!
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I think people that take twitter posts too seriously need better things to do with their time. This age of political correctness is frankly quite frustrating, can’t someone voice their opinion without being open to abject scrutiny every single time they voice something on twitter? Anyway, I agree with Mia, the American Presidency is one of the most important jobs in the world, and the person doing it needs to be up for it both mentally and physically.
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There is a saying, it is not what you say but how you say it.
I read this and believed that Mia posed an opinion, based on a thought she has been contemplating, as to whether anyone of a certain age had the stamina to take on what s obviously a very demanding job at a particular age.
The response of Ann was a personal attack as opposed to an articulate answer to disagree with Mia’s point of view. I have also read many comment below that were personal attacks.
I thought this site was about giving people an opinion, not that everyone must agree on the issue that the writer has bravely put out there. I don’t always agree with the writer or the readers but I would only place my opinion, not lash out at other people for not thinking like I did.
On this particular issue, I believe it is valid to question whether any candidate has the stamina for the job and logically age would have to be a considering factor in that analysis. I also know very energetic people over the age of 69 but would they have the capacity for a job as demanding as this? I do not believe that simply asking a reasonable question makes me, or anyone else, ageist.
Thank you Mia for continually putting yourself out there.
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Another excellent response that I agree wholeheartedly with, Mum of 3.
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“There are 52 states to visit”
Last I checked the USA only had 50 states, didn’t it?
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50 plus Australia and uk
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50 mainland and alaska and Hawaii, NOT Australia and the UK.
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No, 50 including Alaska and Hawaii
Not sure what 52 refers to.
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My bad. I’ve heard of the 52 states being thrown about before too though.
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I believe 52 refers to the 50 states plus the 2 ‘jurisdictions’ – Washington DC and Puerto Rico.
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Thanks, I’m not going crazy after all!
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Can Mia please clarify if that’s what she meant – 50 states plus two other areas – of if it was a typo?
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I can indeed clarify that I made a mistake. Thought there were 52 states. Not quite the main thrust of what I was trying to say however…..
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Mia, I don’t think you’re being ageist. I’ve worked with the elderly before, and it’s a sad fact of life that time does cruel things to our bodies. I’m being rude, or ageist, or harsh, and I’m also not saying that it’s a set-in-stone rule. For some, the timeline is different, and they continue to thrive, mentally and physically. For example, the wonderful Dr. Catherine Hamlin, who at age 89 is a tireless advocate for those less fortunate and a practicing physician.
I think in the case of Hilary it is not yet time to judge whether she will be fit for office in 2016, bad things can sometimes happen very quickly. However, that said, she seems to be a dynamic, independent woman with sensible ideas, and certainly if she continues on this track she may well be a fantastic President. Look at Maggie Thatcher!
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There are many occasions that I don’t agree with you Mia when you get caught in public stoushes! But today I am totally with you. The question you ask is 100% valid in context – that being ‘would Hillary be able to bring the necessary energy to the position of US President at 69?’
Maybe she can, maybe she can’t, but it’s certainly not ageist to ask the question.
P.S. love the photo of you at the beginning of the post!
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Exactly what I think Kelly. So many times I disagree with Mia – stopped following her on twitter – but I totally agree with the fact it was simply a question where she expressed her opinion and asked for ours. Mind you my opinion is I think Hilary is still fully competent enough to make her own decision and I doubt she cares what we think!
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I really like Hillary, and I would love her to be president. She spoke at my university graduation many many many years ago (Clinton was President) and it was awesome. (in San Francisco). My two cents: I don’t think Obama looks exhausted (my opinion) and I don’t think age matters past 60, how depressing if it does. I’d like to think if you keep yourself fit and healthy age doesn’t matter at all.
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oh, just had a thought, wouldn’t it be great if Michelle did a Hillary and ran for office? one can dream….
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She is one of the few women who will be able to run without being called deliberately barren, or accused of neglecting her children. Maybe not the best age, but she would be the ideal first female president because she would sidestep many of the hollow attacks other female leaders get.
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I’m in my thirties and I’m already exhausted. And it gets worse? At this rate I’ll be comatose by the time I’m 45!
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This to me is another example of people not being able to accept life facts. It’s not ageist, it’s fact. Generally people once reaching a certain age begin to lose some physical and cognitive functions. It doesn’t make them any less valuable and i have huge respect for older people and think we can learn alot from them but that doesn’t mean a pensioner is fit to be the leader of the free world. I remember as a young child my older brother taught me a good lesson. He said I needed to be careful with men and never get in a situation where it became physical because I would most likely lose. That annoyed me and I said no I will be strong and be able to win, noone will ever hurt me and he said to me I’m not being mean because youre a girl I’m being real. Biologically women are not as strong as men, we’re built differently. It’s true, men on average do have more strength than women just like people deteriorate with age. Anyone who disagrees obviously does so because they are scared to admit the truth for personal reasons. Although, as previously stated this is only a generalized statement and there are exceptions to all rules.
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It’s not like Hilary would go from sitting on the couch knitting to traversing the world stage making world impacting decisions – she already does that – so in a way, you could say she is ‘match fit’. She, above all other candidates (obvs because of her been-there-done-that experience) knows what the role entails. I trust her judgement. If the lady thinks she can do the job, the lady can do the job…
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I think that it’s sad for women who take the back seat for many years while their partners rock awesome careers in their primes. And finally when we are no longer defined as someone’s wife or mother, we are labelled too old.
I would happily entrust my life to a 69 year old surgeon. I’d happily take a 69 year old legal rep to court with me. I’m pretty sure that one of my kids has s teacher who is older than this. Infact my Inlaws are over 69 and have amazing careers in high pressured jobs which require interstate and overseas travel at least twice a week.
It’s called life experience, Mia. And taking care if yourself. I can think of nobody more knowledgable or qualified for such important roles in society as an older person. And if they are too tired, unwell, weak – I’m pretty sure that they are educated enough to take action if need be. Or one their 5000 staff would. Common sense, Mia.
It’s unfortunate that you have these opinions and put them out there for public criticism. I hope that if you are going to continue to chat in a public forum about topics that could be offensive to people, that you find a way to cope other than to draw more attention to it by posting about it. I didn’t know about this “barney” until just now. I do have to say I always really liked you but since Mamamia I have come to realise how ignorant, closed minded and black or white you are. Not really the voice of young women I thought you were. Maybe you’re getting too old?
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Hi Baby Nightingale, there’s no need to be snide because you disagree with my opinion in this column or any other.
I’m speaking on behalf of myself, not other women. As usual.
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Oh come on Mia. You’re allowed to call someone too old but if someone turns the tables and calls you too old it’s snide? I agree with everything BN says. I also used to think you were fabulous, until I started reading MM. You of course have every right to voice your opinions. But given this forum readers should be able to criticise them if they are ignorant, bigoted or close minded without you having a hissy fit. Which frankly they are the majority of the time. You might grate less on people if you took criticism graciously..
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Baby Nightingale’s comment was dripping with rudeness and condescension. Nobody needs to take criticism graciously if it’s rude. Constructive criticism and disagreeing is expected and I think is usually handled very graciously by Mia.
I don’t think her above comment is a ‘hissy fit’ by any standard.
And you can disagree with her opinions (politely and constructively) all you like, but comments like “I have come to realise how ignorant, closed minded and black or white you are” are not directed at the topic being discussed, but at her as a person. Which is just rude, this is not a forum to discuss Mia as a person, it’s to discuss the issue the article is about.
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Mia is entitled to defend her opinion, without it being called a “hissy fit”.
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Agreed. Everytime Mia is criticised by the public she jumps straight on her blog to justify herself and argue her point, in what I assume is an attempt to win sympathy. I really don’t think it helps! Mia – perhaps time to take a step back and accept that what you said was careless and small-minded: “I’m not a fan of elderly presidents, regardless of gender”.
Ok, so – that’s your opinion and you are “entitled to your opinion”. But you are also a public figure and a social commentator. That means you have to draw the line when it comes to making careless comments about something as pivotal as age and presidents. This is an extreme example but the Ku Klux Klan are of the opinion that black people are wrong. On this basis, if everyone went around saying, “Oh that’s just their opinion. Everyone is entitled to their opinion!”, the world would be a VERY scary place.
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Exactly. I’ve never once seen Mia address any criticism with anything but defensiveness or justification. Is Mamamia a genuine forum for public discourse or a vanity project?
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SO WELL SAID!
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The acronym POTUS reads like a nasty case of tummy upset.
On a more serious note though – there are two issues here:
Will the demands of presidency be too much for a 69+ year old?
And
The way a public forum like twitter (and this site) seems to make it ok for people to name call and hurl abuse and shut down ideas.
On the second issue – there is an opinion that as a writer, you put yourself out there and so you should expect criticism, difference of opinion and abuse. No. The Internet enables bullies to hide behind screens. We want children to stop cyber bullying but how can they when adults don’t set a good example?
On the first topic – I think fitness for the job is dependent on an individual’s circumstance. Hillary may be very fit, and she may have a good team behind her.
Now can we just stop using the acronym POTUS?
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Well you can see why they’ve gone with the acronym POTUS… it’s certainly better than the alternative – PUS!
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Totally agree with you on the second issue.
The first, let’s wait and see. If she’s still up to it, then good for her.
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Couldn’t have said it better myself!
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How about “POTUSA” – or, pot user?
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It’s not the comment that’s the problem, Mia, you are perfectly entitled to your opinion. The problem is having those opinions expressed in a public forum like Twitter. It enables people with differing opinions to bite back.
You’ve now brought this issue to a wider audience. Will you be giving Anne Summers the right of reply here too? The choice was there on Twitter to shut down the debate there if you wished.
For the record, I think Hilary would make a fab president at age 69. Google ‘Retirement Age 75′ and check the results. Sure, POTUS is not your average job but I think all candiates (regardless of age) should undertake a physical and mental assessment before their candidacy is confirmed.
And given the strife the US is in, economically and monetarily speaking, I’d run away from an offer of POTUS as fast as my 41 year old legs could carry me.
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Anne summers is most welcome to comment here at any time. Although when asked about it on twitter yesterday she replied she didn’t have time to read “crap Sunday newspaper columns” so I’m guessing she won’t.
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Wasn’t she responding to a question about Bettina Arndt’s (undeniably crap) column in The Age on Sunday? That’s how it read to me.
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Im sorry Mia but I do think you have been ageist. Some 69 year olds are very fit and healthy with loads of stamina and can outlast people half their age. It is a very individual thing. I’m sure you know this. Maybe you could have tweeted about how fit and healthy anyone would need to be to do such a demanding job. Still love your work though
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I agree. My mum turned 75 yesterday, had a knee reconstruction 4 weeks ago, and still won’t sit down for longer than it takes to drink a coffee! She’s definately still got plenty of stamina at her age (I’m sadly lacking in comparison). So I agree that it does depend on the individual.
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First things first, now following Julia on twitter.
Hope you don’t get tired of the endless criticism and give up Mia. None of us are perfect and we are all entitled to our opinion, our thoughts, our ramblings, our half arsed half thought through Twittering. We don’t have to answer and explain ourselves, especially to those so quick to rush to judgment and paddle along in that sea of judgment they claim to shun. Whether I agree with you or not, I have the good grace to respect people and get over myself.
You don’t deserve to be treated like this – and I’m not just talking about this example. Bit over all this finger wagging.
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Eva, you’ll love following Julia. She’s one of the smartest women I’ve ever met.
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This is news to me and 70% of the electorate!
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Are you confusing julia Baird with Julia Gillard?
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I’d love to see her run……….a fierce intelligence is driven by a fierce energy and I really want to see her deal with all of those rabid misogynists. Obama has had an absolutely gigantic task trying to fix so many problems old & new that it’s shocking that people actually expected him to prevail in his first term……….Obama or Hillary – that’s it………I hate to think of our future without their influence.
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“Others quickly chimed in crossly, citing Ronald Reagan who was President from age 69 until he was almost 78 and republican candidate John McCain who was 72 when he ran against Obama in 2008.
They brandished these examples triumphantly as evidence that 69 isn’t too old to run for POTUS except I don’t think either man sells the idea of older political leaders very well. Reagan was plagued by health problems during his Presidency including recurring skin cancers, hearing and prostate problems.”
But Mia, you’ve made this argument retrospectively to support your initial comment which is, yes, ageist, whether you care to admit it or not. You’ve dismissed someone’s ability to do a job based purely on their age. The fact you’ve done it to a woman baffles me even more so. I haven’t seen you tweet about Mitt Romney being too old for the job of POTUS and he’s 65.
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oh, and i’m not sure if any one else has mentioned it, but Nelson Mandela was 76 when he was elected to lead South Africa. I don’t think anyone’s ever suggested he was too old to lead a country.
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“I don’t think anyone’s ever suggested he was too old to lead a country.”
A much smaller country, with very different needs.
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I didn’t know how old Mitt Romney was. But i think the same about him although perhaps 65 is borderline. If its ageist to take someone’s age into account when assessing their ability to do a job effectively then sure. In the same way that I’d say 35 is too young.
Is that ageist too?
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Yes, it is.
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Mia, I think the relationship between age and health is similar to weight and health. Only the individual (and their doctor) can really know how healthy they are or will be, so for you to doubt Hillary’s ability to be POTUS purely because of her age is very similar to everyone who justifies fat-shaming under the guise that they’re just concerned about someone’s health.
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Agree with you Mia.
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Chillax Mia. There’s a party behind every president. It’s the 21st C. The Democrats won’t be putting up or supporting someone they think may compromise their standing. And clearly, Hillary’s no ordinary woman or person – for obvious reasons I would think. She may well rock as a 69 year old president. ’69′. Woo hoo!! Go Hillary…
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My dad is 71, works four 12-hr days a week as a taxi driver. He is sharp as a tack and by all counts is a ‘young’ 71 year old – mum always jokes he probably has ADD because he is just one of those people who always has to be doing something.
Looking at him, knowing this, I agree with Mia. This isn’t a normal job we’re talkng about here. No one is suggesting 69 year-olds shouldn’t contribute to society. But hello! This is the EPITOME of a Demanding (with a capital D) job! You need a certain degree of physical fitness and endurance that you just don’t have when you’re in you’re 70′s. I don’t think that’s ageist, I think that’s fact.
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My father-in-law is 72 and there’s no way he could meet the demands of that kind of role. My mum’s partner though is also 72 and I definitely think he could. Like in most things, I think it will always come down to the individual and what they’re capable of.
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Firstly, I don’t know another person in the world who assumes Obama will get another term.
Secondly, I just can’t understand people’s fascination with twitter. Why would you want your conversation and inane utterances broadcast to the public? Don’t get it. It seems like such a pose to me.
Thirdly, I very much doubt that I’d have the stamina and sharpness to lead the most important country in the world when I’m 69. Having said that, the wisdom and knowledge of a woman of that age is priceless. I doubt it will be an option for her.
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I think this article is a perfect example of why Twitter is great. All kinds of opinions are brought up – sometimes framed negatively, like Anne Summer’s, but often they are thoughtful and considered. The people I follow rarely put their “inane utterances” on Twitter. Twitter gives the unique ability to discuss, digest and ponder events and issues, and you can achieve a genuine sense of community – it’s especially great for freelancers, journos, comedians, commentators to gauge public sentiment and make connections. Don’t knock it till you’ve tried it! There are plenty of idiots on Twitter too, but just don’t follow them and you can ignore them!
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Sorry, we’ll have to agree to disagree. To me twitter screams ego and w*nker.
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But if you follow egomaniacs and wankers, you’ll get egomaniacal and wanky tweets. I love Twitter, it’s great for getting news and info. It depends how you use it as to the wank quotient. If you don’t like what someone has to say, you just don’t follow them.
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Agree.
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AMAZING post Mia!! So smart and logical. And about politics, but in an insightful and palatable way. I did American studies at uni and you are spot on!
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Why did you need American studies to come to the conclusion that Mia is Spot On. I think we all know a president can do 2 x 5 year terms, at the end of which Hillary will be 79. Other than that, this is about age, not America.
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It’s 2 terms, 4 years each.
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She probably had to say this because of the huge number of Australians that don’t understand the difference between Australian politics and American politics (it must be too much American TV).
Such as: unless you were in Rudd’s Queensland electorate you did not vote for Rudd. (No, really, truly. You didn’t. No matter how much you shout at me, it doesn’t make this one true.)
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