Nellie Bishop
Here’s a short story that some people really need to hear. In the 1920s there was a woman called Nellie Bishop who was distraught after a messy, broken romance. So she went to a notorious suicide spot and jumped off a cliff in an attempt to end her life.
But her life had other plans. Just as she jumped, a freak wave swept in and broke her fall before she was plucked – gratefully – from the ocean by passing fishermen. You see, halfway down in mid-air, Nellie changed her mind. Suddenly, she wanted to live.
Author and journalist, Peter FitzSimons, unearthed Nellie’s story recently and wrote about it, noting that “despite the blackness that propelled her to jump, despite being firmly convinced that there was no way out for her, that life was not worth living, that death was better than life. . . she was totally, comprehensively and stunningly wrong.
For Nellie Bishop really did live happily ever after. She fell in love again with a good man, had eight wonderful children, of whom five joined the police force and one, Bob Bradbury, became NSW’s highest ranking detective. One of her dozens of grandchildren and great grandchildren, Bill Bradbury, became a police negotiator and ended up spending a proportion of his professional life successfully talking people out of suicide. He had a story to tell them . . .”
Talking with Pete about Nellie over a cup of tea a few weeks ago, Pete and I agreed there should be a large plaque erected at that cliff top spot which told Nellie’s story so those contemplating suicide could think about her sliding door moment and perhaps consider how their own life might turn out – if they let it.
If you work in the media, you learn early to tread very cautiously around suicide stories. There are strict media guidelines around the way they’re reported and for good reason*. As adolescent psychologist Dr Michael Carr Gregg explained to me, ‘Suicide contagion’ is a phenomenon first recognised in 1774 after the publication of Goethe’s novel The Sorrows of Young Werther, which featured a young man who killed himself over unrequited love. A spate of copycat suicides across Europe led to the book being banned in Germany, Italy and Denmark.
The often-repeated phenomenon was also seen in Japan in 1986 with the suicide of the pop star Yukiko Okada. There’s now also the Yukiko syndrome where the more a suicide is reported the greater the likelihood of copycat cases.
That’s why you’ll sometimes read or hear about a death reported in vague terms. Why the method of a suicide is never disclosed. And why there are so many, many suicides you’ll never know about because they’re not reported at all.
The reasons for these media guidelines are sound but overall, is it a good thing, this silence?
Tragically, I have two friends whose loved ones have taken their own lives in recent years and they have very different views about media coverage of suicide. One believes that the widespread and quite detailed reporting of a high profile suicide was instrumental in the similar suicide of her loved one just a few weeks later. She’s vehemently opposed to any increased coverage. “No more, no way.”
My other friend believes the opposite. She thinks more public discussion about suicide (and especially the mental illnesses that cause it such as depression) is crucial.
Her loved one suffered from undiagnosed depression, something she discovered too late.
Via email, she told me: “I was always one of those people who thought suicide was selfish and the easy way out until it affected me. It needs to be talked about more, not to glorify it but to educate. Kids need to know what help is available and hear stories of how heartbreaking it is for everyone left behind. They need to be shown it’s not ‘cool’ but ruins so many lives; the affects are so far-reaching.
I think if I’d known the signs to look for I could have got him the help he needed, or at least tried. For those who do lose someone to suicide, they need to know they’re not alone, that it’s a tragedy that happens far too often. Talking about it more is key. Every time it’s reported there can be numbers displayed for Beyond blue, Lifeline etc. Even if it reaches one person, it’s helping.”
So where does the Internet come into it? Facebook is the biggest publisher in the world but it’s not governed by media regulations like the ones we have here regarding suicide. That’s how tribute pages for suicide victims spring up within minutes and how thousands of people ‘congregate’ to leave messages and exchange details about the suicide and the person who has passed away.
On the upside though, according to Michael Carr-Gregg, it can be a powerful medium where marginalised, disaffected, disaffiliated young people at risk of suicide are able to come into contact with support at sites such as Beyondblue.org.au. And psychologists are increasingly moving into cyberspace with counselling sessions by kidshelpline and reachout now available online.
Oh, and Nellie Bishop? In 1988, at the age of 89, Nellie passed away from natural causes as the matriarch of a large and loving family.
*NOTE: the guidelines for media reporting of suicide have recently been ammended. You can read them here.
If you or a loved one need help, Dr Michael Carr-Gregg has provided us with the following websites.
There is free online cognitive behaviour therapy at http://moodgym.anu.edu.au/welcomeOr online counseling at: http://www.headspace.org.au/is-it-just-me/getting-help/eheadspaceAnd kidshelpline: http://www.kidshelp.com.au/kids/get-help/web-counselling/Helping young people learn social emotional competencies via a computer game at: www.roc.reach out.com.au
Comments
93 Comments so far
this is particularly prevalent in indigenous communities, called the ‘clustering effect’. its heart breaking.
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There’s been a few suicides in Brisbane lately – absolute tragedies.
How come they have been reported in graphic detail (even to the point to showing in news articles photos/videos).
It’s certainly not the case that the media can’t talk about suicides in detail – as it happens all the time.
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***This goes against the conventional wisdom on suicide, so apologies if it makes you feel bad. This is kind of the reason why suicidal people don’t really talk to non-suicidal people.. because they just don’t get it. They can’t. If they figured out how absurd this all is, they would probably be suicidal too.. ***
Has anyone seen the film Heathers? The Virgin Suicides? Read Sylvia Plath?
Anything can become a ‘trend’. Especially if there is a pay off, in terms of fame or attention. Especially among teenagers.
The unfortunate thing is that when people start with the half-hearted, melodramatic attempts that they rush to tell everybody about for sympathy, it makes things a bit murky for people who really are suicidal. To be blatantly honest, I am dubious of anybody who publicly spreads the idea that they are suicidal. In my personal experience.. anybody who is truly suicidal won’t tell a soul, so that there would be nobody to stop them.
An example, from my experience at high school:
After a particularly spirited speech from the school nurse about how we can come see her if we’re feeling depressed or suicidal, one girl turns up to school with lengths of lace artfully safety pinned around her wrists after scratching herself with the ring-pull from a can of pepsi enough to make her skin pink. She would have all the girls gathering around her, holding her hand and telling her how brave she was, while she cried her crocodile tears and told endless stories about how life just wasn’t worth living because some boy didn’t ask her out or her parents got mad at her about the phone bill. A couple of other girls followed suit and talked about how they almost overdosed on panadol on the weekend because Dawson’s Creek finished. The girl applied for special consideration for her emotional struggles and got patted on the back by teachers for being so strong, while she lapped it all up.
Another girl had been making herself very scarce and nobody could find her at lunchtimes. Whenever they saw her, she’d be smiling and making conversation as best she could. She always wore her school jumper, even on hot days. Occasionally, she wouldn’t come to school for the week because she was ‘sick’. Sometimes in class she would just stare at the wall, motionless, as if she was a statue that would crack if she moved.
The reality of that situation was that she was hiding in the toilets crying, trying to keep up a facade just long enough to last the school day without throwing herself in front of a bus, needed long sleeves to cover the bandages and scars upon scars, and was hospitalized for severe depressive episodes for most of Year 11, while everybody thought she had glandular fever.
Guess which girl was me? I guess that’s why I’m a bit jaded about the whole thing.
For someone who is truly suicidal, you don’t want to be questioned or counseled. You don’t want anybody to know, simply so they can’t interfere. It’s too much hassle to let anybody know – how could they possible comprehend such an unfathomable compulsion? How could they grasp your perfect logic that lets suicide just.. make sense?
Both of my sisters have attempted suicide too.. we have perfect parents, wonderful lives, I guess we must just have some defective gene or something. I’m a smart, attractive girl with many talents, a loving family, a wonderful boyfriend, who is generally regarded to be creative, vivacious and successful. I plant things in the garden, I write Christmas cards, I love my dog, I sing in the shower – I seem pretty normal – I guess I just have this kernel of ‘wrong’ in me that takes over sometimes, and this is something that could *never* be fully understood by anybody who hasn’t experienced it themselves. Even before my life was taken over by psychiatrists, I always had a split view of the future – I would be brilliant, or I would die.
As for my parents, it’s strange that two people who are so well-adjusted could produce three girls with manic depression severe enough to warrant almost two years of hospitalization between us. As for my partner, well.. he has a clue as to what’s going on. All he will say is that he loves me more than anything and he hopes that I don’t kill myself, but he knows that he can’t stop me. Knowing that he loves me definitely figures into my thoughts when I’m at my worst, so I guess if there is anything you can take from this – tell people how much you love them, don’t just assume they already know. I know how much my boyfriend and my family love me, and I hope for their sake that I don’t end up killing myself. But in acknowledging this dark thing inside me… in remembering how I have felt in the past and knowing that it could get worse… I can’t make any promises to anyone. I can take my mood stabilizers and anti-psychotics, eat well, get enough sleep, take all my vitamins, do exercise, set little goals and organize pleasurable distractions – I can try. I try so hard every day, to be okay, for everybody who loves me. It’s hard, because even when things are okay, I still know how utterly intolerable life can be – it *always* makes more sense for me to be dead than living, but I try (even if I think it’s futile) because I love my family and friends, and I know they love me.
When it comes to suicide, I feel a bit sorry for all the psychologists and idealists saying “if we remove the stigma, more people will talk about it”. It’s not stigma, we’re not afraid that someone will laugh at us or tell us we’re stupid – it’s the sheer fact that people who truly want to die don’t want anybody to stand in their way. Suicide is such a private thing, and it’s impossible to articulate the exact logic behind why death seems like the perfectly solution at that particular time. I have been unlucky (or lucky, depending on how you look at it) in that my suicide attempts have been unsuccessful – losing a lot of blood but not dying, ending up in hospital vomiting up charcoal, or having someone cut the rope off my neck. I think it’s probably the fact that girls usually choose less violent suicide methods that are more likely to fail. The cynic in me would laugh and say that at least I’ve got some practice. The fatalist in me wonders why I haven’t succeeded yet. The optimist in me.. hopes that I don’t get to that place again.
It’s almost like… life, split into two modes.
Life when everything is okay – you can talk about suicide because it’s something removed from you, that doesn’t relate to you.
Life when everything is not okay – you can’t say a thing. Killing yourself is such a permanent action, fueled by unimaginable sadness, fury, apathy or hopelessness. How can you put those things into words? You can’t..
In conclusion, whether suicide is talked about in the public sphere or not really isn’t going to make that much difference. People who are truly disillusioned by life will still do it, if they are determined to. But we do need to beware of turning suicide into an almost grotesque measure of popularity with all the news stories and tribute pages and foundations… people who are desperate for attention, acceptance or celebration will sometimes go to extreme lengths for it, without stopping to think about whether they will be around to enjoy it. Tell people you love them NOW – don’t wait, don’t assume they know it. You don’t know if your love is the thing that will keep them hanging on.
So, I’m sorry if this makes you sad, or you think I’m wrong… I’m not ‘wrong’, because this is my experience. And if anybody wants to truly understand suicide, they would actually listen to the person who has been there, rather than dismissing what they have to say as ‘all too depressing’.
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Your story brought tears to my eyes because I too have been to that very dark place. In the end it was the thought that people I cared for would lose me and have no idea why. Ironically, having stepped back from that abyss I then felt even more of a failure because I thought that I didn’t even have the courage to do what I’d planned.
Only now I see it wasn’t courage I lacked, and as I’ve been able to begin addressing the reasons for my suicidal thoughts I can see that what I saw would be a ‘solution’ for my problems, and would remove a ‘sick’ individual from the family, would in fact really have only caused great heartbreak for those I love, and those who love me.
You are not wrong, Anon. Speaking from the heart, with true knowledge and experience, can never be wrong.
May you continue to see each day through.
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I disagree, whilst in some cases what your saying may be accurate. But in mine it was not.
My brother in law threatened to commit suicide countless times to an array of different loved ones. The one time at 3am he couldnt get hold of anyone to hear him out – he gased himself in the car. If someone is threatening to kill themselves – please listen, as this might be the time they do it and you are left with the pain.
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I’m sorry about your brother in law.
My uncle showed his mate his noose two days before he used it himself. Everyone thought he was joking when he brought it out and did nothing about it. I do not blame them at all, but if someone indicates at all that they want help you shouldn’t pass them off as trying to seek attention.
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I only just read this article today and it really struck a cord. My mother committed suicide when I was 16 – 24 years ago, and I was the one who found her. I carry that image around with me for the rest of my life. She was mentally ill for several years, but for me being so young I never really understood what was going on. Not to mention that my Father tried to hide most of it from me. I do remember our GP at the time saying that most people who talk about suicide are just seeking attention and don’t actually do it. What stupid advice that was. I’m glad things have changed now.
Unless you have been through it, it is so hard to describe the shock you go into. I lived in a self protective shell for years. I truly feel for anyone that has had to go through it. I believe you never get over it.
As for reporting – I don’t know the answer. It’s such a sensitive area. I still have trouble talking about it with people because the emotions are so raw. I can’t imagine that there will ever be a right way of reporting it. We do need to be more supportive about it and do the best we can to convince people with troubled souls that there is more to life – there is plenty to live for.
I now have a young daughter and when she is old enough I hope to tell her the story of her Oma. I hope when the time comes I’ll find the right words.
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I consider myself a survivor of suicide – my sister ( 31 ) and my brother ( 30 ) committed suicide together, 16/12/02.
It was more gruesome than I suspect they thought it would be – I believe they thought they’d be found days earlier than they were.
All these years later, it stills tears my heart apart and the damage is irreversible. My father has since passed on, as has the family name as my brother was his only son.
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Thanks Mia for writing about suicide and referencing a great survivor of depression.
I’d like to point readers like yourself and Susan to an association that was founded and is run by suicide bereaved people for the bereaved by suicide community | http://www.wingsofhope.org.au.
We have ongoing fundraising events and recently supported the development of Dr Diana Sands’ book and DVD “Red Chocolate Elephants” for children and families bereaved by suicide | http://bereavedbysuicide.com.au/red-chocolate-elephants.html.
If you would like to get in touch with this great community service please email: contact@wingsofhope.org.au.
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Mia, after I read this story on Sunday morning I handed it to my 16 year old son to read…why? because the next day we were both attending the funeral of his mate who took his life 13 days ago at the ripe old age of 16.
The last 2 weeks have been a huge wake up call to me as a parent and to my son on just how fragile life can be.
Nothing can prepare you as a parent on how to deal with this and I watched my son change in the space of a day.
I watched at the funeral the carnage left behind, a grieving mother, 2 confused little brothers and a sea of kids who now know that life can be gone in an instant.
RIP Henry, if only you knew how much you were loved…
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oh I forget to add that it was widely reported in our local newspapers. Interviews with the local kids, photos etc. I have never seen suicide reported in the local newspaper before. The kids in our community have been talking and supporting each other and it has brought alot of people together.It needs to be talked about and reported in a respectful way.
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RIP Henry. The reaction I have seen on Facebook to this makes me believe that so many local kids have seen the effect of suicide, and the outpouring of both grief and love, and I just hope that they realise how special they are too.
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I dont know if anyone else has mentioned this, and I hope it is ok to do this (mamamia team???) but September 15th is “R U OK” day.
http://www.ruokday.com.au/content/home.aspx
Its really important we all learn to be open and ask each other how we are going.
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We’ve got a post planned closer to the day
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In one of the spiritual books I’ve read it claims that if you take your own life you get sent back again straight away (in another body) to experience the same sort of difficulties and learn the lessons you are supposed to learn. So suicide, according to this theory, doesn’t end the pain. It just sets you back on your journey. You can’t skip the lessons you are supposed to learn in this life.
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There’s learning lessons, then there is *Pain*.
Who or what would ever want an animal to live with that much agony. No lessons there.
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Not quite, Simone. It is always the Souls decision and choice if it wants to come back to earth. Remember that the same lesson can be learnt in different ways. The Soul will be surrounded with love once it’s back with Source, it will receive healing with no judgement. If and when it’s ready to come back, it will. Hope this help. With blessings and love
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For people with post natal depression, in my case and the case of women in my support group, the advertising of suicide on tv all hours of the day and late at night, in the campaign to educate people last year about suicide being the number 1 killer in my age group, was the most ill thought campaign ever. It cost many lives. The add screamed to all the women in my support group when they were at their lowest that suicide was what other people were doing and was interpreted in the post natal mindset as the best option. Everytime the add came on it was like a reminder to hurry up and just do it.
Talking about it in educational advertisements needs to be done very carefully and nothing like the devastating campaign the government ran last year. I
attempted to take my life after that add hammered itself into my head repeatedly over 6 weeks after my babies traumatic birth and pregnancy. I called PANDA, my health nurse, my gp, i told my gp’s nurse how i was feeling and what i was feeling compelled to do but not one single person called me back that day. I felt lower than low and worthless as a result. It was remarkable I survived all the pills I took, it was a sure fire cocktail of prescription painkillers and relaxants.
When I found out how many women it affected the same way I was disgusted that it ever made it to air or that they continued to run it.
The worst part was the government ran all these adds with no extra support group funding to handle the consequences. My baby was 7 months old before I could get a place in a support group within 45mins of home as there was just no funding or groups running although so many women were in need. Our government felt it better to spend money creating awareness of the problem of suicide and post natal depression rather than help people suffering.
I commend people for wanting to speak out like Miranda this week but they need to realise the issues they will be raising for so many, they don’t realise they may well be doing more harm than good. It’s niaeve to think any child has gone through school in Australia and doesn’t know about kids help line, it is mentioned repeatedly year in year out. These services are not all they are cracked up to be for every age group, and when celebs say they are it only makes people who do call and don’t find solace in the call feel even more worthless.
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This highlights what’s always been a key problem for me in explaining depression and mental illness to those who do not suffer from it.
They have the best intentions in the world but try as they might they just CAN NOT understand the way it warps and skews your world view. That everything you see and hear is filtered through it.
THAT’S why there are such strict rules (or supposed to be) surrounding the portrayal of suicide in media. It’s to try and protect those who are most fragile, who are already on the edge.
As a media professional and someone who suffers with severe depression, the rules and guidelines supplied by organisations like MIndframe make perfect sense.
And Cammy, it’s terrible that concerns about that ad were ignored – and that help was so difficult for you to access.
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2 years ago my dad killed himself. It was, and forever will be the worst day of my life. I was the one who found him in the car, I was 26. It’s with me every single day playing over and over in my mind. I can still see the car filled with the fumes, hear my own screams, and feel my world stopping and heart breaking beyond repair. Every day is now a constant struggle and battle.
He left letters to say he was sorry, and that I was his world but there was too much pain inside him, and didn’t know how to make it stop. He also left a lifetime of questions I will never have the answers to.
2 years ago I didn’t believe in depression, but now I know that ‘believe’ wasn’t correct, I just didn’t ‘understand it.’
Fast forward to now, and I believe in depression like I believe that tomorrow the sun will rise. I also believe that the more we talk about this illness, the more chance we have to save lives, and the lives of their loved ones.
6 months after dad opted out of life, I had very serious intentions of doing the same just so I could see him again. But I stopped, and what stopped me was knowing what he had put our family and friends through, and what I would then put those very same people through if I did the same.
If someone really wants to take their life, they will. Not to copy someone, but because they think it’s their only way out. By not reporting on these tragic events, out of fear of potentially encouraging more people to take their lives, all we are in fact doing is sweeping the very real and the very serious illness that depression is, under the carpet yet again. I truly believe that if more people were exposed to what is really going on out there, that perhaps we may be able to save lives that should never have been lost in the first place.
Depression is real. Suicide is real. I know this now, and wish every day I didn’t. But what I wish for more, is that no one I care about, or even complete strangers for that matter ever have to go through a hell that words cannot explain.
Sugar coating the truth doesn’t help anyone.
Life is a b*tch. But life is also a precious gift.
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I am so very sorry for your loss. My Dad is severly depressed at the moment and I recently had him hospitalized because he was suicidal. Sadly he has spiraled down again and I believe he is severe enough to take his own life. Thank you for sharing your story. Hugs and love.
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Hi, I so very hope that your dad finds the help he needs, and that your strength no matter how tested it is at the moment, helps him through this. Wishing you and your family nothing but love. You are not alone, no matter how much you may feel it sometimes. In my thoughts. x
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I am so sorry. My heart rips reading your story. So much love to you.
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thanks for sharing your story. i am so sorry that you have suffered so much sadness. it is so brave of you to share and help others understand.
i wish you the best
xx
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As a sufferer of post natal depression and part of an online support group for PND I was chuffed to read Mia’s column in The Sunday Life today.
Luckily I am not in the self harm category but I know many that are and that struggle daily to keep going and stay alive.
Suicide due to mental illness needs to be discussed in the media to reduce the stigma associated with it. We don’t need to be informed of the details of the mechanism of “injury” but an acknowledge of the reality of the illness needs to demonstrated.
How many mothers die every year from suicide due to PND? I think it would be a shock to all of us how common self harm & suicide is amongst this group.
We need open discussion about this topic to reduce the stigma and encourage sufferers to seek the help they need before it is too late.
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I have bipolar and have been depressed to the point where I tried to commit suicide. I have never spoken to my housemates about what happened when I was found overdosed. I still feel such shame about what I must have put them through.
I see both sides of the reporting issue. On the one hand it can be triggering for me to read about it. I learnt about the train method through the media. I catch the train every day and some days I think about it. But again, when there was more open reporting on the issue I read an interview with train drivers who spoke about how awful it was for them. That’s one thing that holds me back.
Another report that had a positive impact on me was a documentary about the Golden Gate Bridge in San Francisco, one of America’s top suicide destinations. The film maker set up a camera and recorded the jumps, tracking down those who survived (apparently it is rare but possible). The survivors spoke of those conscious seconds as they fell and how they realised what a horrible mistake it was. That resonated with me.
But for me what it really comes down to it I couldn’t do it to my family. I wonder what happens to those people who don’t have loved ones, or think they don’t?
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As someone who has tried to commit suicide, I know that it is whilst I have the awareness and capability to think through the consequences of my suicide that I am not in the ‘space’ where I would actually do it – in therapist speak ‘suicide ideation’.
When made my attempts it was because of the pain I was in and because I also thought I was such a burden on my family that they were better off without me.
Therefore I am convinced that not having loved ones would change a decision*.
Having a strong social network and the support of loved ones does help people.
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I do think there is evidence to suggest contagion exists, but I’m not sure the best solution with regards to media reporting. I experienced this contagion in a very personal and powerful way recently, after a close friend made a serious suicide attempt. I found myself feeling sucked into a dark place of contemplation regarding life and death – I wondered what the point was, beginning to have thoughts of suicide myself and feeling quite hopeless. I began to experience the strong sense that there was no one who could assist me, or help with how I was feeling – and therefore didn’t feel motivated to disclose my distress to anyone. It was quite scary – that the situation had such a strong impact on me. In a way, I would have expected it to be the opposite (that seeing such a thing would increase my desire to live). It gave me a greater awareness of how this can occur.
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My ex husband attempted suicide during our breakup. I thank god every single day he was unsuccessful and so does he. He has had extensive counseling and realizes his act was spontaneous & brought on by depression. If you asked any one of our family or friends, he would be the one most unlikely. 3 years later and I still have some very dark and sad moments, flashbacks of that terrible day and it has absolutely changed the way I think and act. Life can change in a split second.
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I read the suicide article with great interest to see if there was any mention of a particular group who have ideation of suicide or actually commit suicide, and as there was no mention of them I thought I would bring it up as a discussion point.
Many young gay males – more than females – but both are in the statistics – who live in rural or regional areas tend to commit suicide because they are gay (or lesbian) and they have no resources and no one to talk to or to help them. Somehow these statistics don’t get into the public arena because often they are not recorded as suicides because of abuse – verbal and physical, homophobia, and related bullying activities which for young adolescents with sexuality issues become mountainous issues with only one solution.
Another part of the equation is that organisations such as beyondblue are homophobic and have not been known to support gay, lesbian, transgender, hiv members of our communities who suffer from depression or have suicidal tendencies.
Fortunately there are organisations such as Suicide Prevention Australia who are able to offer assistance, but if you are isolated and live in the country, how do you find out and to whom do you turn?
Such issues ought to be in the public arena so that they can be discussed and addressed, but in the homophobic society in which we live, that is an idle hope!
Mannie De Saxe, Lesbian and Gay Soldiarity, Sydney.
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very relevant and interesting point, especially given recent remarks from bob katter et al. that must be so frustrating when you are fighting for the cause when he makes such dangerous comments.
i didn’t realise that beyondblue was considered homophobic? that is shocking and i am sure, not something they would be proud of..
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I find it really interesting that you say that about BB.
They are involved with many GLBTI events in Australia and have information for this demographic on their websites.
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I find it interesting too about BB… I used to liaise with them several years ago with sponsorship deals and one of the guys (from BB) that I used to meet with was gay. He loved the organisation.
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After a long marriage breakup I went to Echo Point in the Blue Mts to end it all. I looked into the valley and then remembered the few extremely mind blowing psychic experiences I have had involving dead people and realised that, as it had been proven to me, there is life after death, this was not the solution. I went to counselling with Lifeline and was talked into doing a mature age degree. I also enrolled in a course at the Conservatorium of Music and this was far better than being custard on the Federal Pass!
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I think the second half of your last sentence is thoughtless haz1902. There are too many people reading and commenting here who have experienced plenty of pain surrounding this topic to read such a careless remark. If you come back haz1902, do you think you could edit it please?
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It’s too late as far as I can see to edit this post, and I’m sorry if anyone was offended. You see, i have been to that place around four or five times and even one of my sons has attempted suicicide. But i think it’s our nutty sense of humour that always stood by us and got us through. Sorry if it got out of hand!
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Thanks for coming back to me and taking my comment as it was intended. No-one else has commented so perhaps i was being overly sensitive. I understand that humour can get you through, just didn’t get it in this instance myself. Goo Luck to you and your son.
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I know someone whose ex attempted suicide over their break up. She was not successful in her attempt, and as far as I know she is living a fairly happy and balanced life to this day, but I see the repercussions in her ex – the other side of the story.
He suffered from depression when he found out about her attempted suicide, and continued to have nightmares about her trying to kill herself for a long time after.
It has become difficult for him to allow himself to feel anything for another person in the same way, frightened that if things don’t work out he could be responsible for another person attempting to take their life (not that he is responsible for the first girl, but that is how he sees it).
The repercussions can be so harmful, and the loss of that potential life is dreadful. I know I personally would not be here if my mother’s suicide attempts had been successful when she was younger, and I would not be there to comfort my friend through the hard times.
I hope I am never in a situation so dark that suicide seems to be the only way out, but if I am I hope that I am strong enough to wait and stick it out. Both for myself, and for everyone I know.
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As the mother of 7, quite a few decades ago, my grandmother was depressed and committed suicide. Of those 7 children who are now adults, most have some level of mental illness, and one even committed suicide herself in the same way. The effects of this suicide can even be felt now in the 3rd generation on, having grown up with a depressed parent who can’t get over the death of their mum when they were so young. I occasionally think of suicide when things get really bad (think only, never act, I want to emphasise), but it is knowing of people who have attempted and failed, ending up permanently brain damaged and disabled that stops me.
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I read this in Sunday Life this morning and really loved it. Great message and I agree xx
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The evidence is pretty clear that copycat suicide is a real phenomenon, but more importantly, there are clear guidelines about reporting of suicide in the media that can still allow the public debate about the benefits of getting help, while not providing information which may stimulate further suicides.
What is clear is that this is one situation where the media actually tries to do the right thing in relation to minimising risk, which is good to see.
Using media to debate and educate about the importance of identifying depression and suicide risk early and intervening is not the same as reporting the gruesome details of some suicides, which is of no value to anybody outside of the immediate family and friends.
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Perhaps we need to broaden the discussion to hear more stories from family, friends and others directly or indirectly ‘involved’ in suicides. So not only increasing the reporting on the suicide itself, but also creating a voice for the stories of those left behind…and those that may have attempted without success and have gone on to change the path of their lives.
My husband is a paramedic and he often tells me of the horrific scenes he attends when a family has lost a loved one to suicide. He has said to me on occassion, that he wonders if the victim could see what he sees, when he walks into the home of a family who have discovered a suicide, if they would still go through with it. To see the utter devastation of a family whose lives are shattered in a way that they will never be truly repaired.My guess is it may make some think twice.
I often winder how may people, like Nellie Bishop, change their minds half way down. I suspect that the tragic truth would be quite a few.
I think we obviously have to be so very careful of increased discussion leading to ‘contagion’ or ‘copycat’ deaths. But I also feel that by increasing the dialogue and increasing the discussion so it isn’t so ‘taboo’ and closeted, maybe we can help those that really need to talk about what they are going through.
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I am so thankful for people like your husband who do the work they do. I was resuscitated after having a respiratory arrest by a paramedic who bagged me (ie. artificially breathed for me) the whole way to hospital after my attempt. She visited me in ICU when I woke up. She told me she didn’t think I’d make it and was so thankful that I did because; as a colleague (I’m a nurse) it’s hard seeing someone go through something like that and know that even though we’re trained, we missed it and for her it was a terse reminder that it can happen to any of us. She said she’d been really haunted by my case because I was “so young” (I’m really not that young, but I look about 16, although I’m 22). She also said I just seemed like a nice girl who’d gone through some tough stuff and that she’d just hoped I’d been ok. In retrospect it helped to hear that. At the time I didn’t give a rat’s.
Please give you husband a hug from me. We need a National Hug A Paramedic Day. These guys do SUCH GREAT WORK. I am so lucky that our emergency services were available to me the day I needed them and owe my life to a pretty awesome duo.
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Rayn,
I can sympathise with your husband – if he’d been the one who attended the scene of my sister’s and brother’s suicides and had then had to tell my parents!!!!
If only they’d known that their desperate actions would have irreversible and ongoing consequences.
RIP Linda ( 1970 – 2002 ) and Jason ( 1971 – 2002 ) and Dadda (2007)
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I’m currently doing some post-grad work in chronic diseases. Some researchers are predicting that depression will rival or overtake cardiovascular disease as the number one chronic disease worldwide in the not too distant future. It may not be possible to avoid talking about depression then.
My two sons have both lost close friends to suicide, the victims both were 17 at the time they died. So very sad.
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Totally agree that chronic depression is going to take over as #1, I have been fighting depression/anxiety for the past seven years and it can be so dibilitating. I want to get better so desperately, thats why I wake up ready to fight for happiness each day. Suicide is not the answer, but sometimes people get tired of fighting for so long. It is exhausting, especially when you’re talking about depression as a chronic illness.
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I’m curious – what does the research that you have read say is the reason for the increase in rates of depression? For a very tiny proportion of people, there may be genetic issues with neurological biochemistry – but what about for the rest (which must be the majority.) I’m guessing there must be a complex mix of social, psychological and environmental reasons (with some people possessing more of a predisposition towards sensitivity than others)?
As I understand it, many people who take their life are not ‘mentally ill’ nor depressed? (though obviously a fair proportion are). Perhaps sometimes people can just fail to connect with a sense of worth and value in a what can be a very confusing and difficult existence? – obviously that is still just as tragic for people that are affected, I just worry that the discussion is sometimes dominated by biological/medical models of pathology which are limiting the scope of how we think about these issues.
I’ve read quite a bit of philosophy and literature and the concept of coming to terms with consciousness of our own existence and the struggle for a sense of worth in a world with so much tragedy and suffering – has been deeply reflected in all of the arts from poetry to theatre – and has also been wrapped up in very complex ways in the spiritual/religious narratives that have defined cultures. It seems to be traditionally taken as pretty fundamental and universal part of the human condition and experience.
At the same time that many of us have rejected the metaphysics of spiritual/religious explanations of phenomena in the universe and simultaneously thrown out a lot of the social wisdom and support systems that have been wrapped up with it, we have also seen much of the arts turned into a commodity which seems to lack a lot of the deep substance and function that it traditionally had in helping us orient ourselves in the complex questions of existence. For most of human history asking ‘is life worthwhile?’ seemed like a natural, healthy and fundamental question to ask – now it seems that a struggle with worth is always taken as a pathology and unhealthy thing rather than (perhaps) the defining part of someone’s life.
I’m not at all suggesting that lifestyle/environmental toxicity/diet/sociology ect don’t all have really important contributions to mental health – I just wonder sometimes if we as a society may continually fail to help many people in their struggles if we pitch these issues simply all as chronic disease? And also in a world with the scope of suffering that exists why happiness or at least ‘not struggling with depression’ – is taken as a default position of ‘health’?
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You raise a relevant point about depression being viewed simplistically through a medical model of health.
My work in chronic diseases for the last two years has been from the perspective of healthcare provision so what I have been studying is about incidence, the economic cost to society and individuals and personal cost to sufferers balanced against the cost of prevention and which preventative measures are most effective per dollar of the health budget.
Having said that, depression cannot be viewed in isolation from “human” elements such as spirituality, social connectedness, ethics and philosophy and some of the research I have viewed in these areas provides valuable insights into the causes of depression although much of what I have read is academic discussion rather than providing proposals for management of depression on a large scale. The causes of depression are complex and yet to be fully defined as are the reasons for its increasing incidence.
Investigation into managing depression has become a health imperative as incidence increases and this type of investigation requires big dollars which come mostly from the health budgets of government.
Therein lies the reason for the medicalisation of depression. Whether the policymakers decide to broaden their position on managing depression to a more holistic perspective which includes aspects of spirituality/ethics/philosophy is anyone’s guess.
Some studies show that major depression is implicated in over 60% of suicides (American Foundation for Suicide Prevention). I have also read other studies that provide valid support for depression as a fundamental human experience much like the “dark night of the soul” or a “creative depression” that leads to personal growth and change. It is a powerful and deeply painful experience and does carry a significant risk of suicide.
My own professional interest in depression is related to supporting patients during their suffering, prevention of suicide and, ultimately, return to a healthy life in which mental/emotional/spiritual wellbeing is necessary as well as physical health.
It also has to be remembered that depression and suicide can be discussed but then ignored by most of the academic philosophers, theologists and ethicists but not the medical profession when it becomes a matter of treatment and saving lives which are about to expire. This is where the friction of value per health dollar arises. To spend it on acute emergency care for full-blown depression and suicide or invest in prevention from the early stages of life? It is ultimately government that makes these decisions and hopefully they will look to the bigger picture. Preventative measures for many chronic diseases can be surprisingly cheap and this is where much research is being concentrated but these measures require long-term commitment by government. There is also much movement in the medical profession towards a holistic view of health so it will be interesting and critical to public health to observe how it all pans out. However, the same principles which apply to management of a chronic disease like cardiovascular disease can be also be applied to depression i.e. promotion of self-management, medication, knowledge and awareness and public health education programs. Ethicists, philosophers, etc do not generally agitate for their causes as much as ground-level healthcare professionals.
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Thankyou Susan as Well, for your thoughtful response.
It had occurred to me that the medicalisation of all mental health issues was connected to government funding and support structures.
I agree that the health workers who are directly working with people face complexities and responsibilities that those in the more abstract disciplines do not encounter – though I probably wouldn’t assume that a philosopher has necessarily always confined themselves to an academic understanding of the human condition- rather than one that has been also tempered through deep experience in the world.
Obviously the wisdom and expertise that many mental health workers derive from their direct and extensive experience of working with these issues with people is invaluable and not able to be emulated by theoretical models.
I’m not sure either in what way philosophy ect could be used directly in public health management – perhaps that is up to individual mental health professionals. I feel that some of the issues that I am pointing out are more deeper issues about how we organise ourselves as societies.
Perhaps you are right that philosophers do not agitate enough for their causes – but there isn’t many of them! And in the critical philosophies there is an outright struggle from falling into extinction.I’m at least agitating for a broader discussion…
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Agree Mabool. The two things I see happening with philosophy currently are that science, including medical science, is finding the answers to many philosophical questions which has the effect of overshadowing the essential philosophical question – what is life about? I see similar things happening with theology. The second thing is a watering down of philosophy due to the conflict created in local beliefs and attitudes by a more global discussion and that philosophers/theologists are in the process of finding a new way to discuss old questions. I think they ultimately will, human nature being what it is. At least, I hope they do.
I personally am always a bit disappointed when the scientific, rational answers, even though extremely useful in designing public health programs, tend to kill off the philosophical or humanist discussion which society needs to engage in to develop a broad, holistic, all-encompassing worldview. I have read some very lively and relevant discourses by philosophers so, fortunately, I don’t think the breed has yet died out
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My attitude to reporting on suicides was profoundly changed after I attended the aftermath of a man who stepped in front of a train. I could see the visceral details for myself, but obviously there was no way those details would make it into the paper. The witnesses (removed from the train and waiting on a footpath) were mostly just annoyed their train travel had been disrupted. The police media would not give me the details of the man.
As I was not allowed a) to report on that it was a suicide b) find out anything about the man, his situation, his family, his reasons, or who was left to grieve c) write the actual gory details, I was basically left with a traffic report. “Due to an incident, the northern line was disrupted for one hour on Wednesday evening. Passengers were ferried by bus to Subiaco station.”
This appalled me.
I still think about how the story should have been written.
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When I first moved to London I was shocked “The Central line is experiencing major delays due to a person under the train”… I was horrified. Noone else blinked an eye. But after a few months, trying to get to or from work, I was frustrated and annoyed too.
I never stopped feeling sad for the poor drivers who hit those people, and always wondered how they coped.
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The husband of a friend of mine is a train driver, and apparently they are trained to jam the brake on, pull the shutter over the window and hope for the best. they are then required to get out and positivly identify someone has been hit. I cannot imagine a more horrible experiance, it would be so heartbreaking every time.
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Oh wow, those poor drivers. What a horrific experience.
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I remember in highschool someone from QLD rail giving a talk about rail safety.
He said lot of train drivers suffer from severe trauma, grief and depression after an incident and have to leave the job
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This also applies to truck drivers, for the same reason. There’s an amazing interview with three truckies on Enough Rope that talks about it.
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On my way to work about 6 months ago I was on a train that hit someone. Never made it to the papers, was reported on the transit facebook page as “technical difficulties at North Sydney Station”. I’ve also seen someone hit on New Years Eve a few years back at Wynyard.
It was horrific. I still sometimes have visions of it. What broke my heart even more was that people were more frustrated than anything that they were now going to be late. It’s quite a surreal experience to see something like that.
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I too have witnessed this – passengers being annoyed at their trip being delayed (especially while living in London)… but after a while I did wonder if those people who showed annoyance were doing that as a bit of a coping mechanisim, rather than actually think about the horrific event that had just happened.
I certainly know that I eventually felt myself ‘switching off’ when announcements like this would echo through the Tube stations. I become so emotionally involved when I hear tragic stories that I barely cope myself. And there were times that I couldn’t let myself think about it too much or I would fall in a heap.
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People can have different views, but I think this is one issue where it is absolutely vital to go on evidence. And evidence says that public discussion of suicide and details of particular suicides does produce more suicides. Particularly when the suicide is of a teenager. At a suburban high school in Adelaide a few years back, one suicide started a wave of tragic suicides. I know an ambo who got called to almost all of them, and there is no doubt that talk about the first suicide influenced the nature of the subsequent ones.
There are lots of ways to raise awareness of depression and mental illness, and particularly to highlight men’s susceptibility to not seeking help, without explicitly focusing on suicide or the risks of suicide. That is the way to go. People who have lost someone close and feel impelled to take action might feel that they need to talk loud and long about it to try and stop this happening to others, but it’s a misplaced urge. Many well-meaning actions create unwanted effects. For example, a wonderful program designed to prevent eating disorders in teenage girls told them explicitly about what girls do and why they shouldn’t do it. The results? Rates of eating disorders in girls who had taken the program actually significantly increased – the program had provided them with a how-to and a ready response to feelings and experiences they were having. Counselling immediately after a trauma has now been shown to be likely to actually increase long-term adverse effects, compared with waiting for a while and just treating people who are showing initial signs of trauma, rather than getting everyone to go through counselling.
We need to be hard-headed about evidence about what works to best serve people who are vulnerable to these kinds of risks – not just go from what seems like “commonsense”. Like, the plaque at the top of the suicide spot might well work in the opposite way as was intended. Nice ideas don’t always translate into desired outcomes.
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This is such an important point. What I have seen of depression showed me just how much is messes with a person’s head. It can make the sufferer interpret things in a way that would never occur to them when they are well. Its not really surprising that something that seems logical or sensible to people not suffering a mental illness would have a completely different effect in reality.
And surely it is possible to discuss depression and its consequences in general terms without referring to the specifics of individual cases?
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I think we as a society need to ask why so many of us are suffering from depression? I think it has a lot to do with people being so disconnected from each other. Human are social beings – we have always hung out in packs since hunter gatherer times. Yet these days we often live far away from other relatives or are too busy to see them often enough to be a real and meaningful part of each others’ lives. I think it is quite sad and I think we should all make more of an effort to connect meaningfully with the people we care about. Earlier this year my cousin committed suicide and it has been so awful. All of my family have been trying to stay in contact with each other much more than we ever did before.
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I totally agree with you & think u nailed it.
I had a good friend commit suicide almost two months ago & am struggling to accept it. She was diagnosed with bi polar but she only shared this with her husband. All her friends are heartbroken …and she helped a lot of people deal w their ) demons without ever revealing her own. We are all devastated!!
Am not sure about suicide being a contagion but I wish I had known how much pain my friend was in. Govt needs to start putting a lot more money into mental illness based on current statistics & it’s forecast to get worse.
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I couldn’t agree more. From my own personal experience with loved ones dealing with depression, the biggest causes are stress and social disconnection.
I think technology is wonderful and I can’t imagine not having the internet these days, but I think that between stress people are under (work, financial as examples) and then being able to ‘connect’ to people without actually physcially seeing or speaking to them these days is a real worry.
Like everything in life, we need to find a healthy balance. Already today I have received and sent text messages and emails and here I am on the internet. But I have also spoken to people on the phone, had a nice long chat with a shop assistant and am seeing some friends this afternoon for a play date with the kids.
Everyone is always saying how busy they are these days… they are losing touch with friends and family and it’s really sad.
I watched my sister return to Australia from being overseas for a long time and sit at home with her new baby, constantly on Facebook. She kept telling me how she ‘caught up’ with so and so on Facebook and she became addicted to it. But she never actually went out and met up with any of these people in person. And the time she spent holed up at home on the computer, stopped her from going out and exploring her new surroundings and meeting new people. It was very difficult to watch.
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And suicide rates are apparently much higher in developed, peaceful countries. I guess if you’re constantly having to fight for your survival (limited access to food and water, or living in a war zone) makes you value your life more?
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Right.
Actually, *my* depression is a physiological disorder in my brain.
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What I found amazing about my own depression – not sure if everyone experiences this – is that I had like two parallel forms of thinking. I felt so useless and hopeless and had this internal monologue that was so harsh on myself on one level, on the other level I knew that what I was internally saying to myself and admonishing myself for was not true and yet I felt all the self-criticism just as deeply and couldn’t shake it. Weird.
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I feel like I’m always writing this on here. I attempted 3.5 months ago. I woke up in ICU. At first I was not glad I’d survived. I was absolutely furious. It’s only been in the last 6 weeks or so that I’m glad I came out alive. The impact that a suicide attempt has on the person & their community is profound. My parents were shocked and then devastated – which doesn’t even come close to describing it. My friends were amazing, but the impact it’s had on them has been enormous. The friend who found me has nightmares that she was too late & sometimes just calls me so she knows I’m alive when I pick up the phone. If an ambulance goes past at a high speed, my friends flinch & they say “sorry, just seeing you in the back of the ambulance in my head”, etc. But it’s because of that community that I’m trying to get well. I’ve been very lucky; I got away with very little damage. My asthma is worse because I was ventilated, my eyesight has deteriorated rapidly (double strength 4 weeks after I woke up), my memory is slightly impaired (improving) & I still sometimes have poor balance. My liver & kidneys are fine. My heart is not as good as it was, but is ok. SO lucky.
If I’d have died (which by all accounts, I should have), I’d have missed out on so much. The job I love, spending time with people I love, writing, reading, studying, patting puppy dogs in the park, etc. Similar to Nellie, I didn’t think I could go on. Everything felt SO BAD right there, at that time, that I literally could not see any way out. I had tried everything – except reaching out for help – to fix it myself. But then when things started to get better and I started to get well again. I’d hate to think I’d have lost that chance.
I’m not sure I can say that suicide contagion exists. I only know from my experience that media coverage or no media coverage, I was feeling so low, so disconnected from everything that there was nothing that could have gotten in my way of my plan. By this stage, I wasn’t even reading the news or doing anything much other than staring at the walls.
I think respectful reporting is important. I think method is not necessary. What we need to know is that the person was in so much pain they couldn’t take it anymore. The method didn’t kill the person, their pain did. I think stories of recovery are more important than stories of death, but I think we need to talk about it more in our community. If addressing it by the media is what we need to do to make it work, then that’s what we need to do.
I know this much. Life is not perfect. Life is goddam difficult sometimes. But right now I’m ok. I am glad I’m here. If I’d have been able to hold on just a few more weeks, or even hold off another 24 hours and sought help, I would have saved myself and my community a lot of pain. I’m blogging my recovery journey over at http://www.stethescopesandivlines.wordpress.com
If you’re contemplating taking your life I urge you to do this. Do not act now. Do not act when your plan is organised. Hold on. Seek help. It Will, unbelievably I know, get better. Call lifeline 0n 13 11 14, or go to the emergency department or go to a friend and get them to sit with you until you can see a doctor. But don’t do it now.
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Wow, Ella I am so sorry for what you have been through and so happy that you survived.
Best wishes for the future.
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Ella – you are a strong, amazing, special soul to share your incredible story with us. I am so glad it turned out well for you and like Nellie you may / will go on to live a full, happy and loved filled life. We all face challenges, hardships and tough times and often feel we are alone or completely helpless. But we must trust that the world in general will look out for us and things do get better .., everything is inherently good … Keep believing that ! It’s true ! Keep believing in yourself and how worthy you are and how many people care. You are doing great. Keep it up! A big hug … Sarah x
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Hugs to you Ella. Glad you are still with us, and helping others xx
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Ella thank you so much for sharing your story. It’s incredibly moving, and I hope will really help other people see that things can improve in their life. Your honesty shows great courage and strength. I wish you all the best x
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I think depression is something that needs to be discussed more. I used to work in a pharmacy and I used to be flabbergasted by the number of people taking anti-depressants – it is staggering. I used to think that suicide was a selfish act too, until I suffered depression myself and saw how hopeless you can feel in those dark times. Luckily, I think I have largely overpowered my black dog, but I do note that my bad days now are much darker than they were before I suffered from depression. Whereas before I rarely had a bad day and when I did I shrugged it off, now a bad day is a massive slump that feels impossible to crawl out of – luckily it is over the next day and I am back to being me again.
What I find difficult is that I work in a foreign country and most of my friends are also colleagues, which means that it is not very good to talk about really deep, dark feelings as you are compromising how you will be seen professionally. Depression still has a lot of stigma and misunderstanding and I feel like if I spoke to the friends I have here, it would limit chances of promotion as you could be viewed as unstable or potentially unreliable or a flake.
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A close friend of my son, committed suicide during grade 10. It had a devastating effect on that year group. The school was amazing, and did all they could, but a year later, many are still struggling. It is still effecting our family, our son is still in counselling. I thank god that all the boys felt they could openly grieve, openly cry, seek counselling and admit they were struggling. This was only because it was talked about. I agree, if it helps one person, saves one life, saves on family from a lifetime of grief, its worth it.
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I encourage all people considering suicide to go and real a blog called RRSAHM. Lori is such a amzing brave woman who is so great at explaining the aftermath of her husbands suicide. Harrowing reading but it encouraged me to ask the question “Are you ok?”
http://www.rrsahm.com
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Lori is AMAZING.
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I do love that Nellie’s story had a good ending, but what about the poor guy she was meant to marry in the first place? What ever became of him? I would love to know and hope his life became a happy one too : )
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I think the mental illnesses that may lead to suicide definitely need to be discussed, and in the last 15 years or so discussion has certainly become more public. Which is fantastic.
I don’t think the community needs the details on suicides – the where and the how.
My maternal grandfather committed suicide when my mum was 14 and I was brought up being told that it is a completely selfish act, and solves nothing. I can see the emotional scars it wreaked on the family, still visible 46 years later.
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As with any death, I dont think its anyone elses business but the close family of those involved. They are the ones who should determine how public or private the details need to be .
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the other thing that notably increases after a widely reported suicide is traffic accidents, alerting us that many road fatalities might actually be suicides.
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I used the subject of suicide in men a lot during my journalism degree. My ex had a mate whose brother committed suicide over a breakup. It was very humbling to speak to him about it and use the interview for my radio/investigative journalism classes.
I’ve contemplated it myself, in my darkest moments. I couldn’t go through with it, as I kept thinking about how it would affect my family and the missed opportunities. I would tell people to put themselves in loved ones shoes. How would they feel? Or imagine if a loved one were to do it? How would you feel?
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I’m not sure that I accept that suicide is contagious, just a really desperate act by a person who can’t see any hope for their future. My ex partner took their own life a few years ago, having been depressed/anxious for over a year having had numerous hospital and counsellor sessions. The extreme hopelessness they felt was heartbreaking to watch and I felt unable to help. He was let down a bit by the mental health system but that is another issue, for him suicide was an escape from the pain inside and he was aware of the effect it would have on me and our child but that didn’t stop the event from occurring.
I wonder if any readers have any advice on how to talk to a child who doesn’t know the facts of their father’s death. They were too young at the time to know more than dad has died. It worries me that there is secrecy around the circumstances mainly due to the horrible nature of the death, but I don’t want it to become a family secret either. Would appreciate any advice…
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A great resource for young children after the death by suicide of a loved one -Red Chocolate Elephants by Dr Diana Sands -available from http://www.grief.org.au -they also have some other good resources for young children
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I’m not sure what the right answer is either. I do know though that it (suicide) does nothing but leave a lot of unanswered questions.
A girl I know took her own life on Wednesday last week. To say it’s left her family and friends shocked would be an understatement. Her Facebook page is now a tribute to how much she is/was loved and missed, and the number one question everyone is asking is ‘Why’?
So many questions, no answers.
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I totally agree with Katy – there is a difference between reporting suicide in media and having an open discourse on topic with an emphasis on educating the public.
Another website that may be of assistance is http://softenthefckup.com.au/. This new initiative is all about encouraging men to soften up / speak about how they are feeling / support each other, and hopefully help reduce male suicide in Australia.
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I think there is very little said about depression despite it being the #1 mental health problem. While I agree in pointing peoe towards Beyond Blue and Lifeline I think education in schools – especially high school is key.
I suffered depression in my teens and never realised what it was until my early 20s. I had all the symptoms – insomnia, extreme tiredness, isolation, feeling like everything was to be endured rather than enjoyed.
When I spoke to my mum about years ago whether she knew she answered yes. Asked why she never got me help she responded saying everyone goes through it and knew I would figure it out eventually.
My mum is far from a cruel person, she’s honestly lovely, but I think she is an example of what the general view of depression is and how to deal with it.
We need to talk more about the cause than the outcome. We need to remove the shame and isolation that depression has around it – it breaks it’s control then over people and they can then find help rather than staying silent and in pain.
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There defiantly needs to be more discussion about mental illness and the stigma that is still very much there!
Depression can be easy to hide especially of the person thinks this is just how things are for them.
The other thing about suicide is its not always about dying for that person. It can be that
they have become so numb and suddenly it
becomes a logical thought that if I do thisi
it will all stop. It will be ok. Dying as crazy as it sounds doesn’t even come into the equation.
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This is such a hard issue. I don’t know what the answer is, but I do know that what we are doing now isn’t working. People continue to commit suicide, and really every suicide is a suicide bombing – there may not be shrapnel but there is certainly collateral damage.
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I agree with Katy and I also believe that suicide prompts more suicide. It’s a psychological phenomena.
If anyone is ever feeling this low, please talk to a counsellor or pick up the phone and dial lifeline.
There definitely needs to be more discussion with the general public regarding mental health.
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I think the link is actually http://moodgym.anu.edu.au
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Thanks marmalady – I have updated it
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Thanks Mia for today’s story -especially re-telling Nellie,s story. We need to encourage more conversation about how to notice the signs, how to support someone who is thinking of suicide and we need to be especially compassionate to those bereaved by suicide -so let’s talk. I wonder if you hesitated in writing this story?
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I don’t know whether it’s real, but I do know that when it happened in my own family, there was someone we knew who also took their life just two weeks beforehand, then someone else, within the week of our own loss. Not sure that is just coincidence.
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There’s a difference between reporting suicide in media and having an open discourse on topic with an emphasis on educating the public. Both camps are right in my opinion.
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