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IVF1 380x569 IVF: how much is too much?If you’ve ever Googled IVF, here is what you’ll find.

Scattered in amongst all the advertising and the health information, are the stories of thousands of women.

Stories of women who are absolutely desperate to have a child. Stories of women who have found joy with the success of IVF.

Stories of women who are still hoping beyond all hope that on the next roll of the dice their numbers will come up.

What’s harder to find are the stories of the women who stopped trying.

Perhaps, because when you have spent thousands of dollars and countless hours of hope and then disappointment, into trying to make a dream into reality – you rarely want to talk about how it feels when the happy ending doesn’t happen.

Modern medicine has done amazing things for women’s health and fertility. But how often do we stop to consider the effect these advances have on the mental state of the women who don’t get pregnant?

Journalist Wendy Squires wrote recently about her close friend’s struggle with IVF:

Wendy Squires  177x236 IVF: how much is too much?

Wendy Squires

Louisa was a mess. After enduring nine IVF cycles in less than a year, she was so obsessed with trying ”just one more time” for a baby that she hid her last two attempts from her closest friends and family – even her husband.

Her abdomen was a blast of angry pinpricks from hormone injections; she had put on eight hated kilos, was clinically depressed and had forgotten a time when sex was fun.

She was also broke, having re-mortgaged to keep up with the expensive procedures (minus the government rebate, the average cost for a cycle is $3000). Her relationship was suffering and career neglected.

But perhaps the saddest fact is that Louisa entered into every cycle of IVF aware that at her age – 46 – her chance of conceiving was a fraction of 1 per cent. Not great odds when compounded with her history of endometriosis and the fact she had never become pregnant naturally.

Louisa’s story is not uncommon. Most women have a story to share about IVF – if not about themselves, then about a friend, an aunt, a sister, a cousin. But here’s the thing. If Louisa were your friend, what would you say to her?

Would you back her to the hilt? Would you encourage her to try and try and try again; to keep fighting for what she wants so badly? Or do you break the news to this person who you love, that the pain she is putting herself through is no longer worth the ever-dwindling chance of success?

Wendy made that call. She counseled Louisa to stop. But when she hears about IVF success stories or against-the-odds celebrity pregnancies (like this one) they make her wonder whether she did the right thing. Wendy writes:

And here lies the big emotional hurdle with IVF – it is a numbers game. It’s like buying lottery tickets – not such a silly idea if you win…

Ask any woman over 40 why she doesn’t have children and there will be a back-story, often a painful one. I am no different. But I have a deeply felt opinion that children are not a given in life – they are a gift. And that sadly, despite how much a child is desired, it is simply not every woman’s lot or luck in life to reproduce.

…I do want other women struggling with fertility to know that it does get better, that the yearning does abate, that it won’t plague your every waking moment as it does now. Promise.

What advice would you give a friend who had been trying IVF for a sustained period but having no success?  At what point is it okay for you to stop being the supportive friend and start being the realistic one? Have you been through IVF? What was your experience?

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183 Comments so far

  1. Tra

    I am going through my second round of ivf and I am in my 2ww. I can tell you first hand that you have no idea what it is not to be able to not have a baby on your own. I sometimes cry and I will not lie, I am somewhat depressed over the entire thing. For someone that probably has children or is content with not having children telling me that I should give up on something that I most desperately need, it is quite selfish and it’s not fair. We need support more than ever not to have a “friend” shoot our dreams out of the sky. I personally think that their are ways around ivf but the doctors are so greedy that they give us this option as an easy way out instead of directly rectifying the problem that is causing the infertility in the first place. If this was a guaranteed procedure, it will be a lot easier to spend every dime and penny. Their are surgeries for blocked tubes that are never mentioned. Their are also surgeries for endo, etc. You can even do things to assist pcos and help you ovulate through medication. This might take longer but most insurances cover these things and you can get pregnant from them. If this does not work for me, my research will be done and I will get pregnant. I think this is all a game for the reproductive endocrinologists and I am tired of being a ping pong ball. It could be possible that i am pointing the blame in the wrong direction but this is how I truly feel. More importantly so, I believe that you, a friend need to be more supportive. This is very frustrating and painful to undergo.

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  2. Jo

    One miscarriage natural pregnancy. 5 ivfs. Tens of thousands spent on naturopaths, acupuncture, Chinese medicine, special diets. All for no result. I’m 42 in Feb. We are broke and childless and for the first time in years, happy to be done with the hideous rollercoaster that is infertility. Good luck to all if you on your journeys. Only you can decide when enough is enough x

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  3. Cate

    I had ectopics, miscarriage and then went down the road of Ivf. We did 8 cycles fell pregnant with most and lost our babies between 4 and 11 weeks. It was suggested we go down the path of donor eggs. In our circumstance we decided against this as we did not want to explain to a child the situation as it was such an unknown how children deal with it psychologically. We decided to have a break. In the break we looked at Adoption. In Australia, adoption is practically impossible, so we thought we would go down the fostering road and try to have some positive influences in children’s lives that are difficult to no fault of there own. We decided to take a trip overseas before we embarked on our new life. We never had a honeymoon when we married so now was the time to have one. So we closed the door on Ivf in 2010. Took our holiday overseas 2012 and discovered a lump on the breast. I was quickly diagnosed with breast cancer stage 3 and we cut our trip short. I have had surgery and now going through chemo. There is no history at all of breast cancer in our family. The Ivf Clinics will not look you up after treatment to see how your health and well being is. They are aware they have placed you at a higher risk. Personally I would not encourage anyone down the path of Ivf, even for those that have been lucky to have a child because it is not worth the risk of losing your life or the leaving your husband a widow and your child motherless. I will recover and we will now need to revisit our plans . Life has really come against us becoming parents, we are good wholesome people but we are now in a position that we realise it was never meant to be. Fortunately we are the best of friends as well as husband and wife and we will focus on this. Do all the research before embarking on Ivf and listen to the facts , not your heart nor what your dream is. Dreams can be changed and life can still be great, but when we let our hearts rule against facts it can lead to a lot of heart ache and loss of life.

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  4. 27andinfertile

    The few friends who know of mine and my husband’s situation are here for me if I want to have a chat. It is my fertility specialists role to tell me when enough is enough. After my second IVF cycle she suggested I start thinking about using donor eggs – I told her that would be very selfish of me. After our third IVF cycle we already had our donor lined up. My perception of using a donor had changed in such a short period of time. We knew our chances of conceiving (using my eggs) where very slim. We didn’t want to ‘waste’ any more of our lives on IVF cycles.

    We’ve just finished our fourth cycle – this time we used a donor. My pregnancy test is next week. http://www.littlepleasures.blog.com

    Let’s hope I will no longer be a – as the article states – “woman absolutely desperate to have a child”. Really??? That is so demeaning.

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  5. whattodo

    I am 29 and going through our first IVF cycle. I had the embryo transfer yesterday and today have been offered a dream job with fantastic opportunity. I’m keen to hear peoples thoughts on what to do. Is it morally wrong to take this job knowing that I could be pregnant? It is risky for me too, giving up paid maternity entitlements at my current job along with the security of maternity leave. But our IVF journey could take a long time, who is to know? I don’t want to miss this career opportunity but don’t want to burn any bridges/relationships either with potential employer. PLEASE HELP! Any thoughts / advice would be greatly appreciated.

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    • Kym

      that is a tough one. Can you hold off letting them know until you know if you are pregnant? I can fully understand you wanting the maternity leave. I work in Government and have been working part time for three and half years on contracts and am now pregnant. When I finish up in November, I will get no maternity leave – just the Federal Government’s paid parental leave (thank God for that).

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      • whattodo

        I won’t be able to hold off letting them know until I know, it’s a full 2 weeks so not sure I can do that as they want to move pretty quickly with this position. At least the government’s maternity leave policy will still apply. Thanks for the reply, fantastic news on your prenancy and best of luck.

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      • whattodo

        I won’t be able to hold off letting them know until I know, it’s a full 2 weeks so not sure I can do that as they want to move pretty quickly with this position. At least the government’s maternity leave policy will still apply. Thanks for the reply, antastic news on yur prenancy and best of luck.

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        • 27andinfertile

          Take the job. Like you said, there is no telling how long it will take to get a positive. If it’s positive this time around then fantastic! You’ll still get to work there for a little while yet.

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  6. Anna

    I had my three children in my twenties, met my second husband ten years later. Babies were always in our mind and now at 44 I have done two rounds of IVF.. But able to produce only 2 eggs both times, no pregnancies. My biggest regret? We should have done IVF years ago, not thinking that maybe we are able to do it naturally. And now we have decided to move on, my youngest daughter is pregnant . I am going to be NaNa – yeah!

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  7. Kate

    I am 28 years old and can boast 9 IVF failures in 18 months. It is such an incredibly unique situation to find yourself in and unless you have experienced IVF first hand (and by that I dont mean your bosses sisters daughter), I would suggest keeping your opinion to one self. Just be grateful you are not in the shoes of an IVF’er and be respectful of what they are enduring. The IVF world is not a nice one and most of us just want to get on with it without too much discussion or opinion. My family know the drill now and it goes in this order: I bleed, I cry, they listen, they pour me a big glass of wine and then we talk about someone elses problems.

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  8. Princess

    I have 2 beautiful, perfect IVF/ICSI babies. It took 2 cycles, one fresh, one frozen to achieve my darling boy, it took 4, 1 fresh, 3 frozen with my beautiful lil girl.
    It is a long hard road, support from friends and family is paramount, and sometimes that support needs to be to say enough is enough, as hard as it is to hear, and say.

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    • Anonymous

      not really in a position to say that are you!

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  9. nicks02

    The only person who knows if it’s time to give up, is the woman having the IVF. I know this, because I’m about to go to Athens for donor embryos as my 5th round didn’t work here.
    I don’t tell my friends how I think they should bring up their children, or I think the guy they’re dating isn’t right…so please DO NOT tell me when I should stop wanting to be a Mum, because that want will never go away. EVER.

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    • Lil

      Hi nick02

      Wishing you all the very best on your journey to Athens and beyond. Never stop hoping or exploring the options available to you. When there is the will there is a way, donor eggs, and surrogacy are just some of the options available. I never stopped searching for a solution to my infertility problems and now have three gorgeous children. I couldn’t stand it when people told me to except my lot in life and move on. It is your choice and your right to follow your dream of parenthood.

      Sending you much love and strength for the journey ahead xxx

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  10. Loop

    I don’t think it’s EVER a friend’s job to tell somebody to stop trying for IVF. Maybe question what will really make them happy? Tease out their reasons and give them a different perspective? But always let *them* tell *you* what’s best for them.

    I wouldn’t expect my friends to treat me like a kid and tell me what to do in my life, so I’d never do that to them.

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  11. speccygirl

    We just don’t have the money (and we have other debt) – so we’ve decided not to do it… end of story. The amount of money we would spend would mean it could be hard for us to then provide for a family anyway. Very hard for us when so many people suggest it. We’ve had friends and relatives who have done it successfully and unsuccessfully. All the best to everyone trying to conceive with challenges…

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    • speccygirl

      interestingly hardly anyone considers adoption nowadays… for various societal reasons it has simply disappeared.

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      • Anon

        Or people do consider it but it is next to impossible to achieve. Seriously, I went down the -very short!- list of countries Australia has adoption agreements with and we were excluded from every one for a variety of different reasons: too old (38), too fat (at size 16, not 26!), chronic illness (my husband – and it’s not something that would affect his ability to be a great dad, but it’s still a strike), not Catholic (or religious at all – some countries require you to be a regular church goer of some sort), not of ethnic heritage of country where child is (not much we can do about this one). I would LOVE to adopt. But not going to happen. So we’re starting IVF. We both have issues that make it super unlikely we’ll have babies naturally.

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        • Andrea

          Unlikely does not mean NEVER, doctors don’t always know 100% the answers to everything, check my previous post and decide for yourself! Good luck! (P.S. My inspiration was when my husbands doctor told him a lady did IVF 12 times and finally had a baby, I thought it she can do it so can I.

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          • Andrea

            P.P.S. I’m not rich by any means, we organised a credit card soley for IVF, put the $$$ bill on it, got our rebates back etc & paid off the balance on the credit card slowly when we had the money to. Then we did that again the following time, it was the only way we had the money to do it but it worked.

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    • Ness73

      Speccygirl, have you had a look into government funding for IVF? You do have to fit into certain criteria – namely age and you cant already have a child, but it may be worth looking in to. You should definitley ask some questions about it – it may be your answer. Good luck.

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      • Cat

        Government Fundcing?????

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  12. Polly

    Our first IVF attempt was successful and we had a beautiful baby. When we tried for a second child, it was a very different. Four years of repeated attempts. I honestly lost count. It was emotionally exhausting, physically demanding. Repeated miscarriages. I can’t tell you the hell we went through. We were REPEATEDLY advised by friends to ‘be happy with what you have got’. We were. We recognised we were iincredibly blessed, but it didn’t stop us from feeling that ‘someone was missing’. Finally, after a horrific incident when IVF lab accidentally disposed of LIVE embryos, we decided we could not go on. I had already been implanted when this incident occurred but did not know the result. Miraculously, we were pregnant and had a second beautiful baby, who completes our family.
    While I understand the concerns of my family and friends who advised us to give up, I am so grateful I did not listen.
    While too many of us struggle with infertility and miscarriage, it is a lonely road. No one walks the same path. I had one friend who decided, after only a couple of attempts, that she had had enough.
    No matter how close friends and family, they will not be the ones to live with the decision. Had I stopped when advised by my friends, my husband and I would have lived with regret and the sense that a part of us was missing.
    By the time we had made a decision that this would be our last attempt, we knew the road had come to an end. I thank God that the last attempt was successful. Who knows how I would have felt had the result been different? But at least I would have known I had done all I could and had finished my journey.
    My point is that everyone has their own limit. My friend had a few tries, no child, and that was her road. My heart ached for her when she decided to quit.
    But she had done all she could.
    My road was very very much longer but ultimately worth the heartache..
    Sure, speak up if you have concerns, but don’t press the point. It is her, not you, who will have to live with any ‘if only I’d….’

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  13. Kylie2

    It is very sad to hear of the heartbreak that so many couples face.

    If less than 1% of women in their late 40s will actually have a baby through IVF, the other 99% are going to have to give up at some stage. It’s really a question of “when?”

    If you’re not the person affected it makes sense to give up it while your relationship is intact and you’re financially solvent. If you are the person involved you have to feel that you’ve tried every single thing possible and that you’ll never regret feeling that you gave up too soon. I get why people keep going, long after it makes sense to stop. Someone has to be in that one percent.

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  14. chon

    To be a friend to a friend going through IVF is a hard thing. They are usually mental cases – I know this because I was the IVF friend! I was extremely lucky to have amazing, supportive friends that whilst not always side by side they were there for me when I needed them. In saying that if one of them had told me it was time to give up I would have been devastated. BUT, the difference is I am in my early 30′s not in my mid 40′s so the chances of success were fundamentally different. If Wendy could see that this was going nowhere and made the tough love choice to tell her friend that, I can’t find it in me to be harsh to her. It is an awful thing to be confronted with.

    Make no mistake IVF professionals will tell you when they think they can’t help you anymore. They are not just in it for the money. The good ones just want to get you pregnant.

    The only thing I find difficult is when people say that having a child wasn’t to be her destiny or her path in life. Nowhere is it written who is preordained to have children and who can’t. Sometimes circumstances stuff things up and yes if you are going to start trying later in life you know you are cutting it fine, you are not silly. I started trying not long after my 30th birthday with my 26 year old husband – we never thought we would be one of the percentages! But we were and it wasn’t until I changed clinics, had a second opinion that we identified my “unexplained” status and first cycle with him I was pregnant (and four days away from my due date!!). It took six cycles to get me pregnant – I don’t know how many I would have gone through but to never not have this feeling it would have scarred me for life.

    I once had a comment on my blog from a person who had made the “decision” to live child free. I put decision in “” because as she said to me it wasn’t her decision but one that was made for her and even though she has made her peace with it and realises it is what it is, there is still a part of her that wished things were different. There is a difference between living a child free life by choice and living a child free life when choice is taken away.

    It’s hard, it’s awful but you need your friends to be the good and bad angel to help you through this journey.

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  15. jb expat

    Been through MULTIPLE rounds of ivf…initially with my own eggs…4 cancelled cycles, 4 miscarriages requiring 4 D&C’s – over 2 years. My closest of friends knew all the details and finally one did express her concern (she did not exactly suggest stopping and she also had quite traumatic health issues around her own pregnancies although ultimately she did not need ivf) – she also was very clear in that she’d support me in whatever my husband and I decided to do. While I appreciated her concern (and love the fact that she cares so much about me), I needed to try as much as I could tolerate (physically and emotionally). And I did hit a wall – a wall of complete and total emotional exhaustion and physical well, it wasn’t pretty – almost 10kgs, too exhausted to exercise (from not sleeping because I was so stressed), etc. But then I was ready – ready to try an egg donor. And ALL of my friends who were so concerned were thrilled because we all knew (because it had been determined with as much certainty as possible that it was my eggs) it would probably work. And it did – I have a beautiful little boy and am…shhh…5 weeks pregnant from an embryo that was frozen from the first donor cycle that brought us our little boy. If I hadn’t gone through what I did, I wouldn’t have been able to look at donor eggs as a blessing – a true miracle of modern medicine making our dreams come true (sounds corny, but it is very hard to find the words to express how grateful my husband and I are).

    I don’t think there’s a right answer as to “how many”. In fact, the answer was different for my husband – he was initially devastated when I told him I couldn’t try any more with my own eggs…but, as he says almost daily – he can’t imagine a little boy more perfect than our little boy (and he came around well before the donor cycle even began). I think what is most important is a support network – friends, family, partner – whatever yours is. It’s a tough an lonely journey and as I’ve said before, unless you’ve been through infertility yourself (and specifically ivf), you cannot truly understand the emotional side of it and really, shouldn’t say “hey, just adopt”. Adoption is so difficult, just as costly and not the right answer for a lot of people. Nothing about building a family is a one-size-fits-all approach!
    I know people believe that if you can’t get pregnant on your own or after X tries, then “it wasn’t meant to be”. I just don’t believe this. If you can’t cure cancer without chemo and all the horrible side effects, then were you not meant to live? If you need glasses, were you not meant to see clearly? If you have a degenerative disease, are you not meant to seek a cure?

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    • jb expat

      Oh – and I’m old – Collette Dinnigan old! but had an easy pregnancy although ended up delivery almost 4 weeks early because out of the blue my waters broke early…but up until then, my OB was thrilled with how my pregnancy was going.

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  16. Dkmum

    Ugh, I surely hope I never find myself in that situation. Damned if you do, damned if you don’t.
    I’d probably ask whether adoption had been considered before advising that enough is enough.

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    • chon

      Adoption is usually always in the mix whether through donor eggs or old school adoption. However, as has been spoken about many many many times unfortunately in this country it is not as easy as it is for the movie stars.

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  17. Jorie

    I’d like to think that there are some women over forty who are childless by choice and have no regrets about it.

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    • jb expat

      I know quite a few – and they are quite happy and fulfilled – and their vacations are so much better than mine! as are their bags under their eyes (meaning mine are so much worse than theirs)!

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  18. Anon for this one

    I have not been through IVF for some years, thankfully. My only ‘advice’ is to say you do need to start with an end game as otherwise you can go on forever and the IVF companies do not tell you to stop as far as I am aware. They are commercial entities. When you begin you need to say okay I will do this for 1 year, 10 cycles or when you hit your financial limit of $10K or whatever you think you can live with or have to live with. You also need to have other things in your life so it doesn’t become all about trying to get pregnant. I learnt all these lessons the hard way. Our IVF story was ultimately a happy one but I think counselling is very important as the statistics show that they are not all happy endings. Also worth noting on that point when I started IVF 8 years ago, statistics were based on pregnancies…not live births…a significant difference,however this may have changed.

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    • Dkmum

      Such good advice!

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    • Faybian

      This is exactly what I’d say. Myself and a colleague were struggling with infertility at the same time. Mine was secondary, hers was primary. Both is us discussed how far and for how long we were willing to try. Fortunately for us, we both had good end results (2 girls apiece), but those conversations between us were a life and sanity saver.
      While in ever needed full IVF I could see how the temptation would be there to just keep going.

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  19. Jackson

    This is such an emotional topic and I really feel for all theses couples who struggle to have children.
    My only comment on this topic, which comes totally as an outsider looking in. (as I have no experience in this)
    Is that when someones mental health and the health of their relationships are suffering, then as a friend I would want to help my friend and offer not only my support but my observations about how I could see them suffering would have to be said as well.
    I would not be able to sit by and keep my silence if I could see that someone I loved was putting their mental health at risk.
    I would not keep quiet if I though someone was suffering from depression and I think that this is just as important to speak up about.
    I know that if it was me, and my friends were worried about me, I would want them to tell me they were worried.
    It also concernes me when I hear of relationships that break up due to the pressure of IVF.
    Some people seem to lose sight of what they already have in the quest to get something they want.
    There is no point in having a baby if your relationship with your partner has been destroyed in the process and you have split up.
    That being said, IVF etc is a personal road for each couple and each person finds their own path, we are all different and we all have different limits.
    Good luck to all the MM readers who are living this right now.

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  20. Anonymous

    Wendy,

    Thank you for your article. I am 35 years old and my fertility has been obliterated by severe endometriosis, which was undiagnosed until I was 30 (which is another story). Thank you for telling me that the yearning will abate. Thank you for being the kind of friend who supports, who tells the hard truth when it is needed and who is wise and empathetic. People like you make me feel less alone.

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  21. Anon

    One of your previous posts was about ‘should you tell your friends and family that you’re on IVF’.

    Seriously, this is why so many people keep their damn mouth shut. Look at all the negative reactions coming out of the woodwork.

    It’s nobody’s business if you’re doing your first IVF or your fifteenth. You don’t get to judge.

    I don’t know why an IVF-er would even choose to read a post on Mamamia. Sure as heck not a safe place.

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    • Just saying

      Because we might just find something or someone that gives us a little hope when we are losing ours.
      That is why we come to MM.
      Are you helping…? nope :(

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      • Bee

        My husband and I tried to conceive naturally for 3 yrs. We saw a fertility specialist who recommended IVF due to our ages (mid 30′s atmthe time). We decided against it, my husband as he had mates who’s lives/marriages had been destroyed by IVF obsession (their words, not mine) and me because I had studied reproductive biology and have strong reservations about it. We moved on with our lives.
        Then a few years later I became pregnant – it was a complete shock. I didn’t even realise I was until I was 12 weeks pregnant! I was in my early 40′s and thought I was becoming menopausal. I have had that baby (a beautiful baby boy) and have gone on to have 2 more pregnancies resulting in another 2 beautiful boys. My OB is now discussing pregnancy prevention with
        me as he believes I am highly fertile (in my early forties)! This is in complete contrast to what I was being told by the fertility specialist less than 10 yrs ago.
        Things change. You just never know. Unless you have had a hysterectomy there is always hope. But there are no guarantees! Good luck to anyone chasing their dreams, just don’t forget to live a good life along the way :-)

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    • chon

      sometimes it is hard but I have found most of these comments were very balanced and fair. unfortunately IVF is a topic that people feel they have the right to comment on. although……most things in life these days that are personal people feel like they have the right to comment on!!!

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  22. oopsyboops

    Friend should be there to support, to hold hands, to cry with us. To ask “are you ok” and maybe get you to really think about that answer. But I don’t see it as my friends place to tell me to stop trying for children. Unless they have actually been there, they simply can’t know the level of grief one feels while trying for a baby.

    We had 6 cycles to have Miss C. I was in a bad place during that last cycle, and I honestly don’t know what I would have done if it hadn’t worked. With Master A we knew we couldn’t keep going for that long. The first cycle was a disaster (I got OHSS but not embryos to transfer) and at that point our specialist recommended we stop or try other options. We gave it one last shot, and got Master A. But I knew I couldn’t do any more. But *I* had to come to that conclusion. Yes I talked about it with friends who talked about hard hard it was to see us suffer, but they couldn’t really know.

    Just to put it into perspective for anyone who doesn’t really understand. For me, the emotional toll of IVF was worse than being told I had a brain tumor. Yes I’ve had some shockers of days, with my treatment and so on, but the grief of IVF was harder to deal with.

    I blogged about this here although I think I need to update that post, as I don’t think I quite conveyed correctly how I was feeling at the time and also how I feel now:
    http://morebananas.blogspot.com.au/2012/01/which-is-worse-ivf-or-having-brain.html

    Big big hugs to anyone still on the rollercoaster. You are NOT alone. Reach out if you need to.

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  23. wendy

    I have been reading these comments and can see this is an incredibly loaded topic. In encouraging my friend to stop IVF for a period I was not trying to cruel her chances of having a child – I was trying to save her sanity. The fact is women undergoing multiple procedures when they have very little chance require counseling. I believe it should be mandatory in all states and not just Victoria. I also believe that there should be a time when doctors say enough. It is their obligation if it is hindering their patient’s health – even if just their emotional health. To everyone trying for a child with IVF I wish you only success. And to women who are realising that they may have missed the biological boat, I am sending my heartfelt condolences.

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    • Vegas

      Hey Wendy, I thought you did a tough and loving thing, and I would hope to have the strength to do the same in similar circumstances. xxxx

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    • oopsyboops

      I think the trouble is you were reaching out to your friend because her personal circumstances, particularly her age, limited her chances. And yes it sounds like she needed support and guidance.

      But everyone’s story is slightly different. And as you can see on here, a lot of people have such misguided ideas about what is involved in the IVF process. One of those is that everyone doing IVF is over 40. (simply not true at all – I was 28 when we started TTC, and 30 when I started IVF). Also that the women is to blame for requiring IVF (not true in my case, my husband has dodgy sperm from having the mumps as a child). Also, people presume that the odds are slim for everyone – initially my odds were 60% (most people only have a 25% chance for a natural cycle).

      So unfortunately, publicly discussing one persons circumstances and then inferring it applies to everyone else is misguided, and potentially harmful. But discussion like this is good. I truly believe there needs to be more of it, so that people do become more aware of the processes and what is involved. And yes, you are right, counselling should be offered (and often is).

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  24. AT

    My IVF doctor told me of one woman who tried 26 times before a successful pregnancy. Another doctor told me of a couple who tried 18 times, not including FETs (frozen embryo transfers) before coming to see her. She suggested a donor egg, which worked on the first go.

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    • chon

      in my last cycle I was with a women who was my age that had gone through IVF 18 times! 18 times before she was 34. She had even tried donor eggs. It was insane. But she was determined to do it one more time and her one more time resulted in a live birth. sometimes that one extra time is all that it takes.

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  25. Anonymous

    Any concerns from anyone how IVF can affect your chances of getting cancer? All those hormone injections could not possibly be good for your health. I would never in a million years go near IVF if I could not conceive.

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    • IVFer

      What about the statistics of increased breast cancer in the 40+ if you dont have a pregnancy…..

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      • Anonymous

        Glad I had my kids naturally

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        • chon

          very easy to make grand statements of never would go through IVF if I couldn’t conceive until you have to stand in those shoes……..

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        • Well, der Fred

          What a smug and stupid thing to say, Anonymous

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          • Jess

            Such a cold and heartless thing to say.

            I have two beautiful girls through natural conception and I have donated my eggs via IVF treatment to a couple who have had many failed IVF attempts.

            I cannot imagine the heartache people go through when trying to conceive. The stress of failed IVF attempts would be enermous.

            Comments like yours dont help

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    • Michelle

      Anonymous, I take it by ‘if I could not conceive’ you mean either you CAN conceive naturally, you don’t want children, or you don’t know if you can conceive yet. I hope for your sake you can conceive naturally.
      There are risks with any kind of hormone therapy, IVF, HRT etc. There are ways to reduce your risks-breastfeeding may reduce the risk of breast cancer, removal of fallopian tubes which may reduce the risk of ovarian cancer. We aren’t idiots who go into this blind, I know personally I research every step obsessively, and so far there has not been a significant increase in cancer diagnoses in IVF patients.
      Also, please think about the fact that many of us need IVF because our bodies don’t make the levels of hormones we are supposed to-the levels ‘normal’ people have naturally all the time. This can cause many, many health issues including thyroid problems. PCOS, for example, is linked to metabolic issues which increase the risk of heart disease and diabetes. NOT treating it with hormones can be risky. I know for a fact my health has dramatically improved since being treated with hormones, and other health issues have resolved or improved. If you are a reproductive specialist though, and know more about this than we who have gone through it and researched it and spoken at length to actual professionals about the risks, please feel free to pass on some of your own knowledge.

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      • Anonymous

        When my niece died of cancer they linked the 10 years of IVF and her cancer. These were doctors talking.

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    • oopsyboops

      I have asked my specialist this, and he said the research that may have linked it was old (10 years or more) and not replicated.

      But, if you have an increased risk of cancer that is hormone receptive, then you may be increasing your chances of getting cancer. But that is a hypothetical. You wouldn’t know that until you have developed cancer. And if I was told – you have a 1% increased chance of cancer – or you can have a baby – well I know what I would do. But that too is a personal decision.

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  26. Amandarose

    I think the above article has missed the point that Wendy has never had kids so can relate to facing life childless?

    I agree- sometimes we have to accept what life has thrown us and move on. It is hard when You are the person caught up int the just one last chance game.

    I doubt I would tell a friend to stop as I am not in a place to understand or help her situation but maybe Wendy is.

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  27. Cathy Wood

    Good obstetrician refer clients to Natural Fertility Services ph:93905156 before IVF, they have a better success rate and are not as evasive as IVF. There is no harm in trying to maximising your chances by finding out when you are most fertile in the cycle. Over the counter ovulation kits are not 100% .

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    • AT

      Actually with IVF, the doctors tend to use hormone injections to ‘create’ a cycle.

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    • oopsyboops

      Most IVF doctors do extensive testing before recommending IVF. Depending on this, they may also recommend several options before IVF – clomid, timed ovulation, IUI, etc etc. IVF isn’t necessarily the first step. While I know several people who have benefited from natural fertility services and alternative apporaches, I also know many many women who have spent thousands of dollars on these services with no benefit.

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  28. Anonymous

    I don’t think anyone should be telling a friend when to give up on a dream. It is for every couple to decide what their limit is. As a friend you should just be there to help support them. Take them to a chick flick to take their mind off it, get drunk with them … Whatever…

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  29. gypsy

    When I first saw this post I was nervous because of all of the recent narkiness on mamamia I thought – “here we go, us IVFer’s are going to get shot down”. I have to say it’s good to see that the sisterhood is alive and well here today and that the majority of posts would only ever support their friends and not tell them to give up. Support is a big help.
    Interestingly though, I notice a number of comments that people are making about doctors wanting to have their patients keep going for their own financial benefit and whilst I can only comment on the experience I have with my clinic but I have to say that this couldn’t be further from the truth. I have never met such a caring, genuine group of medical professionals EVER than those who work in IVF and I know for a fact that my specialist has indeed turned people away and told them it’s time to give up.

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    • Michelle

      Couldn’t agree with you more, especially about the doctors and nurses. They are truly amazing people, in my experience, and worth every cent.

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    • Robyn P

      I agree, my FS told me after 3 IVF cycles that he would suggest I stop and look for a donor. He told me that if I wanted to keep going he would continue but he warned me that it would more than likely just end up in more heartbreak. I don’t think there are that many specialists out there who would use people’s infertility to their own advantage, they are just as upset as you are when things do not go well.

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  30. Anonymous

    first baby conceived with IVf at 39 years old, second baby conceived naturally at 41yrs old. trying for a third naturally at 44, dont ever give up, dont look at statistics too much, be aware but stop the numbers game, it’s a head fcuk. grandparents generation did it all the time, post war babies conceived with parents in their 40′s. don’t give up.

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  31. Michelle

    My opinion, as an IVF patient for the last 6 years…I would not tell someone to give up, nor would I be open to having a friend who hadn’t been through the same thing tell me to give up. This is not something anyone can understand unless they’ve been there, and even then everybody’s experiences are so different. People told me I was crazy for doing another stim cycle after almost dying from the last one-intensive care for 10 days, collapsed lung, multi organ shutdown, hours from death. You don’t care what you’re risking, you only care about what you can gain. I am now pregnant with my second IVF baby, and I’ll do it again in a heartbeat. I’m not saying everyone feels this way, but I sure as hell do.

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  32. anon

    I agree with Wendy Squires. Some people just arent meant to have children and accepting that can be like lifting a weight off their shoulders.
    I watched a close friend battle through IVF unsucessfully for several years. And during this time she became terribly depressed, she left her loved job that she loved and ended up breaking up her marriage as well. She’s now 46 and alone and her ex husband has a new partner and they have a baby together.
    I wish I had the guts to have that chat with her before the obsession to get pregnant took everything from her that she once loved.

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    • Amandarose

      I find you cannot tell people things. You can point out other things they have going for them or distract them so they can view things differently but when people are rapped up in hope and despair I really don’t think they are open to being told.
      All anyone can do is just be a friend

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  33. gypsy

    It is absolutely a numbers game and my doctors has gone through it very mathematically with me. Essentially for a woman of my age, I need about 20 good embryos for one successful pregnancy. It could take me 2 IVF goes or it could take me 20 to get that many. It depends on SO MANY VARIABLES PER EACH CYCLE. I am currently heading into cycle 6 and because I’m a “poor responder” it takes me one cycle to get max 2 embryos. Essentially this means that it is mathematically logical that I have not yet had a successful pregnancy. This might sound all very strange but when you are dealing with all of the insane, heartbreaking emotion of IVF then these figures give me some clarity. I have a lot of well meaning friends who have asked me “how many goes are you giving it”. As Law for Clouds says, the only advice I take about this is from my doctor who I trust 100%. My girlfriend (who is now the mum to a gorgeous 3 year old) lost count at about IVF number 15.
    I’m incredibly grateful that my husband and I are in a good financial position and coupled with our medicare system the money is not the issue for us.

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    • jb expat

      Totally agree with you – I believe it is a fertility specialist’s job to spoon feed you the facts – the statistics and the variables, and even their recommendation…but then it’s up to you (and partner if any) to make an informed decision. As you said, one of the most important things (I found) is finding a doctor that you trust.

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  34. Laws for Clouds

    I have never had IVF, but I think of it this way. If I had to make medical decisions for my child, the only person I would want advice from would be a doctor. I do not need well-meaning friends saying ‘Pull the plug’.

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    • Luc

      But the doctors have a pretty big invested interest in keeping you trying! It’s not really unbiased….

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      • Michelle

        Just for the record, I have been an IVF patient for 6 years, and have never met such amazing and caring doctors and nurses in my life. The hours they work, the time they spend with you, my doctor comes in on his holidays if I need something, calls me at 8pm to check on me when I start a new med, cried with me at my first ultrasound. They work their asses off, and deserve every cent they earn.

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        • Anonymous

          I agree Michelle. IVF doctors are amazing. I don’t think they do it for the money.

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          • Luc

            Yes, I actually agree they don’t do it for the money. But I think there is a sense that they want to succeed, they want you to have a good outcome, and this sense of optimism means sometimes they push on. I think it is with the best of intentions, but there is nonetheless that sense of scientific zeal about it all.

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            • anon

              I think that can be said for many specialists. Sometimes you have to know when to draw the line and call it quits with any sort of treatment. After ongoing and expensive visits to a specialist I stopped when I began to feel like I was just helping to pay for his new boat. I had my checkups with my GP instead and she told me it wasnt required, I was fine. She only wanted to see me if my symptoms returned, which they havent.

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        • Anon this time

          I’m sure that’s often true. But my brother and SIL really questioned whether their IVF doctors etc were really doing exactly what was best for them or were just trying to get them to fork over more cash. I think Luc has a point. Most of the time, I’m sure the doctors really do have their patients’ interests at heart, but there are also times when you have to question, as my brother and his wife did.

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  35. Rhonda

    I have been through 6 rounds of fertility treatment before we conceived our beautiful son. At one stage a friend (who was meaning well) suggested we stop trying and to look at adopting. As much as my frend was trying to help this was NOT helpful. If you have a friend going through treatment please do not ever offer advice to “stop” this is none of your business. Just be there with open ears and an open heart and listen, laugh and cry with them. Do not take it upon yourself to provide advice to them.

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  36. neola

    I’m currently on round 2, finding out whether it worked today!

    I managed to freeze 5 embryos from my first harvesting, so I thought, ‘OK, good. 5 chances is plenty if the odds are roughly 1 in 3 at my age.’ I definitely NEVER wanted to go through another round of egg collection again, after hyperstimulating and nearly dying the first time.

    But 2 of the 5 didn’t survive thawing, and the first transfer didn’t work. After this one, I have one left. And yes, I will do it all again in I have to. Stopping doesn’t feel like an option yet. It’s amazing how far you’ll go when you feel pushed and without a choice. I never thought I’d do IVF at all…

    So no, I’d never tell a friend when to stop and I probably wouldn’t take it well if someone told me to. If you want to be a good friend, offer distractions aplenty, girls’ trips away, nights out, nights in on the couch watching funny, mindless movies. Just be there.

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    • Mrs H

      Neola, glad to hear that you are waiting to find your results out today. So am I. I have been wondering how you have been going with it all!

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    • eternally

      You must know by now, I hope it was positive!

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      • neola

        Who knew it was possible to be ‘a little bit pregnant’?

        Apparently, there’s a tiny amount of pregnancy hormone, but not enough to declare it a positive – so another week of limbo for me!

        Still, I’ll cling to whatever scrap of hope I can…at least it’s not a no.

        Mrs H and eternally – hope good news is headed your way xx

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  37. Robyn P

    My feeling, being on this road myself, is that it’s never OK to tell a women to stop, unless you are her fertility specialist. That is the emotional decision she needs to make by herself with her partner. If she makes that decision based on other peoples feelings, she will never truly be happy with the decision to stop.

    IVF and infertility is an incredibly hard road to be on, and people who are going through this will benefit more from friends who talk to them about it, understand it and ask them questions, rather than those who would say “you know what I think it’s time to stop”. Deep down they probably already know when they need to stop, but they need to be happy with their decision.

    What also needs to be taken into account is that these women may feel a certain level of jealousy towards friends who have conceived relatively easily, so unless you know what she has been through or have been through it yourself, she probably isn’t going to take it well or on board.

    Every IVF attempt I made was worth it. Yes, it hurt when it didn’t work, but in my mind I was giving it my all to get to that dream that I so desperately wanted.

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  38. XOXO

    It’s a tricky one. Part of me would just want to be her cheer team no matter what, the other part of me (the pychologist part) would want to encourage her to have a reality check. When something becomes obsessive and emotionally/physically damaging it’s time to re evaluate.

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  39. Anon for this

    I hope I would be a good enough friend to listen without judgement and help her look at all her options.

    I have been fortunate to have two easy conceptions and pregnancies and have two girls as a result, 5yo and 4yo. Unfortunately, age is not being so kind now and I have had three miscarriages in the last year.

    We will be heading to Thailand in about 6-8 weeks to start IVF treatment there. I don’t live in Australia so would have to travel regardless. We have chosen Thailand because we will be able to access donor eggs more easily if I don’t respond to treatment. Unfortunately the odds are very slim for me, even at 41, of having a child with my own eggs.

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    • jb expat

      Best of luck to you – there are also very well respected fertility clinics in South Africa and the Czech republic (http://ivftraveler.wordpress.com/2012/02/22/why-ivf-in-czech/) that specialize in donor cycles at costs significantly less than, say the US. My own experience with donor eggs was in the US – but in doing my research I came across the info I found re: Czech Republic and South Africa.

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      • Anon for This

        Thanks for the link jb expat. I’ll definitely check it out!

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  40. Desparate4abub

    Question for those who have had a baby after trying for a while or suffered the loss of babies as well, please tell me all this pain, sadness, grey hairs, tears, physical pain, depression and fear…is all worth it? I’m having more bad days than good :( and although I’m only 29 & everyone keeps telling me I have time up my sleeve I’m not surif how much more I can do this!

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    • Mrs H

      Honestly, I can say it is worth it. I have a child but I have also lost 2 pregnancies and been battling infertility for nearly 2 years at the age of 27. The pain will never go away but it does get more manageable and you become a stronger person for it. You have your good days and your bad days.

      I have written a lot about my losses and infertility here http://www.holmemade.com.au

      I wrote a huge post on miscarriage and how it feels. Maybe it will shed some light on your feelings.

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      • Desparate4abub

        Thanks mrsh I will have a look, I’m probably a bit more emotional than normal atm as my miscarriage was only last week. Thanks again :)

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        • Mrs H

          My heart goes out to you. I know that feeling all too well unfortunately. xx

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    • Jenni

      To answer your question Desperate4a bub, it took me 3 years, a stillborn baby at 20 weeks and finally I am now 23 weeks with a perfectly healthy baby. Yes it’s worth it. Somehow as soon as you know you’re pregnant and it’s for keeps, all the time and and heartbreak doesn’t seem as bad as when you’re right in it. I wish you all the best and hope it happens soon.

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    • Luc

      Oh Desperate4abub, I feel for you.

      I had three miscarriages, four years of “trying”, endo, etc. I was lucky I had a great job and a beautiful husband, but it was such a hard time. It was hard watching others fall pregnant too.

      I gave it literally “one last shot” – I couldn’t keep going in that cycle forever. But then it worked, and I kept the pregnancy.

      Though it was a very dark period, it was totally worth every bit of pain. The one thing I learned though was not to make decisions when you have just miscarried. The hormones are crazy, and obviously the grief. Take some time to think about things.

      But in answer to your question, it was absolutely worth it. Hugs.

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    • Michelle

      Desparate4abub-my heart goes out to you, but there is hope. After 4 years of hell, cycle after cycle, severe hyper stimulation which almost killed me, and all the horrible things you listed, I finally, at 29, conceived my daughter. Then conceived again with my last embryo, but miscarried and had to start from scratch again. But now I am 7 weeks along with number 2. My specialist is very highly regarded, and he calls me his most challenging case, if I can get pregnant you will too. I wish you all the luck in the world.

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    • Steph

      It takes it’s toll, but it is definitely worth it. I have lost 2 babies and even down the track it still hurts. I now have a beautiful daughter and thank my lucky stars. Having her doesn’t erase the hurt, but she is my miracle and I feel so blessed to have her.

      So sorry to hear of your loss and struggles x

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    • oopsyboops

      oh hugs to you. I can say, yes it is worth it. Thats not to say you don’t have hard days – IVF babies still cry, still keep you up at night, still smear food all over the carpet, still test your patience.

      Please talk to someone about how you are feeling. Most clinics have counsellors. I saw one at mine and she really helped work through the grief (yes you are grieving on many levels). Hugs again.

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      • Desperate4abub

        Thank you ladies that has given me hope…& so true to not make decisions straight after I have miscarried! Thanks again

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  41. Nicky

    In the first instance the doctors should stop taking money from women who have such appaling odds.
    If this was a company promising weightless with such terrible odds, they would be shut down for unethical practices.

    In the second instance, absolutely friends should speak up. Why should you expect your nearest and dearest to continue to lie to your face and continue to invest in a less than 1 % chance of a fairy tale?

    Having a child is not a god given right, some people can have them no problem and some can’t. That is life and life is not fair.
    Why do you expect everyone around you to invest in your dream that has such a low chance of success?
    Why should the government fund your lifestyle wish?
    When did having a child become a buisness and a right and stop being a natural process.
    Just because the science is there and it works for some, does not give everyone the right to become a parent at any cost.
    If this was anything else we were talking about with such low odds, everyone would say you are wasting your money and you should stop, but because it is an emotional issue people are too afraid to speak the truth.

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    • Anonymous

      Wow – from someone who went through three rounds of ivf (self funded, for your information) & 3 miscarriages before having a beautiful baby girl through ivf, I wonder what your experience of having children has been. What makes you think you can pass judgement on others?
      I hate that I had to use ivf, but it has given me my dream.
      You should think about the fact that no one would ever choose to go down this path unless it was a last resort.

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      • Robyn P

        Well Said!

        And I actually don’t know anyone who has gone through IVF or any fertility treatments which have been funded by the Government.

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        • Ness73

          I did! But I don’t know of anyone else and I have a lot of IVF friends. I think a lot of people have no idea that it can be government funded if you fit certain criteria. I had 3 lots of drugs and 6 transfers before success and we would have been reviewed if it hadn’t worked then. Thankfully it did and we have beautiful 4 year old twin girls as a result.

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    • ReeBee

      Do you think women willingly go through IVF on a whim? Seriously. I am looking down the barrell of this myself and I can promise you that I do so after almost 2 years of unsuccessful baby making. It’s expensive and it can put significant strain on our body and our relationship. And frankly, it scares me and makes me angry to think I should even have to (in fact, it’s partly the reason I’ve put off seeing the fertility specialist for so long).

      Even before my infertility, if you’d asked me, I’d have told you that I’d rather pay for 100 women to go through IVF treatment to get a much loved baby who will be loved and cared for than pay for 100 to sit on a parenting pension who only had kids for the govt funding and/or a lack of care (and most of us know at least one by association)…

      DISCLAIMER: I am only referring to the deadbeat parents on Centrelink out there who neglect/abuse their kids so if you’re not one of these, don’t be offended.

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      • Donsie

        Well said ReeBee, I absolutely agree with every word you have written.

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    • Anonymous

      “Why should the government fund your lifestyle wish?”

      You’re right, of course BUT until the Government stop handing out welfare payments to help couples (some with no infertility troubles), bring children up, then no I’m sorry, yes Medicare should assist.

      Not long ago the Government wanted us to have one for each other and one for the country, for some that’s not easy, so why shouldn’t the Government help out?

      The Government is funding the lifestyle choices of all those who have 1, 2, 3 or more children but yet can’t do it without getting help from the Government, so why should they get assistance and not someone who just wants A child?

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    • Luci

      I agree with what you have said, but I am sure that there will be lots who will misunderstand it and think that you are wide off the mark.
      I underwent IVF years ago. After three attempts I reluctantly decided to stop. I told myself that this is just the way life is….there is no guarantee on anything, and I would not allow myself to feel sorry for myself…and have not done so since. Do I wish that I could have had children? Of course. Do I feel sad about this ? Only slightly. I keep my circumstances in context. What right do I have to feel sorry for myself..I still have my limbs, faculites etc.There are miliions and millions worse off than me. This is the way life works. I have just got on with life and tried to make the best of things.
      I chose to cease IVF because I did not want to become obsessive about it, and let it dominate my life.
      I would not tell someone directly to stop IVF but I would try and let them see that it is not the end of the world to be childless.
      Watching the story on the ABC last night about the participants in the upcoming paralympics is a reminder of how some people are remarkable in the way they face up to true adversity….and is a reminder to place the issue of childlessness in its context…..to see that it is not that significant when all is said and done.
      I have had some wonderful opportunities to be an auntie, and to share in the help with other friend’s children….there are compensations

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    • Michelle

      I’m sure you didn’t mean to sound so heartless. I may be assuming too much here, but as a 6 year IVFer, I would think you have no first hand knowledge of the subject. If that’s the case I’m truly happy for you. I’m also nicely asking that if you would like to stick to the above opinion, come to an IVF support group and say it to our faces after hearing our stories. I guarantee you would not be so harshly judgmental. I struggled in vain with fertility treatments for 4 years with no success, and almost died after one cycle. I should have given up, just not meant to have a baby, right? Except the next cycle worked. And the next one (which I unfortunately miscarried). And the next one (currently 7 weeks along). THAT is why we never want to give up. The next cycle could be the one.
      And can I add that as long as the government is handing out tens of thousands of dollars to an ex junkie to have their teeth fixed, just one example I know of personally, I think the pittance we get back from the thousands we spend trying to have a very wanted and much loved baby is money well spent.

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    • Anon

      Wow.

      I have paid my taxes for twenty plus years. My husband has paid his taxes for thirty. I have never claimed any childcare benefits, social security benefits, unemployment benefits, aged pensions.

      I pay top price for my medical insurance (most IVF clinics require you have private health insurance). When I require hospital treatment, I go private.

      The only thing – the ONLY thing I have ever claimed from the government was in my years of IVF treatment, and can I say, the medicare rebate is not that brilliant (though we are so much better off than other countries).

      I don’t judge you for sending your kids to child care centres that are covered by government rebates. If you are on unemployment benefits, I don’t call for those to be suspended. Frankly, it’s none of my business what you claim.

      And it’s none of your business what I claim either.

      And for the record, most people have their own personal line in the sand. Few patients keep going back over and over and over. The emotional fallout is just too severe. The last thing I would call the IVF journey is a fairytale.

      I find those that speak the loudest on these topics are the ones who know the least.

      REALLY glad you’re not my friend.

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    • MamaMel

      What a troll

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    • AT

      It’s not a lifestyle wish. It’s a fundamental human need.

      And yes it receives solid government rebates – at a time when the government is trying hard to grow the Australian population naturally.

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  42. May!

    I don’t think I would out and out say “I think you need to stop” but if I was worried about my friends mental health and all she is sacrificing for a <1% chance of conceiving I would definitely try to have a chat and get her to reevaluate. If she wanted to continue, that's ok, I'll support her, but I'm not going to blindly sit by and say 'it's not my business' while my friend is going crazy and giving up her whole life for IVF.

    If she tells me to fuck off because I don't know what it's like, (which I feel like a few commenters here might have done), so be it.

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  43. Kris2040

    If it’s not working, and it’s affecting people like above, yeah, I’d say give it away. Or at least have a break. It can’t be good being that obsessed with something that has such a tiny chance of happening.

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  44. Gemack

    It is absolutely none of your business whether your friend keeps trying or not.

    $3000 a cycle might be expensive, but if your friend told you they wanted to buy a $50,000 car do you think it’s your right to tell them that’s a bad financial decision? What about if your opinion is different to her husband’s and causes problems? Anyway, how do you know what’s around the corner? For all you know, the next cycle could be the successful one.

    Better to leave your friendship in tact and just be supportive.

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    • Cait

      I think the issue is that i probably would tell my friend that paying $50,000 for a less than 1% chance at a car is a bad idea.

      I wouldnt tell someone that they should stop IVF, but i think the issue here is this woman has a problem – she is sacrificing absolutely everything to have a miniscule chance at a child. That sacrifice could be damaging regardless of whether the IVF is successful.

      There is no easy answer, and these are the situations that are the most testing for everyone.

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  45. Mrs H

    I am currently going through IVF and am awaiting my results today. Personally, the yearning for a child is not something that can be easily controlled. I do have a naturally conceived 2 year old son, but for me, my family isn’t complete just yet. I believe it is up to the individual to decide when enough is enough. I think as women, deep down you just know when you are not strong enough to move forward. It is an emotional roller coaster ride and the effects it can have on relationships and families vary from person to person. I don’t think an outsider can really make a decision.

    I am documenting my IVF journey here, http://www.holmemade.com.au for any of you IVFers who wish to follow.

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    • Anonymous

      Good luck, keeping EVERYTHING crossed for you!

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    • MrsS

      Wishing you all the best and you get your much deserved good news!! xx

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    • Another Mrs H

      I’m waiting on my news today too! Fingers crossed it’s a good day for Mrs Hs all over Australia! xx

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      • Mrs H

        My fingers are crossed for both of us!! The waiting by the phone is pure torture

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  46. beee

    It really annoys me when people talk about the ticking body clock. However it also really annoys me when women think it’s totally fine to start trying for a baby at 40 then get seem amazed when it doesn’t work. As much as it’s a highly sensitive and debateable topic, I believe that women need to be smart and realistic when it comes to procedures like IVF. Before starting, set out guidelines and back up plans in case things don’t turn out the way you want them to. Once you’ve started it would understandably become obsessive and addictive and hard to make final decisions.

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    • Amanda

      I completely agree with this comment, as difficult as it is to say. There are some things that science can’t override, and womens’ reproductive abilities after 40 fall into this category.

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    • ameliastclair

      Great comment, beebs x

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  47. No way

    I did not even have to read this article to immediately know the very obvious answer to this (however, I did read the article).

    Never never NEVER would I advise a friend to stop trying. I do not believe this even needs an explanation. It is so obvious!

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    • Gemack

      I agree

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    • beee

      I want to agree with you ‘No way’ but what if the cost was sending your friend broke, she was depressed, her relationship was suffering and her life was on a downwards spiral?
      I dont think I can even answer that question myself. Just putting it out there.
      (Usually I am all for keep on trying!)

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      • Gemack

        Even though we may want to, I don’t think we can or should protect our friends from their bad choices. You may not see all the intracacies of why they are they way they are and why they are making those decisions. And anyway, how are we to know our opinion is the right one for their family anyway? If they are that obsessed I doubt your opinion will change their mind, it will probably just turn into a “don’t shoot the messenger” situation and may perhaps mean your friend becomes even more withdrawn and depressed.

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  48. MrsS

    My husband and I (both healthy 28year olds) have just hit the twelve month mark of trying to conceive and are now classified as “unexplained infertility”. We started all the tests a few months ago, yes he has good swimmers, yes I ovulate, no I don’t have pcos or endo. We had our first appointment at the fertility clinic a few weeks ago, more tests and our follow up appointment is this week. The dr had said if still no luck, start ivf in January 2013. So even though im not at that point yet, I know that I could never ever say to a friend, it’s time to stop. I don’t think I or anyone can fully understand what a person in this situation is going through. Infertility is lonely. If someone has shared their journey with you, they really need your support and a shoulder to cry on. I remember reading a study in the UK that stated that patients with infertility have higher stress rates than cancer patients, so if you have a friend going through this, please remember infertility is a bloody hard road and don’t say, “just relax” or “as soon as you stop trying it will happen”. Just give them a big hug and say, “this really bloody sucks!!”

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    • Mrs H

      Could not agree with you more. I started documenting my journey for the reason that it is a very lonely place to be and when friends asked how things were going, I didn’t really want to talk about it all the time, when I am ready, I blog and if they want to be supportive and stay in the loop they know to check my blog.

      I wish you all the luck!

      http://www.holmemade.com.au – if you wish to check it out :)

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    • Desparate4abub

      MrsS my heart goes out to you. We r in same situation but trying for 2 years,starting the ivf appointments via public system due to costs, in a month. I’ve fallen pregnant twice after 18mths trying, but sadly miscarried both. Part of me wishes we started ivf back at 1 year of trying but then i would never have experienced & learned that we could fall pregnant naturally. Just thought it would help to let you know that I totally get what you are going through.

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      • Mrs H

        Desperate4abub – I wish you all the best on your journey. It is an incredible journey and I truly hope you get what you deserve at the end of it all!

        The desperation is overwhelming isn’t it!

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    • XOXO

      Good luck on your fertility journey. Just know that there are other interventions between ‘el natural’ and ivf. My first two were concieved with a combination of hormone injections, normal sex, and insemination (ie hubby’s sperm artifically injected by doctor). Slightly less intervention (and money spent) then ivf. There is such a small window of opportunity each cycle- my husband travelled alot for work then and was often not home during those times.

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    • archiek

      The most refreshing response I had to my infertility was from a close friend who was completely outraged at the unfairness of what I was going through. If I had heard another “relax and it will happen” I would have hurled myself across the table.

      On the positive side, IVF was a success with a much anticipated baby due any day now.

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    • ReeBee

      MrsS we have a very similar story, except I’ve left it almost 2 years. We’re now waiting until our wedding in October before seeing the fertility specialist, although like you his swimmers are excellent and I’m ovulating etc.

      Good luck with your journey. It’s a journey that is hard to appreciate unless you’ve been there or staring down the barrell of that journey.

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    • Kat

      I hate being told “don’t think about it and it will happen” or “it’ll happen when it’s supposed to”. Really, go jump off a clliff. Telling me that doesn’t solve my problem of not falling pregnant and I’ve been trying naturally for 8 years. Now that I’m 27 and it’s still not happening, I think it’s time to get help. Some people just don’t get it! :(

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  49. Ivf mum

    After 5 ivf cycles, loss of twins in the 2nd half of my pregnancy & approx 16 weeks of hospitalization for myself & our prem baby, our costs have well exceeded $100,000 (luckily a lot has been covered by our health fund). Looking now at our 5 month old son happily playing it has never & would never cross my my mind if he is ‘worth’ the money associated with his birth. I would never tell someone to stop ivf procedures, having fertility problems is a very private matter & is only the business of the couple involved. The only thing coming from friends & family should be love & support for the crazy journey that is infertility. Thinking of everyone currently going through a cycle xx

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  50. Lily.

    Who would even THINK about telling a friend to stop? What kind of business is it of theirs to tell a friend when she’s had enough. I don’t put limits on my friendships, I don’t say “I’ll give you ten goes to get it right and then you’re on your own”, and I think if you can just stop being supportive of something like this, which largely doesn’t have anything much to do with you, you probably aren’t a very good friend. You wouldn’t say it to someone with cancer going through round after round of chemo, you wouldn’t tell them to just stop trying to live.

    I’ve got my friends backs. 100%, unwavering, doesn’t matter what it takes to make them happy I’ll support it. I could never. I would never tell them to stop chasing something that they want, even if it’s hard.

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