Look at this image. And tell us what the first thing is that comes to your mind:
This is a promotional image for The Matt and Jo Show – a morning radio program on FoxFM in Melbourne that is hosted by Matt Tilley and Jo Stanley (both pictured). The pair have hosted the show together for the past 10 years and have a huge supporter base throughout the city.
And according to comedian and social commentator Catherine Deveny, the image is in seriously poor taste. When Catherine saw the image last night, she tweeted her concern about it. Here’s what she had to say:
By showing a full length shot of Jo, in a short and tight dress but focusing on a close up head shot of Matt, Catherine was clearly concerned that the image sent a sexist message. She asked:
In response to Catherine’s comments, Matt and Jo spoke on air about the industry they work in – one that is notorious for having a misogynistic culture that promote men into decision making roles and treats women poorly.
We thought their conversation was worth sharing. Here’s what Matt and Jo said:
Matt Tilley: You’re out of line, lady. And I will say this. If everything about commercial radio is so yuck, then how come some years ago, Catherine Deveny, you kept faxing me scripts, desperate to get on this show?
Jo Stanley: I actually find it kind of funny, I’ve been in radio so long that I’m used to certain people assuming that it is a very sexist industry – and for many women it has been that case, but for myself, I have only ever had incredible support on this show and here at Fox FM, and so I’ve just said ‘look you know what, I don’t define myself by a photo, I define myself by what I say’…
Matt Tilley: But I always think, if you’re going to get on radio and have a shot at people and take the mickey and have fun, then you can’t get prissy when people do it to you, and so I’ve always tried to live by that mantra. But this is something that does irk me, and that is the fact that she says ‘this sums up everything that’s wrong with commercial radio, it’s about his head’ as in big head, as in ego, and ‘it’s about her body’ as in, she’s just a bimbo.
Now, I would say this to Catherine Deveny, yes, I’m on radio, yes, I’m in the public domain, yes, I have plenty to say. But I don’t have a big head, and I don’t have a big ego….I don’t go to openings, you don’t see me in the celebrity pages, I’m just a dad, with kids, who coaches their teams.
You know what? You’ve missed the mark because you probably don’t listen. And do you know what? This show is so dedicated towards equality and women, we’re largely based around women listening to our show, the music that we play…and it just really got my goat that this bland, snide assumption that commercial radio is for idiots and morons is insulting. Not only to us, but the people who listen…it’s snobbery of the worst kind, and it makes me sick, and I think it’s gutless to just put those remarks on Twitter about a photo that’s from years ago…
Matt: I’m not misogynist, I’m not demeaning of women – cheeky at best. And you Jo…making you out as a bimbo, and someone who’s vacuous, makes me sick to the bone, gutless Catherine Deveny. You (Jo) are the epitome of the modern woman – you work, you have a beautiful family, you’re passionate about our listeners, you are forthright and funny and feminist.
You’re being snobby about millions of people who live in this town who have made the choice to have a bit of fun, and put a bit back. And we do the odd good thing. We have raised a few million dollars for sick and unfortunate people…
The dispute over this photo is an interesting one because clearly two very high profile women – namely Catherine and Jo – perceive it quite differently.
Jo is proud of the shot, which admittedly is a pretty standard promotional radio photo, and also defends her industry as one which has promoted and protected her.
Catherine, on the other hand, is worried the shot is reflective of a broader negative culture in commercial radio.
One image. Two very different opinions. We’re keen to know what yours is.
It’s also worth noting that the image is now about 18 months old and no longer even used to promote the radio show, which is part of the confusion over Catherine tweeting about it – the show now use the below promo shot:
The new promo image
Do you listen to Matt and Jo or other commercial radio? Do you think that the image is sexist or is this an overreaction from Catherine Deveny?
Comments
172 Comments so far
Severe overreaction. Whoever this Catherine lady is needs to get a life. More important things to worry about in this world.
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Wow, Jo Stanley!
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Why dies anyone take Catherine Deveney seriously? She tweeted the other day “flossing is for faggots”. Attention seeker of the highest order. Boring and irrelevant.
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I’d have been on the fence until I read the bogan comment first up -
“You’re out of line, lady”
Seriously Matt Tilley F-Off and don’t use “Lady” as a passive aggressive term when you damn well KNOW the name of the person you are addressing. Jerk.
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Two high profile women?
I haven’t heard of either of them, perhaps their profiles are a bit shorter than they would like them to be.
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My first impression of the ad was that SHE had all the power. She’s dressed far more glamorously in a bright colour, will he looks like an Average Joe.
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Interesting that Catherine defended a woman’s image and equality in the media yet the previous day she posted an overweight woman’s picture on her Facebook for the point of getting a laugh.
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Did she? After the whole, “I’m overweight but I love my body, and who would want to be skinny?” article last year? What a hypocrite.
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Oh she’s a comic genius … not.
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I’ve just had a look over at FB and the only image I can see is the cute ILLUSTRATION of a girl with a rather large derrière on a push bike…promoting Catherine’s stand up show ‘curvy crumpet’…which obviously refers to herself. Correct me if I’m wrong? Really if this is the pic you are referring to you’re quite out of line..if not I’d love to know the context of the image you mean so people can have the whole picture (so to speak) before they have a go…
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Hi Mandy that wasn’t the picture I was referring to. I could not upload a screen shot because I was using my phone.
The picture was of an obese woman in small shorts ordering fast food, amd received some derogatory comments.
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Oh, ok fair point. And I was looking at a different FB profile, the official one, too.
Had a little squiz at Catherine’s personal page and still couldn’t find the picture. I really need to see it for the context. I.e. Did she actually post the pic along the lines of look at this fat lady, aint it gross and funny? Or was she perhaps commenting on someone else’s comment?
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Jo is not judged on her looks but for what she has to say she works in radio for god sake. A lot of people that listen to their show would not know or care what she looks like
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Catherine Deveny is the epitome of why I refuse to call myself a feminist. Complaining about an 18mth old picture when the most recent one remedies exactly what has caused her so much heartbreak while in the same week using a highly derogatory term against homosexuals. But it’s all good in her world because that term only insults men. Sadly there are some out there who still don’t understand how much damage people like Catherine do to the very cause they’re so passionate about and they egg her on while the rest of us exit the room quickly because we refuse to be grouped with women like this. Hopefully 18mths from now she’ll find a more worthy cause to try to make herself relevant. Maybe a bit of outrage against homophobes would be a good place to start, eh Cath? Such a joke.
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Great comment, beans, couldn’t agree more.
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You make good sense, as always, beans.
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Catherine Deveny isn’t my favourite person, but she has a point about this weird photo. What’s odd is the unequal representation of the photo. Firstly, it makes Jo look like an after thought until you notice her figure-hugging dress. If sexy is what they were trying to portray, why isn’t Matt posing full body with a tight shirt on? Also, is it just my eyes or does her head look bigger than what it should be?
The newer promotional image is much more appropriate.
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I agree with Catherine, the image is sexist and is a larger conversation about how women are portrayed in the media. Jo is simply defending her job at the Radio station and Matt is taking it personally, overreacting. I find it hard to listed to Matts rant especially since he is a guy and has probably never been on the receiving end of sexism. So to be a modern woman ‘Feminist’ is about working, having a family and being passionate??? I thought its about the values you have how you treat others and creating a positive role model for other women to follow…
I dont listen to Fox mainly because I don’t like there music and its one of those radio stations which seem to connect with the cliche stereo typical cultural audience which I feel as is outdated.
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Completely agree with you.
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Isn’t it likely that this poster was created by a marketing team whose job it is to get people to listen to the radio? And we all know that marketing teams work off the theory that sex sells. Matt and Jo probably had nothing to do with it except for posing for the photo.
I think the positioning looks awkward but I don’t consider it sexist. Perhaps those photos are the best they got of each of them. I also seem to recall Hamish and Andy being posed similarly either on tv or in the print ads? Jo looks fabulous and if I had a body like that I would wear dresses like that. This is a promotional item, she’s not going to be in her trackies!
I thought their reaction was a bit odd but if he’s live on air then perhaps he didn’t really think before he spoke. I don’t listen to the show so I can’t comment too much on that.
I think this is a storm in a teacup especially considering the ad is 18 months old. The new ad is much better, it looks relaxed and fun and they look like a team.
At the end of the day, if someone wants to be offended by something, they’ll find a way.
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Catherine uses ‘slut’ as a term of endearment … excuse me while I don’t laugh.
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Yes. She’s a real class act !
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Catherine can be abrasive, but I like the idea of taking back the word slut. And the c-word. Men (and other women) have used both as insults forever. What is a slut? If it means a sexually active woman, then why is it still offensive? We live in the 21st Century where women have the right to behave sexually as they see fit just like men, not the 19th.
I also agree with her about that shot. It speaks volumes about the perceived attributes of both Joh and Matt.
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Who is Joh?
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Well knock yourself out, PF. I won’t be joining you in your campaign to drag yourself and the next generation of young women into the bowels of locker room machoism just to prove you can mix it with the boys.
No wonder girls are videoing themselves punching and brawling, bashing old people and generally indulging in the typical ‘male’ behaviour we have been trying to stop for years.
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Demonstrating an acute case of Relevance Deprivation Syndrome Catherine. Again.
And someone has given you air-time. Again.
Please rise above Mamamia. Please.
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Just out of interest I Wiki’d Catherine Deveny, which lists some of her tweets. Wow. Why on earth would anyone give this woman the time of day? She’s nasty and adds nothing to the conversation. I really can’t see what this woman offers to society, why she would have a column or why anyone would read her books. She calls herself a ‘professional pain in the arse’- there is a place for civil disobedience and thought provoking commentary. Catherine Deveny does not appear to possess that skill.
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I agree with you – Catherine has bad form. But that doesn’t mean she’s wrong on this particular occasion. I think for once, she’s spot on.
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Oh no, while Devney has been busy with confected outrage and insulting ‘faggots,’ her one and only ‘joke’ has been stolen! Tracey Spicer has decided to get the charming word ‘c***’ accepted in normal conversation. Catherine, I thought you would have copyrighted it.
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I think Catherine Devaney has achieved her objective – she is in the public psyche again. We’re all talking to her and her ridiculous comments. To quote Oscar Wilde – the only thing worse than being talked about, is not being talked about. She throws out the line and we all bite.
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Do people go around looking for things to be pissed off about? To be offended about? It’s a bloody photo with a man at the front and a woman at the back, both are smiling, both look happy, it’s promoting their show. Hey maybe they’re just happy about being employed in a job they love? Who knows.
Regardless, if Jo didn’t have a problem with the image, then no one else really matters.
Catherine, do you just go looking for things that you can be pissed off about to be a talking point?
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I’m sorry but I think you are very wrong on a number of points.
First your evaluation of the the composition of the photo is an incredible over-simplification. To place on figure in the foreground and make him the salient feature is to highlight his importance. To focus on his head and face tells us to engage or connect with him. It says that he, as a person, is worth paying attention to. To place the female in the background, so they figure as much smaller and less significant, to dress her in the way that she is and have her stand in that ridiculous leaning-foward position so she looks like she’ll topple over…honestly! It’s not rocket science. It really shouldn’t have to be spelled out for you, especially if you’re a woman.
Perhaps Jo, as she claims, has no problem with this image. That does not mean it isn’t problematic. I frankly don’t care if she loves it. Perhaps she has it hanging pride of place in her home as an indication of her great achievements as a female in a male-dominated industry. But it offends me that young girls, waiting for a bus, are fed a diet of this sort of message — listen to the clever funny men, admire the hot woman. When is Australia going to grow up!!!!
And lastly, as much as I agree that Catherine has missed the mark in the past, I for one am glad that people like her do go looking for things to be pissed off about. We need people to get us thinking and talking about these issues, as some of the comments here make so blindingly obvious!!!
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Absolutely agree with your excellent response. All is too easy and acceptable. The 95 percenters in life just accept and standards and expectations get lower and lower. Tv and media are a fabulous testament to that. I find it weird that some females actually go along being the ‘hot one’. Hard to really know the true person when it’s all wrapped up (or unwrapped) purely to look hot or sexy. They allow themselves to be manipulated by what men apparently want and what women apparently are meant to strive to be…so they undermine their own true value and worth as a person.
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@CatherineDeveny: I just told my dentist “flossing is for faggots
Yeah, I don’t really care what this stupid woman thinks.
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I agree with matt and Jo.
Some people have to create drama where there is none just because they’ve nothing better to do.
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This image is from 18 months ago. Catherine, move on! Funny how you comment on Jo’s appearance but take a look at how you promote yourself! Sexy low tops, tight figure hugging oitfits, swimsuits…give me a break!
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Yes it is definitely a sexist shot, but most people probably wouldn’t notice since it is so typical, not just of radio, but of a lot of media.
I didn’t take the comments as he has a big head and she is a bimbo, just that it is typically sexist the way the focus on women (and not so much on men) is on their body and their clothes.
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Has anyone even considered that maybe Matt didn’t want his whole body shown and Jo was happy too. If the people in the shot have no problem then why should anyone else. Don’t see the big drama people are just too sensitive these days and need to get a life there are more important things in life than to worry about how people are positioned in a photo! If you don’t like the show or Matt and Jo or fox for that matter then don’t listen and don’t waste other peoples time with your jealous garbage Catherine Deveny. I think she’s just jealous she doesn’t have Jo’s job and doesn’t look as good as Jo!!
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Yeah that’s right – she’s just jealous. Cause women can’t be critical of other women without it being about jealousy!
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Couldn’t care less what Catherine Deveny thinks.
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All I think when I see this photo is that I wish I looked as good in a dress.
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Gloria Steinem was on The View yesterday and said that in terms of gender equality, we are only half-way there. Totally right and this picture is another example of what we should be speaking out against. It’s totally sexist and completely unnecessary. For those who don’t think it’s not a big deal, this just proves how used to these images we are. Doesn’t make it right. Jo looks ridiculous in a sexy red dress next to Matt’s big head. Hardly ‘empowering’.
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Catherine Deveny … seriously? I find wishing someone ‘arse cancer’ and that an eleven year old girl gets ‘laid’ about a billion times more offensive than this ad.
Frankly, I have no idea why you would give this woman the time of day, let alone give her a voice anymore.
Oh, and Catherine, my dear, even ‘faggots’ floss.
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I listened to Matt & Jo on rare occasions. He’s a know-it-all and his prank calls are enough to make me sick. And on the rare occasions I have heard them (for mere minutes at a time), Jo always makes a comment about her thin body (despite apparently eating like a horse) and other comments about her appearance.
Like most people on that radio network, they are waaayyy to concerned with celebrities and looks and what-not.
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Would men have found this sexist if it was a picture of Jo’s face and Matt’s body?
This is a genuine question!
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Not this one.
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BECAUSE SEXISM IS INSTITUATIONALISED OPRESSION SO THEREFORE MEN CAN’T BE VICTIMS OF SEXISM.
I feel like that’s obvious.
God people like you made me mad. Absolutely no understanding of society.
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That’s exactly right, do and say anything to a male to make him realise how pathetic his gender is, all fine, no word for it, doesn’t exist.
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I think personal attacks or such broad comments about my ‘understanding of society’ are totally unnessary. You are welcome to have a different opinion than me Rubie Dickson, and you are welcome to tell me your different opinion, however under no circumstances are you able to make any comments like that about me. I was simply asking my question, as I would at a dinner party, as per the rules of the mamamia site. Would you speak to me like that at a dinner party? I surely hope not.
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What a load of crap.
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Yes I think so
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A genuine question with an obvious answer. NO.
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Well let’s reverse it. Let’s put Matt at the back in just tight bike shorts and Jo at the front without her body showing. If we did that in every media photo where a woman and man are photographed together, men might get what we’re talking about. Matt Tilley you were so off the mark with your rant…who are you to say whether something is sexist?? Catherine was right and didn’t imply all the other crap that you overdramatised this issue with.
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Should I then ask who is Catherine Deveny to say that some is sexist ?
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You think what Jo is wearing is analogous with a bloke wearing no top and bike shorts? Seriously? Come now, Jo is simply smartly dressed, and so what if in the process some think she is hot. Sheesh.
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He just didn’t get Deveney’s point, did he! She wasn’t having a go at him, she wasn’t calling him big-headed. She was making the point (it seems to me) that men are judged based on what they have to say – so you need only show his head – whereas women are still judged on their appearance (even if what they have to say is equally funny/insightful/interesting). If women are considered ‘attractive’ you show their full body and if they’re not considered ‘attractive’ you actively don’t show their body. If they’re commercial media personalities who aren’t considered ‘attractive’, it seems to me they’ve got to be funny.
Other than Chrissy Swan (funny), the only other unconventional-looking female commercial media personality I can think of is, um… Michelle Grattan. Then again, I’m not exactly up on commercial TV or radio personalities and calling Grattan a ‘media personality’ is a bit of a stretch (though she is the celebrity guest on Breakfast with Fran Kelly).
I’m just waffling now, but it is possible to just avoid commercial TV and radio altogether and enjoy the ABC and SBS instead. Then the whole commercial world just seems kind of irrelevant after a while – you barely notice bus shelter ads for radio programs, or conversations about cooking/renovation show. You stop getting angry about the latest insensitive comment made by Kochie or that Karl guy. It’s a much more zen place to live, in a world without commercial media, I highly recommend it.
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I am so with you!!
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Here, here!
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I mean hear, hear!
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I’m with Catherine. If it’s an old shot, says a lot about how outdated it is, the new shot is much better, more equal. Matt’s defensive response is telling; the man ‘doth protest too much methinks’….If he can’t see the sexism in the first photo he’s either blind or in denial! Especially when compared to the new one!
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Why, if they’re meant to be a team, is he huger than life at the front left of the page, and she’s almost an afterthought at the back right? As someone else said, ‘position, position …’
Would love to hear the Gruen Transfer team take this one apart!
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SO over everything being labelled ‘sexist’ !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Who gives a toss what Catherine Deveny thinks?
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Catherine Deveny, I’d imagine.
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Bradley! You comment on almost every article I comment on and I think you are very funny! (Also clever and insightful when required) Keep it up!
I laughed out loud at this one!
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I agree that the image is sexist. They defended themselves but failed to address the point that this is a weird photo – they didn’t explain why she is portrayed as sexy and in the background????
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Why is it sexist for women to be portrayed as sexy when, let’s face it, all women, at some point in time, has tried to see their sex appeal to get what they want? Yet if anyone (read: man) calls out our bluff they are labelled as sexist.
If Jo wants to be sexy then good on her! She is, and raging feminism is not.
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Define ‘raging feminism’ for me will you?
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Oh Emma clearly your definition of feminism is different to mine. Feminism is not designed to be sexy. It’s not ‘raging’, either. It’s designed to liberate and offer choices to women.
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All women? Really?
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Matt is covered by the logo and his legs are chopped off. How obviously misandrist.
All can play this silly game. Next…
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I wish Catherine would just shut down her twitter account and move to the country. All she seems to do is pick on people and start trouble. I think feminism is women supporting women and letting everyone be whoever they want to be. Something Catherine Deveny appears to have trouble doing.
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Now that IS a bit harsh ! The country folk have gone through much hell as of late. Don’t wish any more on to the poor buggers, for goodness sake.
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‘and move to the country.’ Interesting comment there Bec can you ellaborate on that one a bit?
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I like his response…honest and articulate
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Sorry nothing articulate about his response- childish, egocentric and totally
Defensive. He’s defending against things she never said! The image is sexist without a doubt. It’s a shame they can’t have a more intelligent debate about it- but that’s not their market really is it.
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Well said Lush … I cringed when I read his response …. felt very school yard….
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I would be more concerned about the heavy photoshopping. If you saw them both in real life you would know what I mean.
I stopped listening years ago as I got sick of Matt talking over Jo and her just laughing at him. Same goes for Hughesy talking over Kate on Nova. It bloody shits me. What is it with the men talking over the women like what they have to say is more important? And more than that, why do Jo and Kate put up with it?
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Kyle over Jackie o, too – that’s radio!
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When I read Matt’s first line I thought what an immature little man. I’d love to know Catherine Deveny’s response to her ‘desperation’ to be on the Matt and Tilley Show…really? Really? Just does not ring true at all.
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Gawd, Meant *Matt and Jo show*…you can tell I’m not a listener!
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Catherine Deveny is worried about keeping her name in the media and nothing more. Mission accomplished, once again. I wish everyone would stop paying attention to her.
Perhaps Matt’s response seems a bit over-the-top because he is similarly sick of Catherine Deveny and her hysteria. Honestly, sometimes I’m on the same “side” as her but she usually phrases her arguments in such a confrontational and aggressive manner that she makes me want to switch.
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Fox plays fun, poppy music. I think with the disco light background they’re kind of trying to make it look like a fun party. Matt looks like a basic jeans and t-shirt kind of guy, he’d look stupid posing like Jo so they’ve kept him simple. Jo looks great in a glam party dress so she’s bringing the fun to the ad.
Also is this really a new ad? I’m sure I’ve been seeing this ad (and a matching TV ad) for years and years. I remember the TV ad also had Hamish and Andy in similar poses (one in front talking while the other was in the back laughing) and maybe a few other Fox personalities. I can totally picture Jo doing that pose in the TV ad. Maybe Fox is just using the same lit up background and styling, but it’s certainly no big change from the usual promotion.
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Funny, because I thought the impetus behind the photo is that Jo is not only attractive, but she has a stunning body, whereas Matt has a cute face, but isn’t exactly Magic Mike in the abs department.
Simple.
No, it couldn’t be. It must be sexist.
Funny though, if it had been her face all blown up and his full body in the background, Deveny could have been complaining that they only showed half a female, signifying women as only half human.
Or it would possibly be construed as objectifying her face because looks are too important.
Meh!
If you put the right glasses on, you’ll find exactly what you’re looking for and Deveny has milk bottle lenses right now.
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My first thought was that she was away on the day of the photograph and they had to photoshop her in. The poster looks awkward, and Jo looks like she really needs to go to the toilet. It really looks like a project my daughter would have rushed to complete the night before it was due.
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All this poster says to me (I’m not a listener) is that the radio show is hosted by a man. What’s wrong with equally proportioned headshots (or bodies) like any of these co-presenters?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio1/programmes/a-z
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You do realise don’t you Catherine that Fox’s audience is heavily female skewed, so why be deliberately sexist?
Given the target market is female, what is it about what Jo is wearing that is so offensive compared to every second page of every women’s magazine. News flash, women like smart fashion, and I think she looks fab, not at all sexually suggestive.
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Perhaps because the audience is predominantly female, the producers were hoping to attract more male listeners.
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what i actually noticed is the serious photo shop done on both of those shots -that says more to weaken Matt’s argument than his diatribe – he looks completely different in real life & either he’s had work done or Ive been out of Melbourne too long. And yes, sometimes the utter tripe that comes out of commercial radio (Nurse prank anyone?) does make me wonder about who actually listens? And why?
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She wasnt attacking the guy or the girl – i am from Brisbane so i have absolutely no idea who they even are – but when i read her tweet and then looked at the picture i definately saw what her point was. The hosts shouldn’t of been so harsh attacking her, that was just childish. She was merely pointing out an advertising tactic that is like it or not very sexist.
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I think Matt is out of line in his defence. The criticism is of the photo, not of his personal ‘goodness’ or contribution to society. If thats his defence, I tend to believe even more he’s sexist (no- I don’t listen to the show – it’s not broadcast in rural areas). Yes, she might have a good body – how is that relevant in any way to a radio show? Is she employed because she has a good body? Should we listen because she has a good body? Stupid ad – the PR people screwed up big time.
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Manufactured outrage.
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Succinctly accurate.
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